Tuesday, February 16, 2010

rec.bicycles.racing - 26 new messages in 3 topics - digest

Buzz It
rec.bicycles.racing
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing?hl=en

rec.bicycles.racing@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* Zinn is wrong. - 4 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/df5b012a69d08875?hl=en
* "No sports mistake is supposed to be fatal" - 8 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/5e3c7e6891b8f805?hl=en
* Landis Attempts Deflection - 14 messages, 8 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/bfe5ff0ba30cfb85?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Zinn is wrong.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/df5b012a69d08875?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 2:36 pm
From: Henry


On Feb 17, 11:25 am, Brad Anders <pband...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 16, 2:27 pm, Henry <snogfest_hosebe...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 17, 10:09 am, ronaldo_jeremiah <ronaldo_jerem...@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > >http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/02/technical-faq/technical-faq-sa...
>
> > > Zinn seems to think that these carbon frames can be repaired and made
> > > safe.  Ha!  It's like he doesn't even know about carbon's unstable,
> > > explosive properties, even in the absence of damage.
>
> > > -rj
>
> > so what's wrong with fixing it ? Carbon fibre and glue doesn't work ?
>
> You need to put your sarcasm hat on.
>
> Brad Anders

bother; I wasn't really being sarcastic; I'm ignorant - why can't cf
be glued ?
ITIR an Americas Cup boat delaminating and sinking, and believe the
glue is a key component.


== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 2:39 pm
From: "Tom Kunich"


"Henry" <snogfest_hosebeast@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2984954f-09db-4cec-95f7-42b7fa31f813@t34g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 17, 11:25 am, Brad Anders <pband...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Feb 16, 2:27 pm, Henry <snogfest_hosebe...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > > so what's wrong with fixing it ? Carbon fibre and glue doesn't work ?
> >
> > You need to put your sarcasm hat on.
>
> bother; I wasn't really being sarcastic; I'm ignorant - why can't cf
> be glued ?

Relax Henry, Brad was suggesting that you were being kidded. Brad is one of
the good guys.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:16 pm
From: curtis@the-md-russells.org


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 14:36:29 -0800 (PST), Henry
<snogfest_hosebeast@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Feb 17, 11:25 am, Brad Anders <pband...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Feb 16, 2:27 pm, Henry <snogfest_hosebe...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> > On Feb 17, 10:09 am, ronaldo_jeremiah <ronaldo_jerem...@yahoo.com>
>> > wrote:
>>
>> > >http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/02/technical-faq/technical-faq-sa...
>>
>> > > Zinn seems to think that these carbon frames can be repaired and made
>> > > safe.  Ha!  It's like he doesn't even know about carbon's unstable,
>> > > explosive properties, even in the absence of damage.
>>
>> > > -rj
>>
>> > so what's wrong with fixing it ? Carbon fibre and glue doesn't work ?
>>
>> You need to put your sarcasm hat on.
>>
>> Brad Anders
>
>bother; I wasn't really being sarcastic; I'm ignorant - why can't cf
>be glued ?
>ITIR an Americas Cup boat delaminating and sinking, and believe the
>glue is a key component.

If you ever saw the film that used carbon dust as a primary explosive
in battlefield level warfare, you would get off your carbon time bomb
and hope it doesn't go entropic in the immediate future. rbr is on the
forefront of combating this danger on the roads.

And whatever you do, don't smoke around that bicycle...

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...


== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 8:32 pm
From: "Mike Jacoubowsky"


<rick-paulos@uiowa.edu> wrote in message
news:0fc1fd73-f1de-4a9f-8584-28bdf14c554f@w31g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> What a fluff piece for calfee. Wonder how much he paid vsnooze for
> that 'article'.

Fluff piece or not, at least Calfee has taken on the task of repairing what
most have considered disposable. Will this drum up more biz for Calfee's
repair department? Very likely. Is that a bad thing? Absolutely not.
Anything that can get us away from $3000+ disposable frames is, in my
opinion, a good thing.

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA


==============================================================================
TOPIC: "No sports mistake is supposed to be fatal"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/5e3c7e6891b8f805?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 2:48 pm
From: Michael Press


In article <hlcnlo$e5u$1@news.eternal-september.org>,
"KurganGringioni" <soulinthemachine@gmail.com> wrote:

> "Ryan Cousineau" <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:rcousine-8F148D.09060415022010@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]...
> : In article <eP2dnROZZpgr1uTWnZ2dnUVZ_vCdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> : Bob Schwartz <bob.schwartz@sbcREMOVEglobal.net> wrote:
> :
> : > Ryan Cousineau wrote:
> : > > I saw the video. The implication is that they never expected a racer
> to
> : > > leave the course there, which is possibly fair. It was super-late: he
> : > > was actually past the last corner, but had such a drawn-out
> corner-exit
> : > > incident that he ended up riding up a (fairly tall) wall and popped
> out
> : > > of the chute.
> : >
> : > Seriously? No one would expect someone to come off the
> : > course at the bottom when speeds are highest? Over the
> : > lifetime of the facility, which will host competitions
> : > where Olympic level skills are the exception rather
> : > than the rule?
> : >
> : > Seriously?
> : >
> : > Bob Schwartz
> :
> : Expected to fall off their sleds? Yes. Expected a luger to exit there?
> : Well, one assumes a basic level of non-ghoulishness among the course
> : designers.
> :
> : What is obvious in retrospect is less so beforehand.
> :
> : Heck, every cyclocross race I tend to have disagreements with designers
> : about what I consider a reasonable route, and acceptably consequential
> : obstacles. Sometimes I get my way* and sometimes I don't. So far,
> : despite my qualms, there have been no deaths and I can recall only one
> : or two minor injuries. There may have been a broken bone in the last few
> : seasons, but I haven't seen it. Worst CX injury I ever saw was on a
> : training ride, when my friend BP sprinted into an invisible ditch in a
> : park, broke his fork, and couldn't remember his own phone number.
> :
> : Sorry, back to my point. The course was vetted by numerous agencies,
> : including the luge federation. They may not have known what they were
> : doing, but presumably "kill riders" was not part of the plan. It was
> : also in use for a few years. We're also talking about a sport that
> : involves unpadded racers on ice at 150 km/h.
> :
> : In hindsight, the barrier needed to be higher there. I'm glad they did.
> : I hope there are no further injuries. I hope nobody skis into a
> : snow-making machine, or collapses during their event and hits their head
> : (two actual ways Olympians have previously died).
> :
> : *mainly because my friend and club-mate Jak designs two of the courses
> : each year, and I do some of the pre-riding.
>
>
>
> Dumnbass -
>
> In bike racing the finish line isn't contested going downhill at 90mph.
>
> If it were, there'd be some elaborate safety precautions wouldn't there?

Yes, they would have a brace of ambulances at the finish.

--
Michael Press


== 2 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 2:49 pm
From: Michael Press


In article <YOURhoward-40AC36.18274915022010@news.giganews.com>,
Howard Kveck <YOURhoward@h-SHOESbomb.com> wrote:

> In article <rcousine-8F148D.09060415022010@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvox.net]>,
> Ryan Cousineau <rcousine@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Sorry, back to my point. The course was vetted by numerous agencies,
> > including the luge federation. They may not have known what they were
> > doing, but presumably "kill riders" was not part of the plan. It was
> > also in use for a few years. We're also talking about a sport that
> > involves unpadded racers on ice at 150 km/h.
>
> Well, no one has tried to say that the track was designed with fatalities as a
> positive part of the plan. But I heard this afternoon that the course designer (who
> has done the last three Olympic luge tracks) stated that the athletes are going
> almost twenty mph faster than he expected. He wasn't sure what happened between the
> design and the construction that could account for the extra speed. As for how long
> the track had been in use, I read yesterday that the Canadians (yeah, you!) had made
> it kind of hard for competitors from other countries to get runs in. The average
> Canadian team member had something over 250 runs while other countries' teams were at
> a fraction of that number. Kumaritashvili (the Georgian) only had about 25. But even
> the best guys are crashing on the track - the extra speed probably has a lot to do
> with that. As for the place Kumaritashvili ended up going off, it's at the exit of
> the turn, isn't it? The athlete that crashes ends up sliding for ages and at the
> speed they're going it's not all that surprising that someone could crash in a way
> that launches them out.

He did not go off course because he crashed.

--
Michael Press


== 3 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 2:59 pm
From: Michael Press


In article <6sGdnRBt-L51NeTWnZ2dnUVZ_jydnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
"Mike Jacoubowsky" <MikeJ@ChainReaction.com> wrote:

> "Michael Press" <rubrum@pacbell.net> wrote in message
> news:rubrum-2DAF76.09442715022010@news.albasani.net...
> > In article
> > <96016453-fe64-4f0a-ab42-e58625352174@b1g2000prc.googlegroups.com>,
> > DirtRoadie <DirtRoadie@aol.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On Feb 14, 11:22 am, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> > "One thing I know for sure is that no sports mistake is supposed to
> >> > lead to
> >> > a death. No sports mistake is supposed to be fatal," President Mikheil
> >> > Saakashvili told reporters Saturday.
> >> >
> >> > As tragic as the death of the luger was, and as seemingly-obvious the
> >> > dangers of that track were, it's still hard to believe someone making
> >> > that
> >> > statement, and have it embraced by so many others.
> >>
> >> I understand that statement to be a response to the bizarre
> >> implication from some official sources that the competitor was at
> >> fault or somehow not up to the task of competing. But even the
> >> defending gold medalist crashed. Yes, the fatal crash was unusual,
> >> maybe not foreseeable.
> >
> > I expect any luge guy will tell you not to steer into the
> > inside of a turn; and so it is foreseeable.
>
> Foreseeable, yes. But when you look at the photo I referenced elsewhere, at
> the top of this page-
> http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/35369187/ns/sports-olympic_sports/ - you may
> come away with a different feeling about it. Yes, a higher skill level is
> relevant, but balancing the cost of a mistake and its consequences vs the
> pretty low cost of raising the side of that wall...

