Tuesday, October 19, 2010

rec.bicycles.racing - 25 new messages in 8 topics - digest

Buzz It
rec.bicycles.racing
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing?hl=en

rec.bicycles.racing@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* Michael Bloomberg has six pairs of loafers - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/6b38a9d3d6f78212?hl=en
* Separated at birth & old farts & a super tour - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/9c72b22928395fb2?hl=en
* UCI Still Looking For A Way Out - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/df29063fec7206f7?hl=en
* $2mil - 13 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/d76912087193475b?hl=en
* Is this fucking acceptable? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/fd4b240405c0d285?hl=en
* Lance Armstrong welcomes his fifth child - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/19545bc56993d904?hl=en
* Max has a sister - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/6dba1e631caa128b?hl=en
* Masters racing - may be a worldwide phenomenon - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1bc14035a6dccb83?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Michael Bloomberg has six pairs of loafers
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/6b38a9d3d6f78212?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 1:38 pm
From: "Steve Freides"


drmofe wrote:
> On Oct 20, 3:24 am, "Steve Freides" <st...@kbnj.com> wrote:
>> RicodJour wrote:
>>> On Oct 18, 12:45 pm, Plano Dude <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Oct 18, 10:04 am, RicodJour <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>> On Oct 17, 9:41 pm, "Steve Freides" <st...@kbnj.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>>> drmofe wrote:
>>>>>>> Is this acceptable?
>>
>>>>>> Yes.
>>
>>>>>> I have six pair of Converse Allstars. Is this acceptable.
>>
>>>>> Even Cipollini couldn't pull that off.
>>
>>>> Forget Cipo. Even Megan Fox can't pull it off.
>>
>>>> http://www.lifechucks.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Megan-Fox-Conver...
>>
>>> I didn't notice any shoes in that picture.
>>
>>> R
>>
>> Mine are low-tops - should have clarified that, my apologies.
>
> The Converse is not always true.

Now you're catching on.

-S-

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Separated at birth & old farts & a super tour
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/9c72b22928395fb2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 2:07 pm
From: William Fred


Fred Flintstein <bob.schwartz@sbcremoveglobal.net> wrote in news:
_pCdnf6hFZFSeSDRnZ2dnUVZ_sudnZ2d@giganews.com:

> Dumbasses,
>
> Allow me to be the first to predict a Contador victory.
>
> Fred Flintstein

I wish I had predicted that you would be first to predict that.

--
Bill Fred


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 9:58 pm
From: "Mike Jacoubowsky"


"Fred Flintstein" <bob.schwartz@sbcremoveglobal.net> wrote in message
news:_pCdnf6hFZFSeSDRnZ2dnUVZ_sudnZ2d@giganews.com...
> Dumbasses,
>
> Allow me to be the first to predict a Contador victory.
>
> Fred Flintstein

If by "victory" you mean a short suspension that will allow him to ride the
'Tour in 2011, but he loses his 2010 title, then yes, I agree. But many
would suggest that's not really a victory at all... that the only true
victory would be losing the 2010 title, plus a two year suspension, allowing
Contador to claim *three* virtual TdF victories in a row. That's a lot less
risky than having to go out there and actually compete for the win, like
Lance did. Greg has shown us the true way.

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 11:09 pm
From: Fredmaster of Brainerd


On Oct 19, 2:07 pm, William Fred <gcn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Fred Flintstein <bob.schwa...@sbcremoveglobal.net> wrote in news:
> _pCdnf6hFZFSeSDRnZ2dnUVZ_sudn...@giganews.com:
>
> > Dumbasses,
>
> > Allow me to be the first to predict a Contador victory.
>
> > Fred Flintstein
>
> I wish I had predicted that you would be first to predict that.

The safe prediction is always to predict what
happened last time.

Maybe we should just get it over with now and predict
that everything that happens in rbr will be a repeat of
what has previously happened.

I assume that this prediction has already been made.

Fredmorlock Ben

==============================================================================
TOPIC: UCI Still Looking For A Way Out
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/df29063fec7206f7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:33 pm
From: Vagina Gorilla

> Fred Flintstein


Dumbass -Scott got a year and most people that know him and know the
story understand it was tainted supplements.

http://www.usantidoping.org/files/active/arbitration_rulings/arbitration_ruling_4_3_2003_moninger.pdf


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 8:17 pm
From: Fred Flintstein


On 10/19/2010 5:33 PM, Vagina Gorilla wrote:
>
>> Fred Flintstein
>
>
> Dumbass -Scott got a year and most people that know him and know the
> story understand it was tainted supplements.
>
> http://www.usantidoping.org/files/active/arbitration_rulings/arbitration_ruling_4_3_2003_moninger.pdf

Dumbass,

You did read that judgment, right? I mean, it's kind of
funny that you would use it to make your point.

I'll save you time. The statements in 2.2.1 through 2.2.3,
he's never explained those, has he?

If you know Scott, please ask him and report back.

Thanks,

Fred Flintstein

PS He made you look stupid, you might want to ask him
about that too.


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 9:54 pm
From: RicodJour


On Oct 19, 11:17 pm, Fred Flintstein
<bob.schwa...@sbcREMOVEglobal.net> wrote:
> On 10/19/2010 5:33 PM, Vagina Gorilla wrote:
>
> >> Fred Flintstein
>
> > Dumbass -Scott got a year and most people that know him and know the
> > story understand it was tainted supplements.
>
> >http://www.usantidoping.org/files/active/arbitration_rulings/arbitrat...
>
> Dumbass,
>
> You did read that judgment, right? I mean, it's kind of
> funny that you would use it to make your point.
>
> I'll save you time. The statements in 2.2.1 through 2.2.3,
> he's never explained those, has he?
>
> If you know Scott, please ask him and report back.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Fred Flintstein
>
> PS He made you look stupid, you might want to ask him
> about that too.

Yeah, I don't know that I'd use that particular PDF in defending a
bro. Basically said there was nothing in the unopened bottles, and
the opened bottle had some unknown substances and metabolites. Maybe
the metabolites came from recycled steroids? Cost saving measure, I'm
sure.

Maybe it's that time of the month for Vanilla Gorilla...

R

==============================================================================
TOPIC: $2mil
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/d76912087193475b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 5:19 pm
From: "Philip W. Moore, Jr."


"Anton Berlin" <truth_88888@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ab161cfa-eb2e-4c4b-9ce3-6fe9d4b57efb@x42g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
> As long as we all agree that Lance is a self-serving cunt only
> interested himself then we can all get along.

It's bidness, bee-atch! What problem do you have with people making any
amount of money that the market will bear? Supply and demand. What are
you, a fucking commie?

== 2 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 5:51 pm
From: Plano Dude


On Oct 19, 7:19 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
> "Anton Berlin" <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:ab161cfa-eb2e-4c4b-9ce3-6fe9d4b57efb@x42g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
>
> > As long as we all agree that Lance is a self-serving cunt only
> > interested himself then we can all get along.
>
> It's bidness, bee-atch!  What problem do you have with people making any
> amount of money that the market will bear?  Supply and demand.  What are
> you, a fucking commie?


Dumbass,

It was discussed that Armstrong received anywhere from $1 to $3
million start money from the Giro in 2009. When you compare the
magnitude of the Giro to that of the TDU, it makes the $2 Aussie money
seem pretty significant.

Second, when Zomegnan wrote Armstong that check, it was from money his
company was earning. Not directly from the pockets of the taxpayers.
Did you miss the part about the South Australian government cutting
public services?


