Thursday, July 15, 2010

rec.bicycles.racing - 25 new messages in 10 topics - digest

Buzz It
rec.bicycles.racing
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing?hl=en

rec.bicycles.racing@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* What is wrong with you guys?!?! - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/56c8f6f4a4d5bb2d?hl=en
* Poll: Killfiling Laffatme - 6 messages, 5 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/037fd1325ce45778?hl=en
* Wat's with the Yellow Jersey fetching water? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/cf28e5b052ca87a8?hl=en
* I Don't Care What You Say... - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/84744dc3b7429d09?hl=en
* Lance needs a "fix" - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/cf05e05354daa51f?hl=en
* More kudus to Julian Dean - 4 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1978cca078261cf0?hl=en
* Tour Cyclist's Greatest Challenge - To Go Slower - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/7ff039fef194a0d7?hl=en
* Lance's Lawyers Tries to Blow Smoke - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/960bcba70039d083?hl=en
* why stupid people have difficulty when faced with the truth - 4 messages, 3
authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/35435ff2c401a205?hl=en
* Lafferty was totally fucking wrong about Lance getting arrested in France! -
1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/b76f57f21176d546?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What is wrong with you guys?!?!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/56c8f6f4a4d5bb2d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:05 pm
From: Stuknot


On Jul 14, 5:10 pm, Jimmy July <ha...@happy.joy.joy> wrote:
> Are you guys all INSANE!?!?! After all Lance Armstrong has done for the
> sport of cycling and millions of cancer survivors, how can you stand to
> see your own faces in the mirror?
>
> Every one of you is caught up in unproven gossip and innuendo, all
> designed to pull the man down to your level. None of you have ever
> accomplished a damned thing and you're just jealous of someone who has!

Dear Mr. July,

You're gonna need a bigger boat.


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:58 pm
From: Anton Berlin


On Jul 15, 3:05 pm, Stuknot <Jhan...@whwlawcorp.com> wrote:
> On Jul 14, 5:10 pm, Jimmy July <ha...@happy.joy.joy> wrote:
>
> > Are you guys all INSANE!?!?! After all Lance Armstrong has done for the
> > sport of cycling and millions of cancer survivors, how can you stand to
> > see your own faces in the mirror?
>
> > Every one of you is caught up in unproven gossip and innuendo, all
> > designed to pull the man down to your level. None of you have ever
> > accomplished a damned thing and you're just jealous of someone who has!
>
> Dear Mr. July,
>
> You're gonna need a bigger boat.

LOL - great quote


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 3:22 pm
From: Jimmy July


On 07/15/2010 09:03 AM, Anton Berlin wrote:
> On Jul 14, 7:10 pm, Jimmy July<ha...@happy.joy.joy> wrote:
>> Are you guys all INSANE!?!?! After all Lance Armstrong has done for the
>> sport of cycling and millions of cancer survivors, how can you stand to
>> see your own faces in the mirror?
>>
>> Every one of you is caught up in unproven gossip and innuendo, all
>> designed to pull the man down to your level. None of you have ever
>> accomplished a damned thing and you're just jealous of someone who has!
>
> Silly cunt, as soon as you stop gargling Lance's ball sack come back
> and post something less hero-worshippy and frankly less down right gay
> for a grown man to put into a public space.

Sounds like someone's repressing something, and not too well, either!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Poll: Killfiling Laffatme
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/037fd1325ce45778?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:07 pm
From: Frederick the Great


In article <quudnQbHluxU0aLRnZ2dnUVZ_rednZ2d@sti.net>,
"GoneBeforeMyTime" <Fans@EuroForums.com> wrote:

> Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
> > "B. Lafferty" <bl@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> > news:cLWdnReND8ee_6PRnZ2dnUVZ_umdnZ2d@giganews.com...
> >
> >> "What‚s clear is that Lance Armstrong commands a devotion from his
> >> fans that is unmatched by any other sports star in memory.
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> >
> >
> > Dumbass -
> >
> > I'm not a fan of LANCE, but I (and many others here) find your
> > obsessiveness with him to be very annoying.
> >
> > The reason is that your reasons for posting all your stuff has a very
> > negative undertone. It's driven by negative energy and negative
> > emotion. If he's gonna go down, fine, but it doesn't give me any
> > pleasure any more than it gives me pleasure to see any other rider go
> > down for cheating. I don't revel in another person's misfortune. It's
> > bad karma.
> >
> > thanks,
> >
> > Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.
>
> I don't think lawyers are into Karma much.