At no time have I discussed what was in the exit trajectory.
I am perfectly clear about something that was foreseeable.

--
Michael Press


== 4 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:00 pm
From: Michael Press


In article
<fd634446-7bb5-44d6-aa67-3acc970d92f8@e19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>,
DirtRoadie <DirtRoadie@aol.com> wrote:

> On Feb 15, 10:44 am, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> > In article
> > <96016453-fe64-4f0a-ab42-e58625352...@b1g2000prc.googlegroups.com>,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  DirtRoadie <DirtRoa...@aol.com> wrote:
> > > On Feb 14, 11:22 am, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > > "One thing I know for sure is that no sports mistake is supposed to lead to
> > > > a death. No sports mistake is supposed to be fatal," President Mikheil
> > > > Saakashvili told reporters Saturday.
> >
> > > > As tragic as the death of the luger was, and as seemingly-obvious the
> > > > dangers of that track were, it's still hard to believe someone making that
> > > > statement, and have it embraced by so many others.
> >
> > > I understand that statement to be a response to the bizarre
> > > implication from some official sources that the competitor was at
> > > fault or somehow not up to the task of competing. But even the
> > > defending gold medalist crashed. Yes, the fatal crash was unusual,
> > > maybe not foreseeable.
> >
> > I expect any luge guy will tell you not to steer into the
> > inside of a turn; and so it is foreseeable.
>
> I would think a broad application of "Shit happens" and/or Murphy's
> law should dictate how safety precautions would be implemented - i.e.
> take every precaution possible.
> It would not seem that the racer was unqualified.
> http://www.nbcolympics.com/news-features/news/newsid=419540.html#luger+told+will+either+die
>
> http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/35369187/ns/sports-olympic_sports/
> "But the International Luge Federation and Vancouver Olympic officials
> said their investigation showed that the crash was the result of human
> error and that 'there was no indication that the accident was caused
> by deficiencies in the track.' '
>
> My take on it - Crash no. Injury yes.

Agree. The reason he went off course is piloting.

--
Michael Press


== 5 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:02 pm
From: Michael Press


In article
<63465b2b-9c63-46a3-84ac-c3c405ed808e@e19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>,
"bjw@mambo.ucolick.org" <bjweiner@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Feb 15, 1:33 am, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > But there's more to it than that, isn't there? You're also depending
> > upon the governing cycling federation to provide guidelines for who is
> > allowed to be out there. You can hold a category 1/pro event without
> > worrying that you're going to get a cat-4 guy in there who might be
> > strong but way over his head in terms of skills. You don't have to be
> > concerned about being all-inclusive for who gets to race.
> >
> > Different story at the Olympics, at least for the luge. Every country
> > wants to have their people in there, regardless of how well qualified
> > they are for the particular event. We get some great stories from that;
> > who will forget Eddie the Eagle? But that particular case brought light
> > to a situation that may have some parallels here... he wasn't capable of
> > competing at the same level as the best athletes, potentially
> > endangering himself. As a result, the ski federation passed the "Eddie
> > the Eagle" rule, which basically says you have to place in the top 30
> > percent in international competition in order to compete in the
> > Olympics.
>
> Armin Zoeggeler crashed on the same luge course
> in practice.

Did he go off course?

> He wasn't hurt, but it is not as simple as
> saying that the guy who crashed and was killed was
> not good enough to be on the course and that his
> crashing is prima facie evidence of that.

Going off course is prima facie evidence.

--
Michael Press


== 6 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 4:11 pm
From: "KurganGringioni"

"Howard Kveck" <YOURhoward@h-SHOESbomb.com> wrote in message
news:YOURhoward-40AC36.18274915022010@news.giganews.com...

: The average
: Canadian team member had something over 250 runs while other countries'
teams were at
: a fraction of that number. Kumaritashvili (the Georgian) only had about
25.


Dumbass -

The fatality notwithstanding, that just poor sportsmanship.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

== 7 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 4:12 pm
From: "KurganGringioni"

"Michael Press" <rubrum@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:rubrum-441F5C.15003216022010@news.albasani.net...
: >
: > http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/35369187/ns/sports-olympic_sports/
: > "But the International Luge Federation and Vancouver Olympic officials
: > said their investigation showed that the crash was the result of human
: > error and that 'there was no indication that the accident was caused
: > by deficiencies in the track.' '
: >
: > My take on it - Crash no. Injury yes.
:
: Agree. The reason he went off course is piloting.

Dumbass -

One could say the same thing about crashes in crits, but that doesn't
prevent us from haybaling traffic lights, parking meters, telephone poles
and the like.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

== 8 of 8 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 8:39 pm
From: "Mike Jacoubowsky"


> Dumnbass -
>
> In bike racing the finish line isn't contested going downhill at 90mph.
>
> If it were, there'd be some elaborate safety precautions wouldn't there?
>
> thanks,
>
> Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

You never raced Nevada City did you? No, not 90mph, but it does finish on
the downhill, and every single lap you're flying down a *fast* descent
straight into a 90 degree turn. It was more fun when they made the turn a
bit further up the hill, onto a much-narrower, just over one-lane road.

One year I raced it, I watch a guy lose his nerve on that descent and not
even try to make the corner. Just plowed straight into the elaborate safety
precautions (hay bails).

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Landis Attempts Deflection
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/bfe5ff0ba30cfb85?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:00 pm
From: "KurganGringioni"

"MrVidmar" <vidmar@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:v6-dnS2eAv2Zb-fWnZ2dnUVZ_vli4p2d@giganews.com...
: Kurgan Gringioni wrote:
: >
: > "MrVidmar" <vidmar@nowhere.com> wrote in message
: >> Are you really this stupid??!! Of course USADA doesn't "do" criminal
: >> cases. Stupid one, they are the victims of what looks like criminal
: >> behavior on the part of Landis and Baker. As victims (it cost them
: >> thousands of $$ to rebut tainted, doctored evidence resulting from
: >> alleged illegal computer hacking) they would go to the US Attorney and
: >> ask the US Attorney to open an investigation (criminal) against
: >> Landis, Baker and anyone else involved.
: >
: >
: > It won't happen.
: >
: > The US Attorney won't care about this.
: >
: > Please go away.
: It might not happen. You have no way of knowing what interests US
: Attorneys building their career.

Dumbass -

It won't happen. The only instance of the Justice Department getting
involved in a sports dispute are Marion Jones and Barry Bonds and the reason
they did that is Bonds and Jones lied to a grand jury and federal
investigators, respectively. They didn't even go after Mark McGwire after he
evaded Congress' questions and McGwire is a 100 times bigger fish than
Flandis who never got punished. In contrast, Flandis has been punished by
the UCI and the sporting event in question was on foreign soil. The Feds
won't touch this. Waste of their time.

Think about that for a second. The steroid taking cheater who broke Roger
Maris' and by extension, Babe Ruth's record (done in 154 games instead of
162) never got prosecuted and they're going to go after Flandis? Ha. Your
delusionality hasn't changed.

The US Attorneys let the sports governing bodies run themselves, as they
should. They've got bigger things to concern themselves with.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

== 2 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:10 pm
From: curtis@the-md-russells.org


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 17:22:12 -0500, MrVidmar <vidmar@nowhere.com>
wrote:

>Anyone today who thinks they can hack into a computer system and not
>leave an electronic trail is doing little more than make money for
>defense attorneys.

Sorry, happens all the time. Far more than people will admit that were
the targets. Please stop trying to sound like a computer expert when
you are not - and you are proving it more and more by the post.

Whatever the final outcome or disposition of the alleged hacking of
Landis' friend or whoever, a bad hacker is in no way an indication or
marker of the abilities of those that truly good at what they do. And
believe it or not, it is highly unlikely that anyone that is an expert
on either side of the issue is going to discuss openly on rbr what the
latest tools and techniques happen to be.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...


== 3 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:34 pm
From: Fred Fredburger


MrVidmar wrote:

> It's a nice attempt at deflection, but that's not at all likely. I
> don't expect that Landis or Baker will address the forensic trail
> leading to Baker's IP address any time soon.

You're right. Neither Landis nor Baker are likely to address the
imaginary forensic trail that you've convinced yourself exists in some
hugely compelling way.


== 4 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:35 pm
From: MrVidmar


curtis@the-md-russells.org wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 17:22:12 -0500, MrVidmar <vidmar@nowhere.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Anyone today who thinks they can hack into a computer system and not
>> leave an electronic trail is doing little more than make money for
>> defense attorneys.
>
> Sorry, happens all the time. Far more than people will admit that were
> the targets. Please stop trying to sound like a computer expert when
> you are not - and you are proving it more and more by the post.
>
> Whatever the final outcome or disposition of the alleged hacking of
> Landis' friend or whoever, a bad hacker is in no way an indication or
> marker of the abilities of those that truly good at what they do. And
> believe it or not, it is highly unlikely that anyone that is an expert
> on either side of the issue is going to discuss openly on rbr what the
> latest tools and techniques happen to be.
>
> Curtis L. Russell
> Odenton, MD (USA)
> Just someone on two wheels...