== 3 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 6:59 pm
From: "Philip W. Moore, Jr."

"Plano Dude" <tx.wasteland@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:28463165-2fff-4955-9e3d-f9898acdc5d0@9g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 19, 7:19 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
> "Anton Berlin" <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:ab161cfa-eb2e-4c4b-9ce3-6fe9d4b57efb@x42g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
>
> > As long as we all agree that Lance is a self-serving cunt only
> > interested himself then we can all get along.
>
> It's bidness, bee-atch! What problem do you have with people making any
> amount of money that the market will bear? Supply and demand. What are
> you, a fucking commie?

Did you miss the point about me not giving a shit if Shaquille O'Neal or
Lance Armstrong makes 100 of 100,000 dollars per event? I just don't care.
Contracts are offer and acceptance. Should Lance have said, nah, I'll take
whatever Plano Dude says is fair and reasonable?

Dumbass,

It was discussed that Armstrong received anywhere from $1 to $3
million start money from the Giro in 2009. When you compare the
magnitude of the Giro to that of the TDU, it makes the $2 Aussie money
seem pretty significant.

Second, when Zomegnan wrote Armstong that check, it was from money his
company was earning. Not directly from the pockets of the taxpayers.
Did you miss the part about the South Australian government cutting
public services?

== 4 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 7:27 pm
From: Plano Dude


On Oct 19, 8:59 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
> "Plano Dude" <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:28463165-2fff-4955-9e3d-f9898acdc5d0@9g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 19, 7:19 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
>
> > "Anton Berlin" <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:ab161cfa-eb2e-4c4b-9ce3-6fe9d4b57efb@x42g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > As long as we all agree that Lance is a self-serving cunt only
> > > interested himself then we can all get along.
>
> > It's bidness, bee-atch! What problem do you have with people making any
> > amount of money that the market will bear? Supply and demand. What are
> > you, a fucking commie?
>
> Did you miss the point about me not giving a shit if Shaquille O'Neal or
> Lance Armstrong makes 100 of 100,000 dollars per event?  I just don't care.
> Contracts are offer and acceptance.  Should Lance have said, nah, I'll take
> whatever Plano Dude says is fair and reasonable?
>

Dumbass,

Show where I said or even implied Armstrong should have taken any
other amount.

You're lost. I'm not going to respond to more of your misguided
retorts.


== 5 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 7:29 pm
From: RicodJour


On Oct 19, 8:51 pm, Plano Dude <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Oct 19, 7:19 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
>
> > "Anton Berlin" <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:ab161cfa-eb2e-4c4b-9ce3-6fe9d4b57efb@x42g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > As long as we all agree that Lance is a self-serving cunt only
> > > interested himself then we can all get along.
>
> > It's bidness, bee-atch!  What problem do you have with people making any
> > amount of money that the market will bear?  Supply and demand.  What are
> > you, a fucking commie?
>
> Dumbass,
>
> It was discussed that Armstrong received anywhere from $1 to $3
> million start money from the Giro in 2009. When you compare the
> magnitude of the Giro to that of the TDU, it makes the $2 Aussie money
> seem pretty significant.
>
> Second, when Zomegnan wrote Armstong that check, it was from money his
> company was earning. Not directly from the pockets of the taxpayers.
> Did you miss the part about the South Australian government cutting
> public services?

Are you objecting to the fact that the SA government made a deal
without your approval, or that they apparently hid it from their
constituents? Either way, BFD.

It's pitiful that you feel you need an excuse to rag on someone. It
lowers it from an art form to just bitching on Usenet - which is
slightly lower than bitching in your blog.

R


== 6 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 7:40 pm
From: Plano Dude


On Oct 19, 9:29 pm, RicodJour <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
> On Oct 19, 8:51 pm, Plano Dude <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Oct 19, 7:19 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
>
> > > "Anton Berlin" <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> > >news:ab161cfa-eb2e-4c4b-9ce3-6fe9d4b57efb@x42g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > > As long as we all agree that Lance is a self-serving cunt only
> > > > interested himself then we can all get along.
>
> > > It's bidness, bee-atch!  What problem do you have with people making any
> > > amount of money that the market will bear?  Supply and demand.  What are
> > > you, a fucking commie?
>
> > Dumbass,
>
> > It was discussed that Armstrong received anywhere from $1 to $3
> > million start money from the Giro in 2009. When you compare the
> > magnitude of the Giro to that of the TDU, it makes the $2 Aussie money
> > seem pretty significant.
>
> > Second, when Zomegnan wrote Armstong that check, it was from money his
> > company was earning. Not directly from the pockets of the taxpayers.
> > Did you miss the part about the South Australian government cutting
> > public services?
>
> Are you objecting to the fact that the SA government made a deal
> without your approval, or that they apparently hid it from their
> constituents?  Either way, BFD.
>
> It's pitiful that you feel you need an excuse to rag on someone.  It
> lowers it from an art form to just bitching on Usenet - which is
> slightly lower than bitching in your blog.
>
> R

I have a blog? Awesome! Where is it? Link please.

No. No. No, godammit, no.

My curiosity is, let me make this clear to you and Philip Michael
Thomas over there, the PERCEIVED WORTH OF ARMSTRONG'S PRESENCE VARIOUS
EVENTS.

Holy fuck, do you get it now?


== 7 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 7:43 pm
From: "Philip W. Moore, Jr."

"Plano Dude" <tx.wasteland@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7290b406-5d7d-4139-91a5-0e2bd3c6bb69@r4g2000prj.googlegroups.com...
>My curiosity is, let me make this clear to you and Philip Michael
>Thomas over there, the PERCEIVED WORTH OF ARMSTRONG'S PRESENCE VARIOUS
>EVENTS.

Then just say that. The market bears what the market bears. You just have
penis envy.

== 8 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 7:47 pm
From: Plano Dude


On Oct 19, 9:43 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
> "Plano Dude" <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:7290b406-5d7d-4139-91a5-0e2bd3c6bb69@r4g2000prj.googlegroups.com...
>
> >My curiosity is, let me make this clear to you and Philip Michael
> >Thomas over there, the PERCEIVED WORTH OF ARMSTRONG'S PRESENCE VARIOUS
> >EVENTS.
>
> Then just say that.  The market bears what the market bears.  You just have
> penis envy.

I said the fourth post. You just decided it didn't mean what was
written.

That's a YOU problem.


== 9 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 7:51 pm
From: "Philip W. Moore, Jr."

"Plano Dude" <tx.wasteland@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7752b4d2-0b87-4885-a243-dbdd792e5e09@g18g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 19, 9:43 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
> "Plano Dude" <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:7290b406-5d7d-4139-91a5-0e2bd3c6bb69@r4g2000prj.googlegroups.com...
>
> >My curiosity is, let me make this clear to you and Philip Michael
> >Thomas over there, the PERCEIVED WORTH OF ARMSTRONG'S PRESENCE VARIOUS
> >EVENTS.
>
> Then just say that. The market bears what the market bears. You just have
> penis envy.

I said the fourth post. You just decided it didn't mean what was
written.

That's a YOU problem.
___________

If YOU say that. How much money do you think Lance should give back to make
the deal "fair" and for him to receive what YOU think his appearance fee
should be?

== 10 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 7:52 pm
From: "Philip W. Moore, Jr."