Their opinion on the matter does not change Newton's third law.
Actions have consequences on the actor; immediate consequences.

--
Old Fritz


== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:41 pm
From: "A. Dumas"


Betty wrote:
> GoneBeforeMyTime wrote:
>> I don't like the foul language used against Lance, its quite unnecessary
>
> <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDpqupB5_cw>
>
> (The Dumas/Walker/Breuking/k rbr mp3 ref has been disappeared)

New ISP, sorry.
http://members.ziggo.nl/ted/etc/gcuotwf.mp3


== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:08 pm
From: "A. Dumas"


Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
> Spreading negativity is bad karma.

Damn hippie.


== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:12 pm
From: "GoneBeforeMyTime"


Fredmaster of Brainerd wrote:
> On Jul 15, 8:00 pm, "GoneBeforeMyTime" <F...@EuroForums.com> wrote:
>> Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
>>> "B. Lafferty" <b...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> news:cLWdnReND8ee_6PRnZ2dnUVZ_umdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>
>>>> "What's clear is that Lance Armstrong commands a devotion from his
>>>> fans that is unmatched by any other sports star in memory.
>>
>>> <snip>
>>
>>> Dumbass -
>>
>>> I'm not a fan of LANCE, but I (and many others here) find your
>>> obsessiveness with him to be very annoying.
>>
>>> The reason is that your reasons for posting all your stuff has a
>>> very negative undertone. It's driven by negative energy and negative
>>> emotion. If he's gonna go down, fine, but it doesn't give me any
>>> pleasure any more than it gives me pleasure to see any other rider
>>> go down for cheating. I don't revel in another person's misfortune.
>>> It's bad karma.
>>
>>> thanks,
>>
>>> Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.
>>
>> I don't think lawyers are into Karma much. It's their job to roots
>> out facts and details as experts in their field, as where most of us
>> don't even have a clue. It's just a forum, and as long as he's
>> civil, which he usually is, I like the access to those links,
>> stories and facts. Besides there is ample counterweight around here,
>> not like Laff running the show.
>
> Dumbass,
>
> A lawyer's job is to win cases, not to root out facts.
> Rooting out facts happens in the service of winning
> cases, when it is in the service, and not when it isn't.
>
> This is one reason Lafferty is not a reliable source of
> information about LANCE - he's an advocate. There's
> nothing wrong with being an advocate as long as you're
> honest with yourself about it. That's part of the issue -
> if you think you're a objective investigator but you're
> really an advocate.
>
> The other part of the issue is that Laff is blinded by
> his obsession with LANCE, so that he doesn't see
> entire categories:
> Things That Are Worse Than Lance, Things That
> Lance Is Not Responsible For, Things That Won't
> Go Away Even After Lance Is Abolished, and so on.
>
> Fredadvocate Ben

But it's seems like a fairly harmless hobby obsession, no different then
Laff going on TV to offer legal commentary on something like Larry King
during the OJ fiasco. Legal commentators are all over TV in all kinds of
issues and famous cases. Why would Laff be so different then some of those
folks? Some of those guys or women seem to have similar obsessions with
famous cases. Laff isn't going after Lance directly working with
investigators. He's just serving up the daily bread on rbr.

Maybe he's going to write a book someday, who knows!

Advocate or investigator, if he left, it wouldn't be long before you guys
would be calling him back to fill your plates!


== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:56 pm
From: RicodJour


On Jul 15, 1:48 pm, Anton Berlin <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I'd like to ride my bike like I did in the 80s and
> early 90s and not worry about getting crumpled under an SUV whose
> driver is tweeting about how some other jackass on a cell phone just
> cut him off.

That probably has more to do with you being a master
fathead...errr...fatty, sorry, and the inevitable realization with age
- you are not longer invulnerable.

The other possibility is that there are too many cars. Either move,
or give up yours to set a good example.

No need to thank me.