The myth of the good hacker is just that, a myth. Start with the Cohen
Report and I'll send you several more expert reports to read. The latest
tools an technologies won't be discussed here by the experts, but they
are discussed by experts in testimony for court cases and
professionally. Having just gone through litigation focused on just
these issues, I have more insight into the issue than many people. Our
side learned a lot and paid a lot for the education. I estimate that
our side spent in excess of $400,000 for forensics and internet law
experts to acquire insight into the hacking of email and faking of
Usenet postings. I'm not an expert, but I do know what I'm writing about
here whereas people like Schwartz don't.

I have to think that the idea that cyclists have that they can beat any
test or get over on the authorities led to a situation with Landis and
Baker that just did not translate into the hacking milieu. How far the
case will proceed in France and the US is dependent on many unknowns,
but the issues are there as raised and discussed here.


== 5 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:40 pm
From: Fred Fredburger


curtis@the-md-russells.org wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 17:22:12 -0500, MrVidmar <vidmar@nowhere.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Anyone today who thinks they can hack into a computer system and not
>> leave an electronic trail is doing little more than make money for
>> defense attorneys.
>
> Sorry, happens all the time. Far more than people will admit that were
> the targets. Please stop trying to sound like a computer expert when
> you are not - and you are proving it more and more by the post.
>

He's convinced himself that all ISPs log and retain every incoming and
outgoing packet and retain all system and application logs. We wont be
able to convince him otherwise.


== 6 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:49 pm
From: MrVidmar


Fred Fredburger wrote:
> MrVidmar wrote:
>
>> It's a nice attempt at deflection, but that's not at all likely. I
>> don't expect that Landis or Baker will address the forensic trail
>> leading to Baker's IP address any time soon.
>
> You're right. Neither Landis nor Baker are likely to address the
> imaginary forensic trail that you've convinced yourself exists in some
> hugely compelling way.
>
>


Freddy, I suggest that you tell that to the French investigating judge
who issued the arrest warrant. Have you seen the forensic data?
Unlikely. Let's wait and see what the French court makes public. What
we have now is the report from the lab director that the hacking was
traced back to them by the court. Time will tell.

What I'm curious to hear is Landis' attorney's denial that he knoew
anything about the possibly of false data being placed into evidence by
him on Landis' behalf in the CAS proceedings. I don't see an attorney
of his caliber putting his career in jeopardy for a client.


== 7 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:52 pm
From: MrVidmar


Fred Fredburger wrote:
> curtis@the-md-russells.org wrote:
>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 17:22:12 -0500, MrVidmar <vidmar@nowhere.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Anyone today who thinks they can hack into a computer system and not
>>> leave an electronic trail is doing little more than make money for
>>> defense attorneys.
>>
>> Sorry, happens all the time. Far more than people will admit that were
>> the targets. Please stop trying to sound like a computer expert when
>> you are not - and you are proving it more and more by the post.
>>
>
> He's convinced himself that all ISPs log and retain every incoming and
> outgoing packet and retain all system and application logs. We wont be
> able to convince him otherwise.

You have no idea what I'm convinced of, period. Perhaps you would be
surprised by just how much data is stored and saved, even without formal
preservation requests.


== 8 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:54 pm
From: Henry


On Feb 17, 12:40 pm, Fred Fredburger
<Some...@Somewhere.You.Dont.Wanna.Be> wrote:
> cur...@the-md-russells.org wrote:
> > On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 17:22:12 -0500, MrVidmar <vid...@nowhere.com>
> > wrote:
>
> >> Anyone today who thinks they can hack into a computer system and not
> >> leave an electronic trail is doing little more than make money for
> >> defense attorneys.
>
> > Sorry, happens all the time. Far more than people will admit that were
> > the targets. Please stop trying to sound like a computer expert when
> > you are not - and you are proving it more and more by the post.
>
> He's convinced himself that all ISPs log and retain every incoming and
> outgoing packet and retain all system and application logs. We wont be
> able to convince him otherwise.

not that I want to feed the troll, and I do agree with truism of this
comment, logs _can_ be stored and retained quite cheaply; I doubt that
most ISP's want to take on that overhead; I have managed a 2000 user
mail gateway and the logs were kept (hopefully) forever, but not the
attachments. Feed them into a database, archive.


== 9 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 7:37 pm
From: --D-y


On Feb 16, 3:27 pm, bar <barbari...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 16, 3:53 pm, RobertH <r15...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 16, 10:53 am, --D-y <dustoyev...@mac.com> wrote:
>
> > > This Polgar chick really hurt you bad, bro.
> > > --D-y
>
> > I can't believe after 37 posts this one was still up for grabs.
>
> Godammit, that was MY line!!  Serves me right for taking the morning
> off from rbr.
>
> -b-
>
> p.s. "go fuck yourself" is trending quite high today ...

Neck and neck with "stupid", by an informal guesstimate.

I was hoping to transmit a sort of general meaning, if you know what I
mean, and I only want to borrow
your line this once I promise.

Possibly the most applicable instance, I have to say.
--D-y


== 10 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 7:44 pm
From: bar


On Feb 16, 10:37 pm, --D-y <dustoyev...@mac.com> wrote:
> On Feb 16, 3:27 pm, bar <barbari...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 16, 3:53 pm, RobertH <r15...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 16, 10:53 am, --D-y <dustoyev...@mac.com> wrote:
>
> > > > This Polgar chick really hurt you bad, bro.
> > > > --D-y
>
> > > I can't believe after 37 posts this one was still up for grabs.
>
> > Godammit, that was MY line!!  Serves me right for taking the morning
> > off from rbr.
>
> > -b-
>
> > p.s. "go fuck yourself" is trending quite high today ...
>
> Neck and neck with "stupid", by an informal guesstimate.
>
> I was hoping to transmit a sort of general meaning, if you know what I
> mean, and I only want to borrow
> your line this once I promise.
>
> Possibly the most applicable instance, I have to say.
> --D-y

no hard feelings, bro ... you did what had to be done.


== 11 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 7:49 pm
From: Bob Schwartz


MrVidmar wrote:
> The myth of the good hacker is just that, a myth. Start with the Cohen
> Report and I'll send you several more expert reports to read. The latest
> tools an technologies won't be discussed here by the experts, but they
> are discussed by experts in testimony for court cases and
> professionally. Having just gone through litigation focused on just
> these issues, I have more insight into the issue than many people. Our
> side learned a lot and paid a lot for the education. I estimate that
> our side spent in excess of $400,000 for forensics and internet law
> experts to acquire insight into the hacking of email and faking of
> Usenet postings. I'm not an expert, but I do know what I'm writing about
> here whereas people like Schwartz don't.

Dumbass,

Was Professor Vayer one of the experts? You know, he's a professor.

Bob Schwartz


== 12 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 7:50 pm
From: --D-y


On Feb 16, 5:00 pm, "KurganGringioni" <soulinthemach...@gmail.com>
wrote:

(snip snip, just want to ask a question)

So, I went looking and saw Lafferty's name (assuming another Brian is
the same Lafferty who used to go on about stuff like quarantining pro
bike riders, destroying the sport on purpose or at least ending racing
for a couple of years as effective and justifiable ploys in the War on
Doping) mentioned as one of the sue-ee's in the chess-mess that
vidmore is talking about-- ironically, whatever the letters stand for,
it's USCF for chess, too. Yeah, Chess Federation, I guess. Whatever.

Well well, looks like someone called someone else a poopyhead or
something in court, and else is mighty PO'd.

Question is, is this "vidmar" the same entity as Lafferty?
Can you imagine posting to a cycling newsgroup with the nom-de-net
"MrMerckx"? Effrontery, anyone?

They're all still doping. Chess players included.
<g>
Regards,
--D-y


== 13 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 8:49 pm
From: Fred Fredburger


Henry wrote:
> On Feb 17, 12:40 pm, Fred Fredburger
> <Some...@Somewhere.You.Dont.Wanna.Be> wrote:
>> cur...@the-md-russells.org wrote:
>>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 17:22:12 -0500, MrVidmar <vid...@nowhere.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> Anyone today who thinks they can hack into a computer system and not
>>>> leave an electronic trail is doing little more than make money for
>>>> defense attorneys.
>>> Sorry, happens all the time. Far more than people will admit that were
>>> the targets. Please stop trying to sound like a computer expert when
>>> you are not - and you are proving it more and more by the post.
>> He's convinced himself that all ISPs log and retain every incoming and
>> outgoing packet and retain all system and application logs. We wont be
>> able to convince him otherwise.
>
> not that I want to feed the troll, and I do agree with truism of this
> comment, logs _can_ be stored and retained quite cheaply; I doubt that
> most ISP's want to take on that overhead; I have managed a 2000 user
> mail gateway and the logs were kept (hopefully) forever, but not the
> attachments. Feed them into a database, archive.

Sure, it CAN be done. As you say though, the motivation is generally
lacking.


== 14 of 14 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 8:51 pm
From: Fred Fredburger


MrVidmar wrote:

>
> You have no idea what I'm convinced of, period.

Of course I know what you're convinced of, nitwit! You keep telling us.