"Plano Dude" <tx.wasteland@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7752b4d2-0b87-4885-a243-dbdd792e5e09@g18g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 19, 9:43 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
> "Plano Dude" <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:7290b406-5d7d-4139-91a5-0e2bd3c6bb69@r4g2000prj.googlegroups.com...
>
> >My curiosity is, let me make this clear to you and Philip Michael
> >Thomas over there, the PERCEIVED WORTH OF ARMSTRONG'S PRESENCE VARIOUS
> >EVENTS.

If you live in Plano, let's just bitch about this over a bike ride.

== 11 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 8:01 pm
From: Plano Dude


On Oct 19, 9:52 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
> "Plano Dude" <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:7752b4d2-0b87-4885-a243-dbdd792e5e09@g18g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 19, 9:43 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
>
> > "Plano Dude" <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:7290b406-5d7d-4139-91a5-0e2bd3c6bb69@r4g2000prj.googlegroups.com...
>
> > >My curiosity is, let me make this clear to you and Philip Michael
> > >Thomas over there, the PERCEIVED WORTH OF ARMSTRONG'S PRESENCE VARIOUS
> > >EVENTS.
>
> If you live in Plano, let's just bitch about this over a bike ride.

Can you ride? I thought your leg or foot was all jacked up from a
mountain bike wreck.


== 12 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 8:25 pm
From: "Philip W. Moore, Jr."

"Plano Dude" <tx.wasteland@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:ccfacf4c-c91d-4cce-8693-58bb06809b31@x4g2000pre.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 19, 9:52 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
> "Plano Dude" <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:7752b4d2-0b87-4885-a243-dbdd792e5e09@g18g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 19, 9:43 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
>
> > "Plano Dude" <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:7290b406-5d7d-4139-91a5-0e2bd3c6bb69@r4g2000prj.googlegroups.com...
>
> > >My curiosity is, let me make this clear to you and Philip Michael
> > >Thomas over there, the PERCEIVED WORTH OF ARMSTRONG'S PRESENCE VARIOUS
> > >EVENTS.
>
> If you live in Plano, let's just bitch about this over a bike ride.

Can you ride? I thought your leg or foot was all jacked up from a
mountain bike wreck.

-----

No, Plano Sports Association basketball game. Ankle/metatarsals are much
mas better. I'm ready to ride. Been on the dirt most of the time lately,
but I wanna get out the Waterford 1200 and ride.

== 13 of 13 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 9:50 pm
From: RicodJour


On Oct 19, 10:40 pm, Plano Dude <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Oct 19, 9:29 pm, RicodJour <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Oct 19, 8:51 pm, Plano Dude <tx.wastel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 19, 7:19 pm, "Philip W. Moore, Jr." <phi...@pwm-law.com> wrote:
>
> > > > "Anton Berlin" <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> > > >news:ab161cfa-eb2e-4c4b-9ce3-6fe9d4b57efb@x42g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > > > As long as we all agree that Lance is a self-serving cunt only
> > > > > interested himself then we can all get along.
>
> > > > It's bidness, bee-atch!  What problem do you have with people making any
> > > > amount of money that the market will bear?  Supply and demand.  What are
> > > > you, a fucking commie?
>
> > > Dumbass,
>
> > > It was discussed that Armstrong received anywhere from $1 to $3
> > > million start money from the Giro in 2009. When you compare the
> > > magnitude of the Giro to that of the TDU, it makes the $2 Aussie money
> > > seem pretty significant.
>
> > > Second, when Zomegnan wrote Armstong that check, it was from money his
> > > company was earning. Not directly from the pockets of the taxpayers.
> > > Did you miss the part about the South Australian government cutting
> > > public services?
>
> > Are you objecting to the fact that the SA government made a deal
> > without your approval, or that they apparently hid it from their
> > constituents?  Either way, BFD.
>
> > It's pitiful that you feel you need an excuse to rag on someone.  It
> > lowers it from an art form to just bitching on Usenet - which is
> > slightly lower than bitching in your blog.
>
>
> I have a blog? Awesome! Where is it? Link please.

I won't do that to you - it sucks. :)~

> No.   No.   No, godammit, no.
>
> My curiosity is, let me make this clear to you and Philip Michael
> Thomas over there, the PERCEIVED WORTH OF ARMSTRONG'S PRESENCE VARIOUS
> EVENTS.

So what do you feel is Armstrong's "correct" worth?

> Holy fuck, do you get it now?

Cite?

R

PS I'm just fucking with you - it's kinda slow around here and I need
a diversion.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Is this fucking acceptable?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/fd4b240405c0d285?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 5:54 pm
From: Norman


On Oct 19, 9:03 am, Scott <hendricks_sc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Oct 18, 10:14 pm, Norman <invasivenor...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Oct 18, 9:58 pm, "derFah...@gmail.com" <derfah...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Millar appears to be on the 2011 model, which has a different brake
> > > setup (scroll down):
>
> > >http://www.slowtwitch.com/Products/Tri_Bike_by_brand/Felt/Felt_s_2011...
>
> > Oh, hooray.  The return of the chainstay brake mounting.
> > There are good reasons why the mountain bike universe
> > gave that up in 1989.
>
> Yes, but those reasons are completely unrelated to the reasons why the
> aero frame universe is going that way now.

Well, the rationalizations* (all caps, bold, underline) that went into
pushing
chainstay-mounted brakes in 1988 were quite different from the real
world
reasons that pretty much everybody stopped doing it within 5 years.
It
was a retarded idea then, and it is a retarded idea now.


*besides selling a silly idea that requires a new frame, in addition
to new
brake hardware, to a bunch of gullible dentists. THAT part is pure
genius.


== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 7:31 pm
From: RicodJour


On Oct 19, 8:54 pm, Norman <invasivenor...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> *besides selling a silly idea that requires a new frame, in addition
> to new
> brake hardware, to a bunch of gullible dentists.  THAT part is pure
> genius.

You are about to be visited by the wrath of the dental twins. If
you've ever seen Marathon Man, you know you should be very, very
worried.

R

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Lance Armstrong welcomes his fifth child
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/19545bc56993d904?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 9:15 pm
From: jwarner1


Richie Nearsen wrote:

> Pretty good, I guess, for a supposed one-balled guy who faked the
> seriousness of his "cancer," shot-up steroids to win numerous "races,"
> lied about the 'roids, and fooled most of the public into believing
> his story was uplifting -- and true!
>
> Will the law ever catch up to him?
>
> [Will an international tribunal ever indict and summon Bush and Cheney
> to answer charges of crimes against humanity?]
>
> http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20101018/en_afp/cyclingusaarmstrong

stupid beyond belief! see a psychiatrist.

I have sent your post to Armstrong. He has done three tours as a bone
marrow
spokesperson here, on his nickle.

Get a life.


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Max has a sister
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/6dba1e631caa128b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 10:01 pm
From: "Mike Jacoubowsky"


"Mark" <msambors@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:f4538fc8-4c76-4188-b1aa-1d6089600021@j18g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 18, 2:56 am, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
wrote:
> http://twitter.com/lancearmstrong/statuses/27710013616
>
> Anybody here a fan of the TV show "Mad Men?" Wonder what Lance thinks of
> Don Draper? Just sayin'...
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReactionBicycles.com
=========
I see Don Draper as a quasi-nihilist who tries to fill the howling
void in the middle of his psyche with affairs. Don doesn't believe in
love: "The reason you haven't felt it is because it doesn't exist.
What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.
You're born alone and you die alone and this world just drops a bunch
of rules on top of you to make you forget those facts. But I never
forget. I'm living like there's no tomorrow, because there isn't
one." I don't know if Lance would agree with this.