R


== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 3:21 pm
From: Jimmy July


On 07/15/2010 10:48 AM, Anton Berlin wrote:
> On Jul 15, 11:47 am, Amit Ghosh<amit.gh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 14, 10:59 pm, "GoneBeforeMyTime"<F...@EuroForums.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Laff provides insight without all the boorish overtones, and that's ok with
>>> me. I don't like the foul language used against Lance, its quite unnecessary
>>> but this stuff is going to go forward and people are going to be talking
>>> about it, so I would rather have a civil toned lawyer providing insight
>>> instead of a bunch of Boorish thugs. Like the other guy said for crying out
>>> loud, we are just reading text comments.
>>
>> dumbass,
>>
>> henry is right, lafferty is too emotional to be objective - any
>> analysis from him is nonsense.
>
> If anyone is 'emo' about LA it would be my false identity Anton.

So you've finally come out of the closet.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Wat's with the Yellow Jersey fetching water?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/cf28e5b052ca87a8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:20 pm
From: Uncle Dave


On Jul 15, 8:08 pm, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> In article
> <ffed06ac-bec6-4a65-b4ae-da938fe67...@z10g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>,
>  Uncle Dave <davidco...@t-online.de> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jul 14, 9:44 pm, Frederick the Great <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> > > In article
> > > <bc60c427-b0b4-40f2-b500-c5c427343...@g19g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,
>
> > >  Dumbass <tadams...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > On Jul 14, 9:56 am, RicodJour <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
> > > > > On Jul 14, 9:25 am, Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > I've noticed this twice so far
>
> > > > > I think that Andy isn't under any pressure at the moment, and in a
> > > > > magnanimous display of team solidarity and gratitude, he's making a
> > > > > symbolic gesture to his teammates.  The peloton won't attack if he's
> > > > > back for water and his boys will bury themselves all that much more
> > > > > for him when the need arises.
>
> > > > > I know - it's so rare to see good sportsmanship being displayed from
> > > > > the top down that it's almost unrecognizable.
>
> > > > Why would the Peleton not attack?
>
> > > How can it? It does not exist.
> > > What is with the capitalization?
> > > Are we writing German,
> > > and I did not get the memorandum?
>
> > I think that should be "i the Memorandum did not getting"...
>
> Mein Auge Pickelhaube ist. Nein?

I don't weiss nicht.

UD

==============================================================================
TOPIC: I Don't Care What You Say...
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/84744dc3b7429d09?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:29 pm
From: Frederick the Great


In article
<b6322fe9-a68f-4d48-966f-26ce7f8b48bc@d37g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>,
Uncle Dave <davidcovey@t-online.de> wrote:

> HTC versus Garmin is Men against Boys. Not only did Renshaw deliver
> his man, he managed to do a good job of - legally as far as I could
> tell - making sure Farrar couldn't get through. WTF was Farra doing
> trying to go through the inside FFS? I know you yanks are nothing if
> not partisan at suporting your boys, but Garmin really don't have a
> clue at all in these sprints, leastwise not those that I've seen...

You deliberately ignore George Hincapie
when he was on Columbia last year.
Remember the chop block on Avenue des Champs-Élysées?

--
Old Fritz

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Lance needs a "fix"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/cf05e05354daa51f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:47 pm
From: "i,fred"

"FrankdP" <...@000.com> wrote:
>
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7RaOQH8UTE

Thanks for posting - Lance "I want blood thicker than a
quart of Prestone 10w30 that's been in the freezer for a
week" lmao

i,fred

==============================================================================
TOPIC: More kudus to Julian Dean
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1978cca078261cf0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:51 pm
From: drmofe


...for getting a-head of Mark Renshaw...
...for getting in his face...

Capital job!


== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:55 pm
From: "i,fred"

drmofe <stewart@wic.co.nz> wrote:
>....for getting a-head of Mark Renshaw...
>....for getting in his face...
>
>Capital job!

That was pretty cool. He's been around and doesn't
need to take heat from anyone.

i,fred


== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:47 pm
From: Henry


On Jul 16, 8:55 am, "i,fred" <if...@th.org> wrote:
> drmofe <stew...@wic.co.nz> wrote:
> >....for getting a-head of Mark Renshaw...
> >....for getting in his face...
>
> >Capital job!
>
> That was pretty cool. He's been around and doesn't
> need to take heat from anyone.
>
> i,fred

I'm disappointed local (NZ) media turning it into another Aussie v
kiwi thing.


== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:56 pm
From: Henry


On Jul 16, 8:51 am, drmofe <stew...@wic.co.nz> wrote:
> ...for getting a-head of Mark Renshaw...
> ...for getting in his face...
>
> Capital job!

isn't a kudu a kind of antelope? or did I just get wooshed ?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Tour Cyclist's Greatest Challenge - To Go Slower
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/7ff039fef194a0d7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:53 pm
From: "i,fred"

Anton Berlin <truth_88888@yahoo.com> wrote:
>http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/11/sports/cycling/11climb.html
>
>Cyclists=92 Alpine Times May Hint at Past Doping
>By JULIET MACUR
>
>LES ROUSSES, France =97 When the riders in the Tour de France head
>into
>the Alps on Sunday, tackling the first high mountains of this year=92s
>race, all eyes will be on them. Stopwatches will be ticking.
>
>=93I think the simplest way to figure out if the sport is clean or
>not
>is to time some of the climbs,=94 said Jonathan Vaughters, the team
>director of Garmin-Transitions, who is an outspoken antidoping
>advocate. =93It=92s not an exact science, but it gives you an idea
>of
>what=92s going on. For me, it=92s something I pay attention to. I
>want to
>know whether I=92m wasting my time.=94
>
>Vaughters watched the Crit=E9rium du Dauphin=E9 in June and timed
>the
>defending Tour winner Alberto Contador as he raced up L=92Alpe d=92Huez,
>a
>route with 21 switchbacks and one of the legendary climbs in cycling.
>Vaughters looked at his stopwatch and was satisfied. =93It was about
>four minutes slower than the winning time in 2001,=94 he said. =93Ah,
>good.=94
>
>In most sports, progress is measured by advancement. Runners go faster
>on the track. Athletes strive to break records.
>
>But in cycling, a sport plagued by doping problems, some measure its
>progress in a different way: by how much it has regressed in terms
>of
>times on steep climbs, particularly since the 1990s and early 2000s,
>when doping was thought to be rampant.
>
>Though the exact starting point of the Alpe d=92Huez climb has changed
>slightly over the years, the Italian rider Marco Pantani still holds
>the record at 37 minutes 35 seconds, set in 1997, as well as three
>of
>the unofficial top five times. He made those climbs before a test
>for
>the blood booster EPO was available. At that time, some riders have
>said, top cyclists often used EPO to increase endurance.
>
>Riders with at least 7 of the unofficial top 16 times up L=92Alpe
>d=92Huez
>have tested positive, like Floyd Landis and Iban Mayo; have admitted
>to doping, like Bjarne Riis, Richard Virenque and Alex Z=FClle; or
>have
>been implicated in a doping scandal, like Jan Ullrich.
>
>Ullrich, the 1997 Tour winner, retired from the sport after being
>tied
>to a Spanish doping ring. His former coach, Rudy P=E9venage, was quoted
>by the French sports newspaper L=92=C9quipe last week saying that
>he had
>organized Ullrich=92s visits to a blood-doping doctor in Spain.
>
>Based on that history, it makes sense that some climbing times have
>slowed with the advent of tougher antidoping tests, said Aldo Sassi,
>an Italian exercise physiologist and longtime cycling coach who trains
>the riders Cadel Evans and Ivan Basso.
>
>=93The speeds are lower in the climbs because there is no doping now,
>or
>less doping, in my opinion,=94 Sassi said. =93If you look at Pantani=92s
>times, the power he produced was very close to 6.8 watts per kilo,
>and
>that is something no one can explain if you have physiological normal
>conditions for any athlete.=94
>
>Sassi, like nearly every top coach now, uses computers affixed to
>riders=92 bikes to determine how much power those riders are producing.
>Sassi said he could also calculate those numbers the old-fashioned
>way, with math.
>
>Over his decades in the sport, he has concluded that no rider can
>produce more than an average of 6.0 to 6.2 watts per kilogram of his
>weight over a ride of 30 to 40 minutes. In the power numbers he
>calculated from the 2009 Giro d=92Italia, Sassi found that only one
>top
>rider =97 Denis Menchov of Rabobank =97 produced more than 6.0 watts
>per