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alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets - 25 new messages in 4 topics - digest

Buzz It
alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets?hl=en

alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* HUMOR WORLD - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/086119e944658532?hl=en
* Jared Odrick - 6 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/90470891e95c09a8?hl=en
* What exactly does an NFL assistant coach do anyway? - 17 messages, 6 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/e811af4db6f302eb?hl=en
* Jets fans "Board" after watchinh Indy game. - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/d43a498d9bdb4870?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: HUMOR WORLD
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/086119e944658532?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 5:48 pm
From: lowes@msn.com (TIM LAWYER)


http://www.webspawner.com/users/humorworld


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Jared Odrick
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/90470891e95c09a8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 6:19 am
From: Johnctx


Johnny Morongo wrote:
> Johnctx wrote:
>> Johnny Morongo wrote:
>>> Johnctx wrote:
>>>> I watched 1/2 this video. Now it is one game, but this is a
>>>> highlight reel?
>>>>
>>>> http://www.wikio.com/video/2385490
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Now I have to admit I am biased toward SEC players but if by some
>>>> miracle Dan Williams of Tenn drops I will be doing a dance. if the
>>>> Pats get him I will be sick.
>>>
>>>
>>> Why would we want a guy who is described as:
>>>
>>> Extremely inconsistent --- Effort / Motor runs hot and cold --- Does
>>> not always use proper leverage --- Limited repertoire of moves ---
>>> Will not offer much as a pass rusher --- Average hand use ---
>>> Struggles to get off blocks at times --- Has serious issues with
>>> conditioning and stamina.
>>> http://www.draftcountdown.com/ScoutingReports/DT/Dan-Williams.php
>>
>> One draft report which doesn't mean they are wrong. His stock went up
>> at the Senior Bowl. He can play DT & NG and he is huge.
>
> Another scouting site says:
> Odrick (ODD-rick) would be best served playing next to a bigger nose
> tackle in the NFL, allowing him to work one on one against interior
> linemen. His run defense should improve over time, and he can contribute
> right away as an interior pass rusher. His best fit as a professional
> may be in a cover 2 defense, or as a defensive end in a 3-4 alignment.
> Currently he is a fringe first round prospect, but likely a second round
> pick.
>
>>
>> I saw him play a few times and a buddy pointed him out to me.
>
> When you saw him, did he, Gholston like, take plays off? How did he
> look at the Senior Bowl?

The reports were good out the Senior bowl week. I saw him play against
Alabama which they almost won & Ole Miss where they got hammered. He was
very involved and seemed to be doing well at times against two good OL's.

Interesting about him playing 3-4 DE. He is a big man.
>
> I'm looking for the best DE or Best DB on the board at 28. If one of
> the top guys is not there, rather than reaching for a WR, I'd like to
> see us trade back for more lower round picks.

Johnny I hate 1st round picks. If we can get the player we want &
accumulate more picks I say do it. We only have picks in rounds 1, 2, 6
& 7 this year.


== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 7:43 am
From: graybeard


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 08:19:29 -0600 Johnctx <jc@spamtx.net> wrote:

>Johnny I hate 1st round picks. If we can get the player we want &
>accumulate more picks I say do it. We only have picks in rounds 1, 2, 6
>& 7 this year.

I believe we also have the Eagles' 5th round pick from the Lito Sheppard
trade.
--
graybeard


== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 12:58 pm
From: Johnctx


graybeard wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 08:19:29 -0600 Johnctx <jc@spamtx.net> wrote:
>
>> Johnny I hate 1st round picks. If we can get the player we want &
>> accumulate more picks I say do it. We only have picks in rounds 1, 2, 6
>> & 7 this year.
>
> I believe we also have the Eagles' 5th round pick from the Lito Sheppard
> trade.

Gray I hope you are right but I don't see it.


== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:10 pm
From: graybeard


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 14:58:30 -0600 Johnctx <jc@spamtx.net> wrote:

>graybeard wrote:
>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 08:19:29 -0600 Johnctx <jc@spamtx.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Johnny I hate 1st round picks. If we can get the player we want &
>>> accumulate more picks I say do it. We only have picks in rounds 1, 2, 6
>>> & 7 this year.
>>
>> I believe we also have the Eagles' 5th round pick from the Lito Sheppard
>> trade.
>
>Gray I hope you are right but I don't see it.

You may well be right. Between all the picks we traded to Philly for
Lito, to Cleveland for Edwards, and to Detroit for O'Connell, I've
completely lost track of what we have left.
--
graybeard


== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:30 pm
From: graybeard


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 18:10:58 -0500 graybeard <graybeard@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

>On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 14:58:30 -0600 Johnctx <jc@spamtx.net> wrote:
>
>>graybeard wrote:
>>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 08:19:29 -0600 Johnctx <jc@spamtx.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Johnny I hate 1st round picks. If we can get the player we want &
>>>> accumulate more picks I say do it. We only have picks in rounds 1, 2, 6
>>>> & 7 this year.
>>>
>>> I believe we also have the Eagles' 5th round pick from the Lito Sheppard
>>> trade.
>>
>>Gray I hope you are right but I don't see it.
>
>You may well be right. Between all the picks we traded to Philly for
>Lito, to Cleveland for Edwards, and to Detroit for O'Connell, I've
>completely lost track of what we have left.

Then again, there's this:

http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/news/2010NFLDraftCentral.asp

BTW, the Jets own web site is one of the worst organized I've ever seen.
I can never find anything on there.
--
graybeard


== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 6:35 pm
From: Johnny Morongo


graybeard wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 18:10:58 -0500 graybeard <graybeard@invalid.invalid>
> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 14:58:30 -0600 Johnctx <jc@spamtx.net> wrote:
>>
>>> graybeard wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 08:19:29 -0600 Johnctx <jc@spamtx.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Johnny I hate 1st round picks. If we can get the player we want &
>>>>> accumulate more picks I say do it. We only have picks in rounds 1, 2, 6
>>>>> & 7 this year.
>>>> I believe we also have the Eagles' 5th round pick from the Lito Sheppard
>>>> trade.
>>> Gray I hope you are right but I don't see it.
>> You may well be right. Between all the picks we traded to Philly for
>> Lito, to Cleveland for Edwards, and to Detroit for O'Connell, I've
>> completely lost track of what we have left.
>
> Then again, there's this:
>
> http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/news/2010NFLDraftCentral.asp
>
> BTW, the Jets own web site is one of the worst organized I've ever seen.
> I can never find anything on there.

I'm glad I'm not the only one, Gray. That site has needed a make-over
since the day it was introduced. This is NEW YORK, fer Criss sake.
Can't we get a site that is at least as good as the Bills?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What exactly does an NFL assistant coach do anyway?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/e811af4db6f302eb?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 7:38 am
From: graybeard


Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
don't understand how this move improves the team.
--
graybeard


== 2 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 8:06 am
From: MZ


graybeard wrote:
> Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
> new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
> playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
> exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
> of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
> a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
> get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
> don't understand how this move improves the team.

They say that good defenders know exactly what everybody else is doing.
Being immersed in the league for so long, I think they become experts
in the hows, regardless of position.

I remember when the Pats moved Pepper Johnson to DL coach and moved Matt
Patricia (former college OL, offensive assistant) to coach linebackers.
Patricia had a little more coaching experience than Johnson at the
time -- maybe the LB coach position is more "cerebral"?


== 3 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 9:14 am
From: graybeard


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 11:06:41 -0500 MZ <mark@nospam.void> wrote:

>graybeard wrote:
>> Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
>> new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
>> playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
>> exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
>> of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
>> a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
>> get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
>> don't understand how this move improves the team.
>
>They say that good defenders know exactly what everybody else is doing.
> Being immersed in the league for so long, I think they become experts
>in the hows, regardless of position.
>
>I remember when the Pats moved Pepper Johnson to DL coach and moved Matt
>Patricia (former college OL, offensive assistant) to coach linebackers.
> Patricia had a little more coaching experience than Johnson at the
>time -- maybe the LB coach position is more "cerebral"?

I can certainly understand how a smart player, offensive or defensive,
will know the placement and responsibilities of everyone else on his
unit, but once the ball is snapped he's gonna be pretty busy, so I don't
see how he could really observe the details on how other guys go about
their jobs. I suppose he could pick up some knowledge from film studies,
but I don't believe that's the same as actually having played the
position(s). The word is that Carrier wants to learn about other areas
of defense so that he can become a Defensive Coordinator someday, and
that's fine, but I would rather he started as assistant to a more
experienced DL coach rather than jumping right into a job he is
unfamiliar with. I've always felt that players from the other side of
the ball would make good assistant coaches for positions they have
played against, for example, an offensive tackle passing along pass
rushing tips to a defensive end based on the techniques of all the DE's
the OT has faced. But maybe that kind of thing goes on all the time at
practice.
--
graybeard


== 4 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 9:15 am
From: Michael


On Feb 16, 10:38 am, graybeard <graybe...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
> new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
> playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
> exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
> of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
> a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
> get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
> don't understand how this move improves the team.
> --
> graybeard

if you are a patriots assistant coach, you don't do a whole lot other
than get belichicks laundry while you are being covered in praise for
a job well done. of course, that will turn to criticism just as soon
as you sail away on your own.

and yes.. that seems odd... a db as a d-line coach ??? still... if you
are a hc, you still coach and teach all players including skill
players and guys in the trenches, no ??? same deal if you are running
an offense or defense. most if not all the guys you are coaching play
a position that you never did. so i guess not so strange just as long
as you actually know what you are doing.