Like Don, Lance is trying to maintain a fragile public persona that
provides social benefits to him.

On the other hand, Don has stated many times: "I have a life. And it
only goes in one direction. Forward." If Lance felt the same way, he
shouldn't have done what he did in July 2010...
========

I'm impressed! So who *is* the Don Draper of the cycling world?

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Masters racing - may be a worldwide phenomenon
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1bc14035a6dccb83?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 11:20 pm
From: "Kurgan Gringioni"

"Fred Flintstein" <bob.schwartz@sbcREMOVEglobal.net> wrote in message
news:2e-dnc0uUd41vSfRnZ2dnUVZ_sOdnZ2d@giganews.com...
: On 10/16/2010 4:12 PM, Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
: > "Fred Flintstein" <bob.schwartz@sbcREMOVEglobal.net> wrote in message
news:D9idnRqiYYPcKCTRnZ2dnUVZ_hKdnZ2d@giganews.com...
: >> On 10/16/2010 4:50 AM, Anton Berlin wrote:
: >>> I've been traveling around Italy for the last two weeks and have only
: >>> noticed (besides one what appeared to be a pro racer) older (40+ men)
: >>> riding road bikes for training/fitness. Any time I saw a younger
: >>> rider (training) they were on MTBs.
: >>>
: >>> Today is the Giro Lombardia. Last event of the 2010 UCI. If I see
: >>> McQuiad I will punch him in the face and tell him it's from all of us
: >>> in RBR. I know you'd do the same for me.
: >>
: >>
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/browse_frm/thread/cde3f8c1e33c6cb0/49d041133f7fdeb3
: >>
: >> I'll bet if you stopped into any shop at random and asked about
: >> bike sales to younger riders they would tell you the same thing
: >> Mike would.
: >>
: >> Fred Flintstein
: >
: > It is very discouraging how few young guys have taken up road cycling.
Back in the day the junior fields were as large as any. These days, the
sweet spot in the road bike market is 35-45. Women
: > actually trend a bit wider, picking up the sport/activity in their
mid-20s (I think part of the attraction is that some see it as safer than
jogging).
: >
: > I don't think it's just mountain bikes that have taken away from road
cycling for younger males though. Cycling in general is not the activity for
the younger folk that it used to be, at least not in
: > the US. I think much of the blame goes to traffic congestion around
schools, caused ironically by people driving their kids because they don't
think it's safe to ride with all the cars out there. Plus
: > mandatory helmet laws don't help either. And finally there's a general
sense of paranoia if John or Jane are out of sight, despite the fact that
John & Jane have cell phones now, while when many of us
: > were kids, we'd be completely out of touch from our parents for many
hours at a time.
:
: I've stopped wearing a helmet for the around town riding I
: do. I occasionally get questioned about that, my response
: is that riding a bicycle isn't dangerous. And while I've
: destroyed a helmet or two, I haven't fallen while toodle
: riding since I was a kid.
:
: I'm very aware of the drop off in youth cycling due to
: parental paranoia over the danger. I think our ability to
: assess risk is way out of whack.
:
: I've got a teenager in the house. The odds of her cracking
: her head open are way lopsided that it will happen in a
: car as opposed to on a bike.

Dumbass -

I don't know if I agree with that.

I've got 4 hospital visits due to bike crashes, none from car crashes. Knock
on wood.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

==============================================================================

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8106 Obama's India visit will have tangible results: US

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Obama's India visit will have tangible results: US
http://www.hindustantimes.com/Obama-s-India-visit-will-have-tangible-results-US/Article1-615262.aspx

Indo-Asian News Service
Washington, October 20, 2010

Underscoring the "significance" that US puts on its "important
economic relationship" with India, the White House hopes to have "some
tangible results" from President Barack Obama's visit to India. "Look,
obviously, this is an important relationship," White House Press
Secretary Robert Gibbs told reporters on Tuesday when asked how the
President was preparing for his trip to India in early November in the
midst of a tough election campaign.

"It's an important trip," he said. "Look, just from a viewpoint
economically, we understand ...what we have to do to create jobs, to
grow our exports, to ensure that it just doesn't fall on American
consumers to drive world demand."

"That's a lot of what you'll hear the President talk about on that
trip, and we'll hopefully have some tangible results from it," Gibbs
said.

Noting that Obama had hosted the first state dinner of his
administration in honour of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh last
November, he said: "I think that gives you the degree of understanding
in terms of the significance that this government and this
administration puts on that relationship."

"It's an important economic relationship," Gibbs said. "So the
President is involved in fairly regular meetings with the national
security team to ensure a successful visit not long after the
elections."

At the State Department spokesman Mark Toner did not say whether
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton would be accompanying Obama on his
India trip.

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 ‘GIPA efficient method of responding to HIV/ADIS’

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'GIPA efficient method of responding to HIV/ADIS'
http://www.morungexpress.com/regional/56610.html

morungexpress

Dimapur, October 19 (MExN): The GIPA principle - the Greater
Involvement of People Living with HIV is the answer as it is the
proven backbone of many interventions worldwide.

It is a concept born out of the recognition by programme planners and
implementers, that the involvement of people living with HIV in policy
formulation, service delivery and programme evaluation is an efficient
method of responding to the epidemic. The Paris AIDS Summit in 1994
issued a declaration in which they made a commitment to support "full
involvement" of people living with HIV in the "common response to the
pandemic at all national, regional and global levels". It can be
mentioned here that India was a signatory of the Paris Declaration,
also known as the GIPA declaration, stated a press note issued by NMP+
Mokokchung.

The note also stated: "We hear success stories of western countries in
the response towards HIV/AIDS. And we learn that their success is due
to the implementation of the GIPA concept. GIPA has been understood as
a "model of best practice in the response to HIV/AIDS" because PLHAs
have first-hand experience about treatment, care and support, and
stigma and discrimination associated with HIV/AIDS.

PLHAs understand each other's situation better than anyone and are
often the best to advise one another.

"This experience can be harnessed into a vital component of the
essentials required in the activities associated with HIV/AIDS. Their
participation gives a personal power and immediacy to AIDS."
It also stated that Naga society and organizations involved in the
fight against HIV/AIDS can do serious introspection.

"Do we have enough information about HIV/AIDS and its treatment, which
is the tool to eradicate stigma and discrimination? Do we make it
possible for PLHAs to disclose their status and thus be 'visible'
PLHAs? Does authority at the top engage PLHAs at the decision making
level to profit from the experience of what goes on at the lower
levels? These are only some among many questions we can ask ourselves
to do our bit in the fight against the epidemic. Proper knowledge of
the GIPA principle means that we have taken a huge step in the fight
against HIV and AIDS," the note added

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Gen Y not aware about HIV

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Gen Y not aware about HIV
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/life-style/health-fitness/health/Gen-Y-not-aware-about-HIV/articleshow/6774769.cms

ANI, Oct 19, 2010

Read more: Gen Y not aware about HIV - The Times of India
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/life-style/health-fitness/health/Gen-Y-not-aware-about-HIV/articleshow/6774769.cms#ixzz12s5Y4tZc

It seems generation Y has little understanding of HIV, for new
research has revealed that 45 per cent believe the disease can be
contracted by mosquito bites.

A further 12 per cent of people aged 18-29 years surveyed by Galaxy
research believed that sharing knives, cups and other household items
was a high risk.

While 53 per cent thought HIV was transmissible from blood
transfusion.