>kilogram on a climb, kicking out a 6.1. Yet a rider who was later
>suspended for doping at that race, Danilo DiLuca of Italy, was
>producing power on another climb at a rate much less than 6.0, Sassi
>said.
>
>=93There is always a gray area,=94 he said.
>
>Sassi said that determining the exact power-to-weight numbers for
>riders in the past was not easy because of the variables involved.
>He
>would need to know things like the length of the climb, the rate of
>ascent, the weight of the rider and bike, and the weather conditions.
>
>=93So for Pantani, for Armstrong, I=92m just not sure,=94 he said.
>
>Lance Armstrong, who is trying to win the Tour for the eighth time,
>holds two of the top four unofficial times up L=92Alpe d=92Huez. His
>team
>manager, Johan Bruyneel, said those fast times should not cast a
>shadow on Armstrong, who is under federal investigation for fraud
>and
>doping during the years he rode on the United States Postal Service
>team.
>
>One of Armstrong=92s top times up L=92Alpe d=92Huez was in the 2004
>time
>trial, when he went full bore up the mountain, with no race tactics
>in
>play or other riders to deal with. He finished in 37:36.
>
>=93There=92s no way you can measure one time against another,=94 Bruyneel
>said. =93If a rider is going full gas from the bottom, that=92s one
>thing.
>But most of the times, that wasn=92t the case. But that won=92t keep
>people from talking.=94
>
>Eyebrows were raised last year at the Tour when Contador sped up the
>Verbier climb, leaving other riders in his wake.
>
>He had zoomed to the top of a 5.5-mile ascent with a 7.5 percent
>average grade in just under 21 minutes, and he later refused to answer
>questions about how he had performed so well.
>
>Vaughters said it was possible to do without doping because it was
>a
>very short climb. But Greg LeMond, a three-time Tour winner, wrote
>in
>the French newspaper Le Monde that he was skeptical of the
>performance.
>
>=93There is something wrong,=94 LeMond wrote, likening Contador=92s
>performance to a Mercedes winning a Formula One race. =93It would
>be
>interesting to know what=92s under the hood.=94
>
>LeMond had performed calculations that showed that Contador=92s maximum
>oxygen intake in that climb was out of the realm of possibility. Some
>exercise physiologists agreed with him and his calculations. Others
>did not.
>
>The same debate arose when Landis won the now infamous Stage 17 of
>the
>2006 Tour. He crossed the finish line in Morzine, the same town
>hosting the finish Sunday, after an improbable solo breakaway that
>set
>him up for the victory. It was an effort so incredible some people
>thought it was too good to be true.
>
>And they were right. He later tested positive for testosterone on
>that
>day and was stripped of the Tour title.
>
>But his former trainer, Allen Lim, who now works for Armstrong=92s
>RadioShack team, said it was possible for Landis to have produced
>that
>performance. He said Landis had produced even more power over a longer
>ride during training.
>
>=93In and of itself, these racers are doing amazing, unbelievable
>things
>on a daily basis because they are already a tiny part of the
>population, a very small percentage of the world,=94 Lim said. =93They
>are
>already different. It=92s when a rider has no history of good
>performances, then has massive changes. Now that=92s when you should
>raise a red flag.=94
>
>There have been some discussions among exercise physiologists of
>testing individual athletes=92 peak performances to determine each
>one=92s
>peak power output and use it as a baseline to determine possible
>doping. Any future performances above that output would raise a red
>flag.
>
>But some say that would never work. The reasons behind amazing
>performances cannot necessarily be proved, they said. Sometimes, they
>just happen.
>
>=93When people are put into extreme situations, like when you see
>when
>people=92s kids are trapped beneath cars and they are able to lift
>up
>that car, they can go to unknown depths of human performance,=94 said
>Matt Parker, the head of marginal gains for Team Sky. =93Performances
>like that come out in sports once in a while, too. So when someone
>does something incredible, why not believe it?=94