== 5 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 9:31 am
From: "Ray O'Hara"

"graybeard" <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:6fjln59lp9jkrcpm9sdjqqnpiq5idinq8d@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 11:06:41 -0500 MZ <mark@nospam.void> wrote:
>
>>graybeard wrote:
>>> Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
>>> new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
>>> playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
>>> exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
>>> of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
>>> a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
>>> get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
>>> don't understand how this move improves the team.
>>
>>They say that good defenders know exactly what everybody else is doing.
>> Being immersed in the league for so long, I think they become experts
>>in the hows, regardless of position.
>>
>>I remember when the Pats moved Pepper Johnson to DL coach and moved Matt
>>Patricia (former college OL, offensive assistant) to coach linebackers.
>> Patricia had a little more coaching experience than Johnson at the
>>time -- maybe the LB coach position is more "cerebral"?
>
> I can certainly understand how a smart player, offensive or defensive,
> will know the placement and responsibilities of everyone else on his
> unit, but once the ball is snapped he's gonna be pretty busy, so I don't
> see how he could really observe the details on how other guys go about
> their jobs. I suppose he could pick up some knowledge from film studies,
> but I don't believe that's the same as actually having played the
> position(s). The word is that Carrier wants to learn about other areas
> of defense so that he can become a Defensive Coordinator someday, and
> that's fine, but I would rather he started as assistant to a more
> experienced DL coach rather than jumping right into a job he is
> unfamiliar with. I've always felt that players from the other side of
> the ball would make good assistant coaches for positions they have
> played against, for example, an offensive tackle passing along pass
> rushing tips to a defensive end based on the techniques of all the DE's
> the OT has faced. But maybe that kind of thing goes on all the time at
> practice.
> --
> graybeard


two of the greatest offensively minded head coaches, Landry and Shula were
DBs.
you never know


== 6 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 9:41 am
From: MZ


Ray O'Hara wrote:
> "graybeard" <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> news:6fjln59lp9jkrcpm9sdjqqnpiq5idinq8d@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 11:06:41 -0500 MZ <mark@nospam.void> wrote:
>>
>>> graybeard wrote:
>>>> Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
>>>> new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
>>>> playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
>>>> exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
>>>> of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
>>>> a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
>>>> get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
>>>> don't understand how this move improves the team.
>>> They say that good defenders know exactly what everybody else is doing.
>>> Being immersed in the league for so long, I think they become experts
>>> in the hows, regardless of position.
>>>
>>> I remember when the Pats moved Pepper Johnson to DL coach and moved Matt
>>> Patricia (former college OL, offensive assistant) to coach linebackers.
>>> Patricia had a little more coaching experience than Johnson at the
>>> time -- maybe the LB coach position is more "cerebral"?
>> I can certainly understand how a smart player, offensive or defensive,
>> will know the placement and responsibilities of everyone else on his
>> unit, but once the ball is snapped he's gonna be pretty busy, so I don't
>> see how he could really observe the details on how other guys go about
>> their jobs. I suppose he could pick up some knowledge from film studies,
>> but I don't believe that's the same as actually having played the
>> position(s). The word is that Carrier wants to learn about other areas
>> of defense so that he can become a Defensive Coordinator someday, and
>> that's fine, but I would rather he started as assistant to a more
>> experienced DL coach rather than jumping right into a job he is
>> unfamiliar with. I've always felt that players from the other side of
>> the ball would make good assistant coaches for positions they have
>> played against, for example, an offensive tackle passing along pass
>> rushing tips to a defensive end based on the techniques of all the DE's
>> the OT has faced. But maybe that kind of thing goes on all the time at
>> practice.
>> --
>> graybeard
>
>
> two of the greatest offensively minded head coaches, Landry and Shula were
> DBs.
> you never know

And Belichick was a college OL.


== 7 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 12:53 pm
From: "papa.carl44"

"graybeard" <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:e7eln5l0nulsf9cttj6cp2arglgqhjltfr@4ax.com...
> Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
> new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
> playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
> exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
> of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
> a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
> get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
> don't understand how this move improves the team.
> --
> graybeard

This doesn't confuse me at all, especially from this particular perspective.
Carrier spent his whole career watching D linemen in front of him, plus he
is completely immersed in the entire defense. I coached for about 25 years,
when I played I mostly played offensive guard, fullback, and a hybrid
noseguard, linebacker thing...but when I coached I coached every position in
the game until finally becoming a linebacker coach and defensive
coordinator. Defensive players learn what the entire D is doing, and they
do understand technique too. Coaches spend most of their time going to all
kinds of clinics and spend countless hours working on technique. This is
not the pop warner deal where some local high school guy comes out to prove
how great he thinks he once was by creating a clone of himself as a running
back or QB. Coaches spend ALL of their time working on what they do. If
Carrier is a bright guy, and wants to be a top coach, he will be fine at
coaching the D line, when he was playing he had to know a lot of what they
were doing anyway. There are also lots of coaches who were quite good that
never played the game, but knew how to do it. OMHO, Papa Carl


== 8 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 12:59 pm
From: "papa.carl44"

"Michael" <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:5a4f3d7a-4b6d-4544-a5a4-c6f492888f01@c28g2000vbc.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 16, 10:38 am, graybeard <graybe...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
> new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
> playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
> exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
> of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
> a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
> get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
> don't understand how this move improves the team.
> --
> graybeard

if you are a patriots assistant coach, you don't do a whole lot other
than get belichicks laundry while you are being covered in praise for
a job well done. of course, that will turn to criticism just as soon
as you sail away on your own.

and yes.. that seems odd... a db as a d-line coach ??? still... if you
are a hc, you still coach and teach all players including skill
players and guys in the trenches, no ??? same deal if you are running
an offense or defense. most if not all the guys you are coaching play
a position that you never did. so i guess not so strange just as long
as you actually know what you are doing.

If you have been around football for any legnth of time...really around it,
involved...you will find that position played has NOTHING to do with how
good a coach someone is. I was asked to become a track coach by the guy who
was the head track coach. I never was involved with track. He had watched
me coach linebackers and felt I would be a good sprint guy. He taught me, I
learned and we won a lot of races. I already knew how to motivate, control,
keep them working etc. The reaction fundamentals had a lot of carrry over
involved. I just don't see any problem here at all.


== 9 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 1:09 pm
From: graybeard


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 09:15:23 -0800 (PST) Michael <mjd1966@verizon.net>
wrote:

>and yes.. that seems odd... a db as a d-line coach ??? still... if you
>are a hc, you still coach and teach all players including skill
>players and guys in the trenches, no ??? same deal if you are running
>an offense or defense. most if not all the guys you are coaching play
>a position that you never did. so i guess not so strange just as long
>as you actually know what you are doing.

Not all Generals came up through the infantry, but if you were in an
infantry company, and you found out that your new 1st Lt who is going to
be leading you into a fire zone was just transferred over from Supply,
you might get a little nervous.
--
graybeard


== 10 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 1:16 pm
From: graybeard


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 12:31:36 -0500 "Ray O'Hara"
<raymond-ohara@hotmail.com> wrote:

> two of the greatest offensively minded head coaches, Landry and Shula were
>DBs.
>you never know

True, but Head Coach is a whole different job from position coach. HC
requires much more of an ability to see and manage the whole picture.
Guys with that talent can have various backgrounds.
--
graybeard


== 11 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 1:34 pm
From: Michael


On Feb 16, 4:09 pm, graybeard <graybe...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 09:15:23 -0800 (PST) Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net>
> wrote:
>
> >and yes.. that seems odd... a db as a d-line coach ??? still... if you
> >are a hc, you still coach and teach all players including skill
> >players and guys in the trenches, no ??? same deal if you are running
> >an offense or defense.  most if not all the guys you are coaching play
> >a position that you never did.  so i guess not so strange just as long
> >as you actually know what you are doing.
>
> Not all Generals came up through the infantry, but if you were in an
> infantry company, and you found out that your new 1st Lt who is going to
> be leading you into a fire zone was just transferred over from Supply,
> you might get a little nervous.
> --
> graybeard


but at least the guy from supply could pull a few strings with the
quartermaster and get everyone extra body armor, bandages and
morphene :-)


== 12 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:12 pm
From: graybeard


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 13:34:52 -0800 (PST) Michael <mjd1966@verizon.net>
wrote:

>On Feb 16, 4:09 pm, graybeard <graybe...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 09:15:23 -0800 (PST) Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >and yes.. that seems odd... a db as a d-line coach ??? still... if you
>> >are a hc, you still coach and teach all players including skill
>> >players and guys in the trenches, no ??? same deal if you are running
>> >an offense or defense.  most if not all the guys you are coaching play
>> >a position that you never did.  so i guess not so strange just as long
>> >as you actually know what you are doing.
>>
>> Not all Generals came up through the infantry, but if you were in an
>> infantry company, and you found out that your new 1st Lt who is going to
>> be leading you into a fire zone was just transferred over from Supply,
>> you might get a little nervous.
>> --
>> graybeard
>
>
>but at least the guy from supply could pull a few strings with the
>quartermaster and get everyone extra body armor, bandages and
>morphene :-)

And condoms! ;-)
--
graybeard


== 13 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 3:14 pm
From: graybeard


On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 15:53:45 -0500 "papa.carl44"
<papadotcarl@nospamverizon.net> wrote:

>
>"graybeard" <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
>news:e7eln5l0nulsf9cttj6cp2arglgqhjltfr@4ax.com...
>> Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
>> new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
>> playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
>> exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
>> of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
>> a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
>> get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
>> don't understand how this move improves the team.
>> --
>> graybeard
>
>This doesn't confuse me at all, especially from this particular perspective.
>Carrier spent his whole career watching D linemen in front of him, plus he
>is completely immersed in the entire defense. I coached for about 25 years,
>when I played I mostly played offensive guard, fullback, and a hybrid
>noseguard, linebacker thing...but when I coached I coached every position in
>the game until finally becoming a linebacker coach and defensive
>coordinator. Defensive players learn what the entire D is doing, and they
>do understand technique too. Coaches spend most of their time going to all
>kinds of clinics and spend countless hours working on technique. This is
>not the pop warner deal where some local high school guy comes out to prove
>how great he thinks he once was by creating a clone of himself as a running
>back or QB. Coaches spend ALL of their time working on what they do. If
>Carrier is a bright guy, and wants to be a top coach, he will be fine at
>coaching the D line, when he was playing he had to know a lot of what they
>were doing anyway. There are also lots of coaches who were quite good that
>never played the game, but knew how to do it. OMHO, Papa Carl

Glad to hear it. I'm always prepared to take your opinions on coaching
seriously.
--
graybeard


== 14 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 5:40 pm
From: "Ray O'Hara"

"graybeard" <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:cc2mn5dmou7o4ikv2v7gsoa175j7p7soi9@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 12:31:36 -0500 "Ray O'Hara"
> <raymond-ohara@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> two of the greatest offensively minded head coaches, Landry and Shula
>> were
>>DBs.
>>you never know
>
> True, but Head Coach is a whole different job from position coach. HC
> requires much more of an ability to see and manage the whole picture.
> Guys with that talent can have various backgrounds.
> --
> graybeard

they all started as position coaches.


== 15 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 6:06 pm
From: Johnny Morongo


graybeard wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 13:34:52 -0800 (PST) Michael <mjd1966@verizon.net>
> wrote:
>
>> On Feb 16, 4:09 pm, graybeard <graybe...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 09:15:23 -0800 (PST) Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> and yes.. that seems odd... a db as a d-line coach ??? still... if you
>>>> are a hc, you still coach and teach all players including skill
>>>> players and guys in the trenches, no ??? same deal if you are running
>>>> an offense or defense. most if not all the guys you are coaching play
>>>> a position that you never did. so i guess not so strange just as long
>>>> as you actually know what you are doing.
>>> Not all Generals came up through the infantry, but if you were in an
>>> infantry company, and you found out that your new 1st Lt who is going to
>>> be leading you into a fire zone was just transferred over from Supply,
>>> you might get a little nervous.
>>> --
>>> graybeard
>>
>> but at least the guy from supply could pull a few strings with the
>> quartermaster and get everyone extra body armor, bandages and
>> morphene :-)
>
> And extra large condoms! ;-)

Fixed.


== 16 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 8:05 pm
From: "papa.carl44"

"graybeard" <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:ql9mn5909a9skfdib3eib6or1155qnk3c1@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 15:53:45 -0500 "papa.carl44"
> <papadotcarl@nospamverizon.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>"graybeard" <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
>>news:e7eln5l0nulsf9cttj6cp2arglgqhjltfr@4ax.com...
>>> Recently the Jets hired former pro bowl safety Mark Carrier to be their
>>> new Defensive Line coach. Huh??? What does an ex-safety know about
>>> playing DL? Is teaching no longer part of a coach's responsibility? How
>>> exactly is Carrier going to school a new draft pick on the finer points
>>> of Nose Tackle technique, or show a DE what kind of moves will make him
>>> a better pass rusher? Or is he just there to make sure the right guys
>>> get on the field for the formation that's called? This confuses me. I
>>> don't understand how this move improves the team.
>>> --
>>> graybeard
>>
>>This doesn't confuse me at all, especially from this particular
>>perspective.
>>Carrier spent his whole career watching D linemen in front of him, plus he
>>is completely immersed in the entire defense. I coached for about 25
>>years,
>>when I played I mostly played offensive guard, fullback, and a hybrid
>>noseguard, linebacker thing...but when I coached I coached every position
>>in
>>the game until finally becoming a linebacker coach and defensive
>>coordinator. Defensive players learn what the entire D is doing, and they
>>do understand technique too. Coaches spend most of their time going to
>>all
>>kinds of clinics and spend countless hours working on technique. This is
>>not the pop warner deal where some local high school guy comes out to
>>prove
>>how great he thinks he once was by creating a clone of himself as a
>>running
>>back or QB. Coaches spend ALL of their time working on what they do. If
>>Carrier is a bright guy, and wants to be a top coach, he will be fine at
>>coaching the D line, when he was playing he had to know a lot of what they
>>were doing anyway. There are also lots of coaches who were quite good
>>that
>>never played the game, but knew how to do it. OMHO, Papa Carl
>
> Glad to hear it. I'm always prepared to take your opinions on coaching
> seriously.
> --
> graybeard

Thank you. I spent a lot of time around it...the best QB coach I ever saw,
at high school and college levels was a center when he played at a D I
school. I know how to run the football, read blocking etc., I know how to
attack a defense far better than I could ever execute it. I coached my son
to be a running back and he was very successful in college...but I sure as
Hell could not play the way he did. I teach chords and scale patterns on
guitar to my granddaughter, but her young and quick fingers execute the
stuff better than I do after a few months of practice. But....she still
comes back when she can't remember stuff or gets confused, and I can watch
what she does and correct it. Coaches work hard at what they do....and if
they don't, they are simply not good coaches or teachers. I would rather
have a good teacher who works at his craft doing the coaching at any
position than a super star at that position who is not a good teacher.


== 17 of 17 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 8:25 pm
From: "Ray O'Hara"

"graybeard" <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:p52mn55ri899uphfe1vqefdtpjaoe4jp3u@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 09:15:23 -0800 (PST) Michael <mjd1966@verizon.net>
> wrote:
>
>>and yes.. that seems odd... a db as a d-line coach ??? still... if you
>>are a hc, you still coach and teach all players including skill
>>players and guys in the trenches, no ??? same deal if you are running
>>an offense or defense. most if not all the guys you are coaching play
>>a position that you never did. so i guess not so strange just as long
>>as you actually know what you are doing.
>
> Not all Generals came up through the infantry, but if you were in an
> infantry company, and you found out that your new 1st Lt who is going to
> be leading you into a fire zone was just transferred over from Supply,
> you might get a little nervous.
> --
> graybeard

U.S.Grant, America's greatest, most talented and most successful general,
was the regt quartermaster.
He was a lion in combat as a junior officer.


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Jets fans "Board" after watchinh Indy game.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/d43a498d9bdb4870?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Feb 16 2010 8:06 am
From: Michael


On Feb 15, 8:41 am, "4th and 2 BAHAHAHA" <brady to welker @
cumshot.com> wrote:
> Just sayin......

there is a post below that i think you'd be interested in

"Increase your penis size and feel better about yourself"


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[socialactionfoundationforequity:2095 Child Health News Update

Buzz It
--- On Wed, 17/2/10, Editor <editor@news-medical.net> wrote:

From: Editor <editor@news-medical.net>
Subject: Child Health News Update
To: avnishjolly@yahoo.com
Date: Wednesday, 17 February, 2010, 4:55

Problems reading this email? Click here to browse online.

Latest Child Health News


Childhood obesity: Strongest predictor of premature death
In a study now being published in The New England Journal of Medicine, Associate Professor Paul Franks of Umeå University in Sweden, in collaboration with researchers in the US, shows how childhood obesity, together with other risk factors for cardiovascular disease, affects premature death.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100216/Childhood-obesity-Strongest-predictor-of-premature-death.aspx


SELmedia releases evidence-based program that helps HFA kids develop social skills
SELmedia announced today that it has released its newest addition to the growing suite of S.S.GRIN (Social Skills Group Intervention) programs. S.S.GRIN HFA is the first evidence-based program that teaches social skills to young children diagnosed with High Functioning Autism (HFA). The program is appropriate for use in schools, community settings and clinics.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100216/SELmedia-releases-evidence-based-program-that-helps-HFA-kids-develop-social-skills.aspx


Circumcision: Risky by untrained providers with inappropriate equipment
How safe is circumcision? A systematic review, published in the open access journal BMC Urology has found that neonatal and infant circumcision by trained staff rarely results in problems. Risks can be higher among older boys, especially when undertaken by untrained providers with inappropriate equipment.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100216/Circumcision-Risky-by-untrained-providers-with-inappropriate-equipment.aspx


Nascent symptoms of autism in infants emerge during latter part of first year of life
A study of the development of autism in infants, comparing the behavior of the siblings of children diagnosed with autism to that of babies developing normally, has found that the nascent symptoms of the condition - a lack of shared eye contact, smiling and communicative babbling - are not present at 6 months, but emerge gradually and only become apparent during the latter part of the first year of life.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100216/Nascent-symptoms-of-autism-in-infants-emerge-during-latter-part-of-first-year-of-life.aspx