"For people aged over 30 who remember the early HIV awareness
campaigns which dispelled many myths, these misconceptions will be
seen as quite alarming," News quoted Dr Roger Garsia, Chair of the NSW
Ministerial Advisory Committee on HIV and STIs, as saying.

Gary Taylor, 32, was diagnosed with HIV three years ago. He said the
misconceptions of younger people and in particular his family made him
feel 'dirty.'

"A lot of my family thought you could catch it from grabbing my fork,
from kissing me or hugging me or using the toilet seat, until I found
out I had HIV, I thought you could catch it that way too," Taylor
said.

"It's really just like living with cancer, you can touch me, you can
hug me, you can drink out of the same cup as me. You're not going to
get HIV unless you have unprotected sex with me."

Most of the people the world over think that AIDS is an advanced state
of HIV infection, and a disease that heterosexuals and children can
acquire.

Taylor said: AIDS is not the same as HIV. HIV is a treatable disease.
I will probably die from old age. AIDS is what you get if you have
left HIV untreated.

"If you don't see HIV in your peer group, you think it's gone away and
therefore you don't need to take any precautions. So people tend to
have more unprotected sex,'' Taylor added.

Read more: Gen Y not aware about HIV - The Times of India
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/life-style/health-fitness/health/Gen-Y-not-aware-about-HIV/articleshow/6774769.cms#ixzz12s5BAHWE

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Lack of sex driving over-50s to divorce

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Lack of sex driving over-50s to divorce
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/life-style/relationships/man-woman/Lack-of-sex-driving-over-50s-to-divorce/articleshow/6773390.cms

ANI, Oct 19, 2010,

Read more: Lack of sex driving over-50s to divorce - The Times of
India
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/life-style/relationships/man-woman/Lack-of-sex-driving-over-50s-to-divorce/articleshow/6773390.cms#ixzz12s4CfGX2

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Eastern India leads the pack in female tobacco users: Survey

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Eastern India leads the pack in female tobacco users: Survey
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Eastern-India-leads-the-pack-in-female-tobacco-users-Survey/articleshow/6776204.cms

Kounteya Sinha, TNN, Oct 20, 2010,

Read more: Eastern India leads the pack in female tobacco users:
Survey - The Times of India
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Eastern-India-leads-the-pack-in-female-tobacco-users-Survey/articleshow/6776204.cms#ixzz12s3xOht8

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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Medarticles book required

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If anybody could help me with the following two books. i need them for my Phd work
Inselbergs 
by Porembski S. , Barthlott W. 
Springer, Hardcover - 2000, ISBN

Inselbergs: Biotic Diversity of Isolated Rock Outcrops in Tropical and Temperate Regions [Hardcover]

S. Porembski (Editor), W. Barthlott (Editor)
  • Hardcover: 524 pages
  • Publisher: Springer; 1 edition (November 27, 2000)
  • Language: English

looking ahead for ur cooperation

regards
manoj

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Someone looks Possessed

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Someone looks Possessed
http://scottystarnes.wordpress.com/2010/10/18/someone-looks-possessed/

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Althouse: "What Is Your American Dream?"

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Althouse: "What Is Your American Dream?"
http://althouse.blogspot.com/2010/10/what-is-your-american-dream.html

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Peace Celebration: Billboard

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Peace Celebration: Billboard
http://peacecelebration.blogspot.com/2010/10/billboard.html

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 CAP News | Morphine Scandal Rocks Vintage Base Ball Team | Satire & Parody

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CAP News | Morphine Scandal Rocks Vintage Base Ball Team | Satire &
Parody
http://www.crystalair.com/story.php?id=200809009

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Young Guns: GOP Misfires

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Young Guns: GOP Misfires
http://www.dccc.org/page/content/younggunscorkboard10132010/

--
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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Territories snared in wage debate

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Territories snared in wage debate
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/oct/18/territories-snared-in-wage-debate/?sms_ss=email&at_xt=4cbe609999568f4e,0

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Pakistan's haven for terror unit irks U.S.

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Pakistan's haven for terror unit irks U.S.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/oct/19/pakistans-haven-for-terror-unit-irks-us/?sms_ss=email&at_xt=4cbe60f22a75b29f,0

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Fox News' 14th anniversary: A reminder of media change

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Fox News' 14th anniversary: A reminder of media change
http://communities.washingtontimes.com/neighborhood/not-your-average-read/2010/oct/10/fox-news-14th-anniversary-media-oreilly/

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Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Guest column: ‘I came to feel it was my civic duty’

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Guest column: 'I came to feel it was my civic duty'
http://communities.washingtontimes.com/neighborhood/young-willing-and-able-angela-hopp/2010/oct/11/guest-column-i-came-feel-it-was-my-civic-duty/

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Judge won't delay ruling on 'don't ask' policy

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Judge won't delay ruling on 'don't ask' policy
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/oct/19/gay-recruits-accepted-warned-of-uncertainty//?sms_ss=email&at_xt=4cbe63665a00f229,0

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Senators seek data on secret U.S.-Russia missile talks

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Senators seek data on secret U.S.-Russia missile talks
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/oct/19/senators-seek-data-secret-us-russia-missile-talks//?sms_ss=email&at_xt=4cbe63e8c2ba974a,0

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Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:8090 Britain to cut troops, delay nuke upgrade

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Britain to cut troops, delay nuke upgrade
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/oct/19/britain-to-cut-troops-delay-nuke-upgrade//?sms_ss=email&at_xt=4cbe63b9a9703461,0

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Re: Medarticles article need

Buzz It
enclosed

anand
http://www.indiasarkarinaukri.com/

On Sat, Oct 9, 2010 at 11:23 AM, pratipal singh <organoactive@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear friends i need this article

I will be thankful if I get it.


13C-based metabolic flux analysis

Nicola Zamboni1, Sarah-Maria Fendt1,2, Martin Rühl1,3 & Uwe Sauer1



Nature Protocols 4, 878 - 892 (2009)
Published online: 21 May 2009 | doi:10.1038/nprot.2009.58

Subject Categories: In silico modeling | Functional analysis

thanking You all

Pratipalsingh

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Re: Medarticles REQ:The Bile Salt Export Pump: Clinical and Experimental Aspects of Genetic and Acquired Cholestatic Liver Disease

Buzz It
sent

anand

On Sun, Oct 10, 2010 at 11:38 PM, john kopsidas <j77.cont@gmail.com> wrote:
If possible, please provide the following:

Semin Liver Dis 2010; 30(2): 125-133
DOI: 10.1055/s-0030-1253222

The Bile Salt Export Pump: Clinical and Experimental Aspects of
Genetic and Acquired Cholestatic Liver Disease

Ping Lam1, Carol J. Soroka1, James L. Boyer1
1 Liver Center, Yale University School of Medicine, New Haven,
Connecticut


https://www.thieme-connect.com/DOI/DOI10.1055/s-0030-1253222
https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=https://www.thieme-connect.com/ejournals/pdf/sld/doi/10.1055/s-0030-1253222.pdf

Thank you in advance,

John K.

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alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets - 25 new messages in 5 topics - digest

Buzz It
alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets?hl=en

alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* Edwards/Holmes/Cotchery/Keller - How do they rate? - 7 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/86c046b32d365e8e?hl=en
* Ok, let's give it a shot - 4 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/3ade27b4eb81e1d7?hl=en
* League will start suspending players for.... - 9 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/56a34289385ca32b?hl=en
* Cimini calling out Schott... - 4 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/8a00fcc1c9584bba?hl=en
* What If We Go To The Super Bowl In Dallas And Sanchez Gets Homesick???? - 1
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/373c06f700c90507?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Edwards/Holmes/Cotchery/Keller - How do they rate?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/86c046b32d365e8e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 1:52 pm
From: Keith Keller


On 2010-10-19, Harlan Lachman <harlan@eeivt.com> wrote:
>
> Imagine how old someone must be who watched Dick Wood QB the team in the
> Polo Grounds.