Thanks for posting. I think this is more than just a gray area. While I agree
that it can work I just can't see how it would be enforced.

i,fred

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Lance's Lawyers Tries to Blow Smoke
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/960bcba70039d083?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 1:53 pm
From: drmofe


On Jul 16, 7:11 am, "B. Lafferty" <b...@nowhere.com> wrote:
> Note to Lance's attorney.  Lance was entitled to the stock as of the
> Fall of 2004 and acted in reliance thereon. He became a shareholder when

I'm presuming that the isue is if Lance was a shareholder prior to US
Postal pulling out as sponsor and there was institutionalized doping,
that US Govt money could have been used in the doping program?
Which then makes it Federal, and brings in DEA and RICO statutes?


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:59 pm
From: RicodJour


On Jul 15, 3:11 pm, "B. Lafferty" <b...@nowhere.com> wrote:
> Note to Lance's attorney.  Lance was entitled to the stock as of the
> Fall of 2004 and acted in reliance thereon.

Entitled - okay, sure. Acted in reliance...? Cite.

Everybody and their fookin' uncle knew OJ was guilty. Lawyers are
invidious and not to be trusted. You should know that. You should
know that you can't even trust your own opinion on anything, which,
for the record, is not an opinion but tumescence speaking for you.

R


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 3:19 pm
From: "B. Lafferty"


On 7/15/2010 4:53 PM, drmofe wrote:
> On Jul 16, 7:11 am, "B. Lafferty"<b...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>> Note to Lance's attorney. Lance was entitled to the stock as of the
>> Fall of 2004 and acted in reliance thereon. He became a shareholder when
>
> I'm presuming that the isue is if Lance was a shareholder prior to US
> Postal pulling out as sponsor and there was institutionalized doping,
> that US Govt money could have been used in the doping program?
> Which then makes it Federal, and brings in DEA and RICO statutes?

We'll that's one issue. But, if Lance, Johan and Stapleton were in on
knowingly perpetrating a fraud along with Weisel, then Lance and friends
lack of a formal ownership interest would not shield them from fraud
indictments. RICO is a hard charge to make compared to mail and wire
fraud. I doubt the DEA will involve itself in this case.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: why stupid people have difficulty when faced with the truth
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/35435ff2c401a205?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:46 pm
From: Henry


<http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=128490874>


== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:52 pm
From: RicodJour


On Jul 15, 5:46 pm, Henry <snogfest_hosebe...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=128490874>

When people 'discuss' politics, their emotional centers light up -
they're not thinking rationally.

R


== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:53 pm
From: Henry


On Jul 16, 9:52 am, RicodJour <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 15, 5:46 pm, Henry <snogfest_hosebe...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > <http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=128490874>
>
> When people 'discuss' politics, their emotional centers light up -
> they're not thinking rationally.
>
> R

aka rbr trolls


== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 2:56 pm
From: Anton Berlin


On Jul 15, 4:46 pm, Henry <snogfest_hosebe...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> <http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=128490874>

There are extremely high correlations between genetic predispostions
and ultimately political leanings.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/02/080206091437.htm

http://www.cnn.com/2008/HEALTH/02/11/politics.genes/index.html


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Lafferty was totally fucking wrong about Lance getting arrested in
France!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/b76f57f21176d546?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jul 15 2010 3:18 pm
From: Fred Flintstein


Dude,

One of your defining personality characteristics is a complete
inability to accept that you might be wrong about something.
You are the Dunning-Kruger effect brought to life. Here you are
wrong about more than I have the time to point out.

But I am going to address this:

On 7/15/2010 12:55 PM, GoneBeforeMyTime wrote:
>
> To you yeah, so what if he doped, although there is no proof he did yet, but
> yeah, what about all those cancer children he visited who see him as a big
> hero? They are not hardened kids, but kids who often hang onto sports heroes
> almost day by day, and some are completely obsessed wrapping their entire
> teenage lives around them. You ever see a teenager's room plastered with
> posters of their heroes? Look at all the kids who had cancer and saw Lance
> as their hero, and now they will be devastated to find out he's the biggest
> fake in the history of cycling, (if it's proven). Most kids are fragile, not
> hardened like the Grande Poobah who's been in rbr for 20 years.

You don't have anything going on in your life. That leaves a void
that you seek to fill with things that give you comfort. I get that.

A pediatric cancer patient is in the opposite situation. Their lives
are full and overflowing with stuff coming at them from many
directions. The stuff that you think is important to them is not on
the radar screen. Seriously, it is not. There isn't room. Your life
is empty, theirs are overflowing.

Check this out:
http://wjn.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/21/5/600

"Hopefulness and its Characteristics in Adolescents with Cancer"

That comes to mind because I know one of the authors. I'm not really
qualified to judge whether it's top notch work or not. But I do know
that having a sense that you can win the fight is a critical part of
the process. So if Lance shows up at the hospital and convinces kids
that this is a battle they can win, that matters. The stuff that you
think matters... well, it isn't even on the radar screen.

When you look at what livestrong does, you will see things that matter
to cancer patients. The stuff that you think really, really matters,
it doesn't matter. Cancer patients don't have the time or energy for
it.

Trust me on that.

Fred Flintstein


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