Over 96% of SIDS cases due to known risk factors
Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS) continues to be the third leading cause of infant death, according to the Centers for Disease Control (CDC), despite a decline in SIDS that is associated with a rise in safe-sleep practices for newborns and infants. A new study by Barbara M. Ostfeld, PhD and Thomas Hegyi, MD, professors in the Department of Pediatrics at UMDNJ-Robert Wood Johnson Medical School, has identified that more than 96 percent of infants who died of SIDS were exposed to known risk factors, among them sleeping on their side or stomach, or exposure to tobacco smoke, and that 78 percent of SIDS cases contained multiple risk factors.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100216/Over-9625-of-SIDS-cases-due-to-known-risk-factors.aspx


'Crowding' helps see things better
'Crowding', the phenomenon when people are less able to differentiate letters if they are surrounded by other letters, actually leads to better vision. This is the conclusion of Dr Frans Cornelissen, who together with Dr Ronald van den Berg and Prof. Jos Roerdink is the first to succeed in explaining crowding with a mathematical model. 'At this moment in time our model is mainly interesting in a fundamental sense', says Cornelissen. 'In the long term, however, it may acquire practical applications, for example when designing learning material for children with dyslexia.'
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100216/Crowding-helps-see-things-better.aspx


Rite Aid raised more than $5.1M in 2009 for Children's Miracle Network hospitals
Thanks to the efforts of Rite Aid associates and customers nationwide, Rite Aid raised more than $5.1 million in 2009 for Children's Miracle Network, an international, non-profit organization that raises funds for more than 170 children's hospitals.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100216/Rite-Aid-raised-more-than-2451M-in-2009-for-Childrens-Miracle-Network-hospitals.aspx


Researchers identify potential therapeutic targets for treatment of neuroblastoma
A team of researchers, led by Patrick Mehlen, at Universit- de Lyon, France, has identified the protein NT-3 and the cell-surface molecule to which it binds (TrkC) as potential therapeutic targets for the treatment of neuroblastoma - the most frequent solid tumor in young children- by studying human neuroblastoma cells in vitro and after xenotransplantation into mice and chicks.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100215/Researchers-identify-potential-therapeutic-targets-for-treatment-of-neuroblastoma.aspx


Two families having premature baby visit White House to share their inspiring stories with President Obama
Two families who know all too well the trauma of having a baby born prematurely visited the White House today to share their inspiring stories with President Obama. The Hall family from Leesburg, Va., and the Hoffman family from Weston, Fla., are ambassadors for the March of Dimes, a nonprofit foundation that works to prevent premature birth, birth defects, and infant mortality.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100215/Two-families-having-premature-baby-visit-White-House-to-share-their-inspiring-stories-with-President-Obama.aspx


Discharged VAD implanted pediatric patient receives successful heart transplant after eight months
The wait is over for 16-year-old Francesco "Frank" De Santiago. On January 29, De Santiago received a donor heart in a nine-hour transplant operation at Texas Children's Heart Center De Santiago made news last October as the first child ever discharged from a pediatric hospital with an implanted mechanical heart pump, or ventricular assist device (VAD). Until then, pediatric patients with VADs remained in the hospital, often in ICU, while awaiting a donor heart.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100215/Discharged-VAD-implanted-pediatric-patient-receives-successful-heart-transplant-after-eight-months.aspx


Plagiocephaly babies need to be screened and monitored early in life for possible cognitive, motor delays
In a new study, infants averaging six months of age who exhibited positional plagiocephaly (flat head syndrome) had lower scores than typical infants in observational tests used to evaluate cognitive and motor development. Positional or deformational plagiocephaly may occur when external forces shape an infant's skull while it is still soft and malleable, such as extended time spent lying on a hard surface or in one position. This is the first controlled study to suggest that babies who have flattened areas on the back of their heads during the first year of life may be at risk for developmental delay.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100215/Plagiocephaly-babies-need-to-be-screened-and-monitored-early-in-life-for-possible-cognitive-motor-delays.aspx


Hypnosis has potential therapeutic value in children with respiratory disorders
Hypnosis has potential therapeutic value in children with respiratory disorders for alleviating symptoms such as habit cough or unexplained sensations of difficulty breathing and for lessening a child's discomfort during medical procedures.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100215/Hypnosis-has-potential-therapeutic-value-in-children-with-respiratory-disorders.aspx


NNDS, SlateXP raise over $75,000 to help children in partnership with UMPS CARE Charities
The National Network of Digital Schools and SlateXP, in partnership with UMPS CARE Charities, are proud to announce that the 5th Annual UMPS CARE Charities Golf Classic has raised over $75,000 for children in need.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100215/NNDS-SlateXP-raise-over-2475000-to-help-children-in-partnership-with-UMPS-CARE-Charities.aspx


Learning Lab of Brentwood to present free seminar on ADHD in Brentwood
The Learning Lab of Brentwood will present a free seminar, ADHD Kids: Getting Along Socially, on Thursday February 18 from 12:00-1:30 PM at the Maryland Farms YMCA in Brentwood.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100212/Learning-Lab-of-Brentwood-to-present-free-seminar-on-ADHD-in-Brentwood.aspx


United Airlines to deliver teddy bears to kids undergoing cancer treatment across the country
Starting today, United Airlines employees will begin delivering thousands of teddy bears to kids undergoing cancer treatment at hospitals across the country through a partnership with the American Cancer Society® that raised almost 27 million Mileage Plus miles.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100212/United-Airlines-to-deliver-teddy-bears-to-kids-undergoing-cancer-treatment-across-the-country.aspx


Parents often recognize signs of asthma in their children but delay home treatment: Report
Parents of young children with asthma often recognize signs that their child is about to have an asthma attack but delay home treatment until the attack occurs, researchers at Washington University School of Medicine in St. Louis report.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100212/Parents-often-recognize-signs-of-asthma-in-their-children-but-delay-home-treatment-Report.aspx


Measures to tackle school avoidance in children
Children and adolescents who refuse to attend school should not be given doctors' sick notes. In the current issue of Deutsches -rzteblatt International (Dtsch Arztebl Int 2010; 107[4]), child and adolescent psychiatrist Martin Knollmann and colleagues explain the causes of school avoidance and describe measures to tackle the problem.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100212/Measures-to-tackle-school-avoidance-in-children.aspx


First FDA-approved umbilical cord blood stem cells infusion trial in children with cerebral palsy
Medical College of Georgia researchers are conducting the first FDA-approved clinical trial to determine whether an infusion of stem cells from umbilical cord blood can improve the quality of life for children with cerebral palsy.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100212/First-FDA-approved-umbilical-cord-blood-stem-cells-infusion-trial-in-children-with-cerebral-palsy.aspx


FKF receives funds to launch Fragile Kids Partner Program
The Centene Foundation for Quality Healthcare announced today that it has awarded a $35,000 grant to Fragile Kids Foundation, Inc. (FKF), a nonprofit organization based in Atlanta, Ga.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100212/FKF-receives-funds-to-launch-Fragile-Kids-Partner-Program.aspx


Study suggests obesity prevention efforts should begin much earlier
While many adults consider a chubby baby healthy, too many plump infants grow up to be obese teens, saddling them with Type-2 diabetes, elevated cholesterol and high blood pressure, according to an article published this month in the journal Clinical Pediatrics (published by SAGE).
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Study-suggests-obesity-prevention-efforts-should-begin-much-earlier.aspx


Daiichi Sankyo's Benicar receives FDA approval for hypertension treatment in children and adolescents aged 6-16
Daiichi Sankyo, Inc. announced today that the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has approved the hypertension treatment Benicar® (olmesartan medoxomil) for use in children and adolescents 6 to 16 years of age. Benicar was originally approved in 2002 for the treatment of hypertension in adults.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Daiichi-Sankyos-Benicar-receives-FDA-approval-for-hypertension-treatment-in-children-and-adolescents-aged-6-16.aspx


Winter Sports: Tips on proper training, and prevention of injuries and concussions
According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 46 percent of children admitted to trauma centers for winter sports injuries have been diagnosed with a head injury – the majority of them from snowboarding, sledding, skiing, ice skating or ice hockey. Pediatric sports medicine is a growing field and is a direct response to how active today's children are in competitive and recreational sports.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Winter-Sports-Tips-on-proper-training-and-prevention-of-injuries-and-concussions.aspx


Innocence Report calls for new approach to sex ed that respects sovereignty of family
"This report demonstrates the anti-religious, anti-parent, and anti-family bias of Planned Parenthood's approach to children," stated Emmett McGroarty, Director of Preserve Innocence, an initiative of the American Principles Project focused on protecting the innocence of children. Mr. McGroarty's comment referred to a new report from International Planned Parenthood Federation entitled Stand and Deliver: Sex, Health, and Young People in the 21st Century.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Innocence-Report-calls-for-new-approach-to-sex-ed-that-respects-sovereignty-of-family.aspx


Eczema in early childhood may influence behavior and mental health later in life
Eczema in early childhood may influence behavior and mental health later in life. This is a key finding of a prospective birth cohort study to which scientists of Helmholtz Zentrum München contributed.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Eczema-in-early-childhood-may-influence-behavior-and-mental-health-later-in-life.aspx


ALSF commemorates "a decade of standing for hope" by holding high profile lemonade stands
Alex's Lemonade Stand Foundation for Childhood Cancer (ALSF) is commemorating "a decade of standing for hope" by holding a string of high profile lemonade stands, the first taking place at the Pro Bowl and Super Bowl. 2010 marks 10 years since cancer patient Alexandra "Alex" Scott (1996-2004) held her first front yard lemonade stand to find a cure for childhood cancer.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/ALSF-commemorates-a-decade-of-standing-for-hope-by-holding-high-profile-lemonade-stands.aspx