Triple digits? ;-O

--keith

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== 2 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:17 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 16:23:30 -0400, "yoyodog" <connarchNOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>"buRford" <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>news:78rrb69nld8mdj94d0fjtbbcv29q6uhoh8@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 14:59:28 -0400, "yoyodog" <connarchNOSPAM@yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"buRford" <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>>>news:isorb6hsj4jdf0lpq9btdbrc657pb01ne5@4ax.com...
>>>> On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 11:08:01 -0400, "yoyodog" <connarchNOSPAM@yahoo.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Vous etes Quebecois?
>>>>
>>>> That's a cool story... I woulda said Range, as in I'd be getting a new
>>>> stove, especially
>>>> if I had just woken up ;)
>>>
>>>Oui, Tabarnak! But growing up 100% bilingual in the West Island of
>>>Montreal
>>>requires to also say "Fuck, yeah!"
>>>
>>>
>>
>> I used to go up there a lot (& Quebec City), in my late teens & early 20s.
>> Loved the local stock of femmes... was easy to delude myself that I was
>> actually a
>> sophisticated world traveller, meeting Renaissance women ;)
>
>... and drinkin' lots of Brador I bet ;-)
>

I think it was regular Molson that was buzzing my veins, eh ;)


== 3 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:17 pm
From: graybeard


On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 14:48:45 -0400 buRford <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 11:38:16 -0400, graybeard <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 07:16:17 -0400 buRford <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Mon, 18 Oct 2010 23:32:28 -0400, graybeard <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Reel-to-reel tape? You're not old - you're antediluvian! If you can't
>>>>put it on an iPod, some of the guys here probably have no idea what you
>>>>are talking about ;-)
>>>
>>>
>>>What's an iPod ;)
>>>
>>>If I recall, I also have the Supe year "highlights" broadcast with Merle Harmon, on r-t-r
>>>tape. Got some priceless stuff... like evidence that I've never grown up, was a wiseass
>>>my whole life... some phoney phonecalls I made, &, the night we landed on the Moon,
>>>afterwards, I called a radio talkshow (Leon Lewis or Alex Bennett?).
>>>Something like:
>>>"To add a little levity to the night, what do you call a Moon Monster?"
>>>"I don't know, what?"
>>>"A Moonster."
>>>Promptly cut off the air ;)
>>
>>And rightly so ;-) I recall fondly my own long gone Tanberg deck. No
>>digital editing software, just a trimmer and a box of splices. I used to
>>buy vinyl LP's and play them only once while taping them in real time,
>>then put the LP's away and listen to the tapes. Never got into 8-track
>>cartridges, but I did migrate to cassettes for my car. Nowadays I just
>>buy CD's. I have converted a lot of my 300+ old vinyl LP's to MP3 to
>>carry around on my laptop. I know it's a lossy format, but I figure I
>>can't hear anything below 50Hz or above 12KHz any more anyway.
>
>
>Always enjoyed splicing.
>It's funny, when I was in the film biz, and things were transitioning to editing in video
>vs film, the real old-school editors, were dropping like flies. They didn't like the
>new-fangled electronic editing. They missed the tactile feel of actually cutting
>film/negative. Then when things transitioned from analog video tape to digital, I lost
>interest. I missed all my toys, hundreds of thousands of dollars of electronic gadgets to
>manipulate everything... instead of one desktop computer, with software to do the
>manipulations... and having to transfer the source video onto digital storage arrays.
>Hated it, even though I had assistants to do all the transfers. Even liked the super fast
>scanning through tape, as opposed to instant access. An obsolete rebel was I ;)
>
>Mp3s certainly save space... I always do everything in flac, being the anal former editor,
>where everything had to be perfect. I still can't really enjoy a film, etc, because I see
>& hear every flaw ;)

Speaking of advances in technology in the entertainment business, I have
a close friend, and I love him like a brother, but he's a bit of a
trendoid. Recently he acquired an iPhone, and he was telling me how
great it was to be able to watch a movie whenever he had some time to
kill and could get a signal. Bear in mind that this is the same guy who
last year, after getting a 50" plasma high definition TV and hooking it
up to his 7 channel surround sound system, was squealing about how he
could never watch a movie on a regular sized TV set again. Now he's all
gaga over watching one on a screen the size of a pack of playing cards
with a tiny monaural speaker.
--
graybeard


== 4 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:20 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 16:44:28 -0400, graybeard <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 15:03:26 -0400 Harlan Lachman <harlan@eeivt.com>
>wrote:
>
>>And Sauer played only one dominating year.
>
>Not sure what your definition of dominating is.
>
>1966: 63 receptions (2nd in AFL) / 1079 yds
>1967: 75 receptions (1st in AFL) / 1189 yds
>1968: 66 receptions (2nd in AFL) / 1141 yds
>
>Pro Bowls: 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969
>
>For a guy who only played for 6 six years, those aren't bad credentials.

Interesting that with all the Supe III reunions over the years, I can't remember Sauer
ever showing up. I know he was born in Sheboygen, Wi (a town I still use in jokes)...
maybe living there, he has no use for the big city anymore ;)


== 5 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:28 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 18:17:44 -0400, graybeard <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 14:48:45 -0400 buRford <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 11:38:16 -0400, graybeard <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 07:16:17 -0400 buRford <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Mon, 18 Oct 2010 23:32:28 -0400, graybeard <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Reel-to-reel tape? You're not old - you're antediluvian! If you can't
>>>>>put it on an iPod, some of the guys here probably have no idea what you
>>>>>are talking about ;-)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>What's an iPod ;)
>>>>
>>>>If I recall, I also have the Supe year "highlights" broadcast with Merle Harmon, on r-t-r
>>>>tape. Got some priceless stuff... like evidence that I've never grown up, was a wiseass
>>>>my whole life... some phoney phonecalls I made, &, the night we landed on the Moon,
>>>>afterwards, I called a radio talkshow (Leon Lewis or Alex Bennett?).
>>>>Something like:
>>>>"To add a little levity to the night, what do you call a Moon Monster?"
>>>>"I don't know, what?"
>>>>"A Moonster."
>>>>Promptly cut off the air ;)
>>>
>>>And rightly so ;-) I recall fondly my own long gone Tanberg deck. No
>>>digital editing software, just a trimmer and a box of splices. I used to
>>>buy vinyl LP's and play them only once while taping them in real time,
>>>then put the LP's away and listen to the tapes. Never got into 8-track
>>>cartridges, but I did migrate to cassettes for my car. Nowadays I just
>>>buy CD's. I have converted a lot of my 300+ old vinyl LP's to MP3 to
>>>carry around on my laptop. I know it's a lossy format, but I figure I
>>>can't hear anything below 50Hz or above 12KHz any more anyway.
>>
>>
>>Always enjoyed splicing.
>>It's funny, when I was in the film biz, and things were transitioning to editing in video
>>vs film, the real old-school editors, were dropping like flies. They didn't like the
>>new-fangled electronic editing. They missed the tactile feel of actually cutting
>>film/negative. Then when things transitioned from analog video tape to digital, I lost
>>interest. I missed all my toys, hundreds of thousands of dollars of electronic gadgets to
>>manipulate everything... instead of one desktop computer, with software to do the
>>manipulations... and having to transfer the source video onto digital storage arrays.
>>Hated it, even though I had assistants to do all the transfers. Even liked the super fast
>>scanning through tape, as opposed to instant access. An obsolete rebel was I ;)
>>
>>Mp3s certainly save space... I always do everything in flac, being the anal former editor,
>>where everything had to be perfect. I still can't really enjoy a film, etc, because I see
>>& hear every flaw ;)
>
>Speaking of advances in technology in the entertainment business, I have
>a close friend, and I love him like a brother, but he's a bit of a
>trendoid. Recently he acquired an iPhone, and he was telling me how
>great it was to be able to watch a movie whenever he had some time to
>kill and could get a signal. Bear in mind that this is the same guy who
>last year, after getting a 50" plasma high definition TV and hooking it
>up to his 7 channel surround sound system, was squealing about how he
>could never watch a movie on a regular sized TV set again. Now he's all
>gaga over watching one on a screen the size of a pack of playing cards
>with a tiny monaural speaker.