Researchers investigate risk factors for childhood obesity
Both genetics and parents who comfort their infants with food are the focus of a study funded for $1 million by the National Institute of Diabetes and Digestion and Kidney Disease investigating risk factors for childhood obesity.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Researchers-investigate-risk-factors-for-childhood-obesity.aspx


Current research underway to prevent preterm births
Family history, infection and stress all may play a role in raising a woman's risk of having a premature baby - but they don't fully explain why some women give birth too soon and others don't, according to a review article published today in the New England Journal of Medicine.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Current-research-underway-to-prevent-preterm-births.aspx


Preterm birth: Pre-pregnancy obesity and gestational weight gain increase risk
Researchers at Boston University School of Medicine's (BUSM) Slone Epidemiology Center and Boston University School of Public Health (BUSPH) have found that pre-pregnancy obesity and gestational weight gain are associated with an increased risk of preterm birth in African American participants from the Black Women's Health Study. This study currently appears on-line in Epidemiology.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Preterm-birth-Pre-pregnancy-obesity-and-gestational-weight-gain-increase-risk.aspx


New sensory tools for younger children
The recent results of the National Survey of Children's Health showed roughly 1 in 90 US children are affected by Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD). Add to this the gamut of other disorders (Attention Deficit Disorder (ADD/ADHD), Anxiety disorders, Sensory Processing Disorder (SPD), etc.) our children can be faced with, and it isn't surprising that an increasing number of special needs children are in our classrooms.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/New-sensory-tools-for-younger-children.aspx


Eczema can lead to behavioral and psychological problems in children
Eczema in early childhood may influence behavior and mental health later in life. This is a key finding of a prospective birth cohort study to which scientists of Helmholtz Zentrum M-nchen contributed.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Eczema-can-lead-to-behavioral-and-psychological-problems-in-children.aspx


Mental health 'bible' starts revamp with new terminology, diagnoses
The Wall Street Journal: "Mental-health experts wrestling with how to fit temper tantrums, hoarding and even Internet addiction into the current understanding of mental illness are proposing changes to the field's primary reference for diagnoses for the first time in 16 years. The draft revisions of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders—the bible for mental health clinicians and researchers—unveiled Wednesday could have effects that ripple through mental health care."
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100211/Mental-health-bible-starts-revamp-with-new-terminology-diagnoses.aspx


Cardiology 2010 conference focuses on current treatments for children with heart disease
An international group of over 900 medical experts gathers today to discuss the most current treatments for children with heart disease. Affecting about 8 in every 1,000 children, congenital (present at birth) heart disease is the most common birth defect. In its severe forms, it is also the leading cause of death from birth defects in infants.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Cardiology-2010-conference-focuses-on-current-treatments-for-children-with-heart-disease.aspx


Contraceptive sex education and 'empowerment' for ten-year-old children
International Planned Parenthood Foundation's recently released report, "Stand and Deliver: Sex, Health and Young People in the 21st Century," advocates policies that jeopardize the well-being of children's health, the importance of parents and the moral values of our society, Family Research Council said today.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Contraceptive-sex-education-and-empowerment-for-ten-year-old-children.aspx


New research sheds light on the negative impact that food product placements in movies could have on children
New research from the Hood Center for Children and Families at Dartmouth Medical School (DMS) for the first time sheds light on the significant potential negative impact that food product placements in the movies could be having on children.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/New-research-sheds-light-on-the-negative-impact-that-food-product-placements-in-movies-could-have-on-children.aspx


Restricted fetal growth during first trimester linked to maternal high blood pressure and hematocrit levels
Factors such as maternal high blood pressure and high hematocrit levels (the proportion of blood that consists of red blood cells) are associated with a greater likelihood of restricted fetal growth during the first trimester, with restricted growth linked to an increased risk of preterm birth and low birth weight, according to a study in the February 10 issue of JAMA.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Restricted-fetal-growth-during-first-trimester-linked-to-maternal-high-blood-pressure-and-hematocrit-levels.aspx


New campaign against childhood obesity: AACE lauds First Lady's efforts
The American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists (AACE) welcomes and applauds the effort of First Lady Michelle Obama, who announced a new campaign to combat childhood obesity today.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/New-campaign-against-childhood-obesity-AACE-lauds-First-Ladys-efforts.aspx


Exposure to unhealthy food commercials linked to childhood obesity
The association between television viewing and childhood obesity is directly related to children's exposure to commercials that advertise unhealthy foods, according to a new UCLA School of Public Health study published in the American Journal of Public Health.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Exposure-to-unhealthy-food-commercials-linked-to-childhood-obesity.aspx


Measles vaccine does not increase risk of autism in children, reveals Polish study
As a pivotal paper linking childhood vaccinations to autism is discredited, a new study finds no evidence that the measles vaccine—given alone or as part of a combined measles, mumps, and rubella (MMR) vaccine—increases the risk of autism in children. The study appears in The Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal (www.pidj.com), published by Lippincott Williams & Wilkins, a part of Wolters Kluwer Health, a leading provider of information and business intelligence for students, professionals, and institutions in medicine, nursing, allied health, and pharmacy.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Measles-vaccine-does-not-increase-risk-of-autism-in-children-reveals-Polish-study.aspx


Children with depressive symptoms may have greater affinity for sweets, says study
New research from the Monell Center reports that children's response to intense sweet taste is related to both a family history of alcoholism and the child's own self-reports of depression.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Children-with-depressive-symptoms-may-have-greater-affinity-for-sweets-says-study.aspx


Maternal obesity increases offspring's risk of developing inflammation-related disorders
As if there are not enough reasons for obese people to lose weight, a new research report published online in The FASEB Journal (http://www.fasebj.org), adds several more. In a study involving rats, researchers from Duke University found that obesity in mothers causes cellular programming in utero that predisposes offspring to inflammation-related disorders (such as Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, type 2 diabetes, stroke, heart disease, and more) from the day that they are born, regardless of whether or not the offspring are obese themselves.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Maternal-obesity-increases-offsprings-risk-of-developing-inflammation-related-disorders.aspx


Study indicates children's exposure to secondhand smoke has decreased markedly since mid-nineties
The most comprehensive study to date of secondhand smoke exposure among children in England is published today in the journal Addiction. The study, carried out by researchers from the University of Bath's School for Health, reveals that exposure to household secondhand smoke among children aged 4-15 has declined steadily since 1996.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Study-indicates-childrens-exposure-to-secondhand-smoke-has-decreased-markedly-since-mid-nineties.aspx


New filtration process to improve safety and quality of infant formula
Pall Corporation, a global leader in filtration, separation and purification, today introduced a new filtration process that significantly improves the safety and quality of infant formula. The Pall process is engineered to prevent microbial contamination through intensive filtration, while preserving nutritional quality by minimizing the need for repeated heat treatment during manufacturing.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/New-filtration-process-to-improve-safety-and-quality-of-infant-formula.aspx


Acupuncture: An effective pain management therapy for pediatric patients
Doctors at Rush University Medical Center are offering pediatric patients diagnosed with chronic illnesses acupuncture therapy to help ease the pain and negative side effects like nausea, fatigue, and vomiting caused by chronic health conditions and intensive treatments.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Acupuncture-An-effective-pain-management-therapy-for-pediatric-patients.aspx


Drinking milk during pregnancy can protect baby against multiple sclerosis
Drinking milk during pregnancy may help reduce your baby's chances of developing multiple sclerosis (MS) as an adult, according to a preliminary study released today that will be presented at the American Academy of Neurology's 62nd Annual Meeting in Toronto April 10 to April 17, 2010.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Drinking-milk-during-pregnancy-can-protect-baby-against-multiple-sclerosis.aspx


Disney participates in 'Let's Move' campaign to promote nutrition and healthy lifestyles for kids and families
As part of its ongoing effort to promote healthy lifestyles and nutrition for kids and families, Disney today announced that it will develop a program in collaboration with First Lady Michelle Obama supporting "Let's Move," her newly announced campaign to create a healthier generation.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Disney-participates-in-Lete28099s-Move-campaign-to-promote-nutrition-and-healthy-lifestyles-for-kids-and-families.aspx


Six months old infants know when we're "playing" them
A study by York University researchers reveals that infants as young as six months old know when we're "playing" them - and they don't like it.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100210/Six-months-old-infants-know-when-were-playing-them.aspx


AMA supports initiative to combat childhood obesity
"The American Medical Association is pleased to support First Lady Michelle Obama in the Let's Move Campaign. As the nation's largest physician organization, we have long worked to address obesity and are committed to reenergizing our programs and communications this year to focus on children's needs related to obesity prevention and management.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100209/AMA-supports-initiative-to-combat-childhood-obesity.aspx


RWJF announces grant to promote healthy eating and active lifestyle among children and families
The Quantum Foundation is proud to be partners in a grant awarded to the School District of Palm Beach County that will help kids and their parents eat right and get fit.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100209/RWJF-announces-grant-to-promote-healthy-eating-and-active-lifestyle-among-children-and-families.aspx


Whooping cough vaccine may be losing its punch: study
Vaccination programs against whooping cough may not be fully effective because the bacteria that cause the disease have evolved new strains, a new study has found.
http://www.news-medical.net/news/20100209/Whooping-cough-vaccine-may-be-losing-its-punch-study.aspx


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