People like their toys, especially ones they can put in their pocket, I guess.

I love tech, and learn new ones easily, but I always rebel against new ones, as I hate
being told I have to *retire* something useful.
Even working with CDs when they first came out, I stayed with cassettes & didn't buy a CD
player, until my cassette players died. Same with DVDs, etc.
I don't watch much telly, so I still don't have an HD, even though they'd be easier on my
anal eyes ;)


== 6 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 5:19 pm
From: BicketyBam


buRford <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in
news:is1qb6lvstsm0kc7sae4ek6jc8hlnr2jvp@4ax.com:

> On 19 Oct 2010 00:32:28 GMT, BicketyBam <Blowme@joemama.net> wrote:
>
>>"JKConey" <jkconey@verizon.net> wrote in
>>news:i9iokl$86h$1@news.eternal- september.org:
>>
>>>
>>> "BicketyBam" <Blowme@joemama.net> wrote in message
>>> news:Xns9E15C8CAA4047Blowmejoemammanet@209.197.15.254...
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thoughts?
>>>
>>>
>>> Maynard-Sauer-Lammons.... best of all time!
>>>
>>
>>That was long before my time, but I will take your word for it :)
>
>
> Long before your time... hey, I take offense to that... you callin' me
> old??
>
> Those guys were great, but it was such a different era.
> Maynard would probably be broken into numerous parts, if he was hit by
> some of the defenders these days.
> Then again, with the advances in training... who knows.
> I do know Namath would've had a longer, & more productive career...
> but I digress ;)
>

I was bor born in 1967, so technically I was around :)


== 7 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 5:22 pm
From: BicketyBam


Harlan Lachman <harlan@eeivt.com> wrote in
news:harlan-BC9CF0.15014519102010@news60.forteinc.com:

> In article <Xns9E15C8CAA4047Blowmejoemammanet@209.197.15.254>,
> BicketyBam <Blowme@joemama.net> wrote:
>
>> I started watching the Jets in 1986. I know may of you go back long
>> before that. I was thinking about the current Jets receivers
>> (including the TE) and trying to figure out if the Jets have had a
>> better group since I've been a fan. In 1986 they had Toon, Walker and
>> Shuler. How do you think the current group compares to them? Toon had
>> some of the best hands I have ever seen, and Walker was a tremendous
>> deep threat. Shuler was a very good pass catching TE back when TE's
>> usually were known for their blocking. But I think as an overall
>> group, Edwards, Holmes, Cotchery and Keller are more explosive...if
>> not for the fact that Keller is more dangerous than Shuler and we
>> have one extra wideout. That '86 team team did use McNeil as Hector
>> as receivers, but Tomlinson is more than capable.
>>
>> The only other team that I could think of that might be on par was
>> the '98 team with Keyshawn, Cherbet, Ward and Kyle Brady. But I think
>> both the '86 group and the current group were/are better.
>>
>> So unless I missed something, I'd say this is the most explosive set
>> of receivers since the mid 80's. I can't speak for any team before
>> that.
>>
>> Thoughts?
>
> Older Fans would remember that Maynard, Sauer and Lammons were were OK
> but that only that Sauer was a short route runner and Maynard for the
> most part like Moss, a go guy.
>
> This group has not proven itself to me yet. I agree they are better
> run blockers than any group of WR that I remember but Braylon had the
> droppsies and still does not come back for the ball strong, Dustin
> does not consistently beat other teams, and Holmes is too new.
>
> Keysawn Q, Ward and Brady were the most over hyped and over paid
> group. Key was never the elite receiver he thought he was or we
> thought when we wasted the high pick on him. He is not in the same
> league as a Andre Johnson, Fitzgerald, and even Detroit's C Johnson. Q
> was not as dangerous or problematic as Welker and Brady was a wasted
> pick.
>
> I think the best WR this team has had since Dick Wood was the Toon,
> Walker and Shuler group. Albeit, this was in the days where teams only
> needed two WR, but I think Walker was the best WR I remember and Toon
> ran over the middle routes until he got woozy that were the best I
> remember. And, I remember Shuler with the fondness Jint fans remember
> Bavaro but we didn't win the big ones so none of these guys got the
> props (or QB for that matter) that they deserved.
>
> h

I agree that MeShawn was severly overrated. I was happy to see him go.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Ok, let's give it a shot
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/3ade27b4eb81e1d7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 2:16 pm
From: John C TX


X-No-Archive: Yes

> And seriously, finding Holmes down there, and throwing it, was about as brilliant a
> decision as he could of made, at that moment.  Last season, he probably wouldn't have seen
> Holmes, let alone decide to pass it.


b, the poise was incredible. It would have been nice to have someone
open for a 1st down.

yes, that is a criticism of the play calling.

--


== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:07 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 15:14:59 -0400, Harlan Lachman <harlan@eeivt.com> wrote:

>In article <ehkpb6p1km8ergsn1aqudhda32dosm8anp@4ax.com>,
> buRford <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>
>> As far as whatever else I said, I am speaking only of the Jets, & what I want
>> to see from
>> them. No other team is part of the equation. If we're taking care of our
>> own business, I
>> could care less about what other teams, can or can't do.
>
>At this point, if we win all the rest of our games, you'd be right.
>

That's my plan.


== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:13 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 14:16:08 -0700 (PDT), John C TX <johnctxjets@gmail.com> wrote:

>X-No-Archive: Yes
>
>> And seriously, finding Holmes down there, and throwing it, was about as brilliant a
>> decision as he could of made, at that moment.  Last season, he probably wouldn't have seen
>> Holmes, let alone decide to pass it.
>
>
>b, the poise was incredible. It would have been nice to have someone
>open for a 1st down.
>
>yes, that is a criticism of the play calling.

From what Cimini is now saying, a first down play was never called.
It was an all hail-mary, all the time playcall, with no outlet or other options.
Just for that alone, our beloved OC should be sent packin', especially since Sanchez has
very little accuracy on long passes. That pass to Holmes, though, was probably his nicest
long one of the season, although it was a tad underthrown (worked out well for the Jets).


== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 4:36 pm
From: Tutor


On Oct 19, 6:13 pm, buRford <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 14:16:08 -0700 (PDT), John C TX <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >X-No-Archive: Yes
>
> >> And seriously, finding Holmes down there, and throwing it, was about as brilliant a
> >> decision as he could of made, at that moment.  Last season, he probably wouldn't have seen
> >> Holmes, let alone decide to pass it.
>
> >b, the poise was incredible.   It would have been nice to have someone
> >open for a 1st down.
>
> >yes, that is a criticism of the play calling.
>
> From what Cimini is now saying, a first down play was never called.
> It was an all hail-mary, all the time playcall, with no outlet or other options.
> Just for that alone, our beloved OC should be sent packin', especially since Sanchez has
> very little accuracy on long passes.  That pass to Holmes, though, was probably his nicest
> long one of the season, although it was a tad underthrown (worked out well for the Jets).

THat's not what Rex said at the presser. Go back and listen. Either
Cimini's full of it or Rex was dishonest or ignorant of what Schott
called.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: League will start suspending players for....
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/56a34289385ca32b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 9 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 2:40 pm
From: MZ


On 10/19/2010 4:26 PM, Michael wrote:
> On Oct 19, 3:51 pm, MZ<m...@nospam.void> wrote:
>> On 10/19/2010 3:24 PM, Harlan Lachman wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> In article<6tednR8ox7y_NyDRnZ2dnUVZ_oidn...@giganews.com>,
>>> "papa.carl44"<papadotc...@nospamverizon.net> wrote:
>>
>>>> "Michael"<mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:dc12b00b-19c7-4d1b-8c55-5308cbfb2e94@t8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
>>>>> devastating hits ??? Are you kidding me ???
>>
>>>>> It will be a foul to light another guy up ???
>>
>>>>> What exactly is wrong with a devastating hit ??? This is not "helmet
>>>>> to helmet". This is a new item that they are introducing. Are you
>>>>> not supposed to lay devastating hits on the other players ??? They are
>>>>> talking about changing the game. Why not just put a red shirt and
>>>>> flags on the players ???
>>
>>>> There is only one rational answer. Over the last couple of decades, maybe
>>>> even less than that, the size and speed of the players has gotten way out of
>>>> hand. You simply can not play the game as we know and understand it with
>>>> guys this big and not have "devastating" results. If they had ever done
>>>> anything about steroids in the beginning some of this would not be
>>>> happening. We could have a lot of taller players who did not approcach 400
>>>> pounds. The "bigger, faster, stronger revolution" seemed like a great idea
>>>> and it was not thought out very well, now they are reaping the results of
>>>> those decisions. I don't see any way around this at all. Either they will
>>>> change the game, or someone will get killed. This is very interesting if
>>>> you view it from a perspective of social change. Again, I suggest a good
>>>> read, "How Football Explains America" by Sal Palantonio.
>>
>>> I urge you both to listen to the Mike and Mike in the morning highlights.
>>
>>> The league is out of its mind. There are no plans to distinguish between
>>> intent and an offensive player repositioning himself (e.g., ducking).
>>> There is no distinction between a helmet to helmet launching by the Pats
>>> Brandon M, and the shoulder of Leonhard.
>>
>>> Worse, officials are encouraged to throw players out of the game at the
>>> time of infringement. Can you imagine Leonhard taken out of the game for
>>> a bad call.
>>
>>> Golic was not a happy camper and if you listen to the sections by M Hoge
>>> and Carter and then listen to the section with the league's Anderson you
>>> will get a sense of how deeply out of touch the NFL is and how (bad)
>>> officiating will become even more likely to determine winners and losers
>>> and playoff teams.
>>
>>> harlan
>>
>> Sometimes the difference between a clean shoulder and a dirty helmet is
>> bad aim. Or geometry.
>>
>> I'm in the minority that thinks players already avoid leading with the
>> crown of their helmets, generally. Paralysis is worse than suspensions,
>> so there's already a good reason for them not to do it. I don't buy
>> that players are going out there trying to injure fellow players.
>
> WTF ??? please go watch some highlights of Chuck Ceicel, Tatum,
> Atwater, Concrete Charlie, Night Train, etc and tell me that are not
> interested in causing injury

Never heard of 'em. :p Welcome to this century, Michael. Or, as I
call it, the "it's just business, man" era of the NFL.


== 2 of 9 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 2:47 pm
From: MZ


On 10/19/2010 4:30 PM, John C TX wrote:
> X-No-Archive: Yes
>
>> How, exactly, does one define "blatant" and "egregious"? Even the best
>> officials couldn't be able to pick those out.
>
> If the refs catch it they flag him. That is what happened, correct?
>
> That video is tough to find online but I saw it on TV.
>>
>> Was Meriweather trying to intentionally hurt (his friend) Todd Heap? Or
>> was he just trying to make a big hit (like the one Chung made earlier
>> which directly caused an incompletion on a key 3rd down)?
>
> I didn't see the game. I saw the clip once so I didn't see what Chung
> did.
>
> It doesn't matter if intentions were not to hurt him his actions did
> and did it illegally. What I saw from Merriwaether was foul play. He
> he could have hit him with his shoulder. He could have avoided the
> head.
>
>> I'm with Michael on this. No matter how you slice it, it's bad for
>> football. Good for player safety? Maybe. But I think at some point,
>> we all have to sit down and come to grips with the fact that football is
>> a violent sport and lots of these guys are going to have long lasting
>> effects and there's very little that can be done about it without
>> destroying the game.
>
> How are they destroying the game by enforcing the current rules? Both
> Robinson& Merriweather's hit were dirty.

Dirty? Give me a break. Careless, possibly. It hasn't seemed to occur
to anyone here that Meriweather just isn't a very good player, and he's
a notoriously shitty tackler who's been benched and is trying to add a
physical dimension to his game but doesn't know how. But "dirty"
implies that you're trying to do harm. I don't buy it. Especially when
you consider that the two guys in question are friends and hang out off
the field.

Fans are drama queens. Everybody watches too much WWF. They think guys
are going to hit other guys with steel chairs when the ref turns his
back. Players will make mistakes...all the time, and hopefully
tightening up certain rules can help keep them from making some
mistakes. But the problem I see is that the NFL thinks that they can
eradicate something, and they can't. And the game will suffer in their
quest to do so.


== 3 of 9 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 2:59 pm
From: Ron


On Oct 19, 5:40 pm, MZ <m...@nospam.void> wrote:
> On 10/19/2010 4:26 PM, Michael wrote:
>
> > WTF ??? please go watch some highlights of Chuck Ceicel, Tatum,
> > Atwater, Concrete Charlie, Night Train, etc  and tell me that are not
> > interested in causing injury
>
> Never heard of 'em.  :p  Welcome to this century, Michael.  Or, as I
> call it, the "it's just business, man" era of the NFL.

You've never of Steve Atwater or Jack Tatum? What about Lester Haynes,
Ronnie Lott or John Lynch? All big hitters that played in the
secondary.

== 4 of 9 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:22 pm
From: Michael


On Oct 19, 5:40 pm, MZ <m...@nospam.void> wrote:
> On 10/19/2010 4:26 PM, Michael wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 19, 3:51 pm, MZ<m...@nospam.void>  wrote:
> >> On 10/19/2010 3:24 PM, Harlan Lachman wrote:
>
> >>> In article<6tednR8ox7y_NyDRnZ2dnUVZ_oidn...@giganews.com>,
> >>>    "papa.carl44"<papadotc...@nospamverizon.net>    wrote:
>
> >>>> "Michael"<mjd1...@verizon.net>    wrote in message
> >>>>news:dc12b00b-19c7-4d1b-8c55-5308cbfb2e94@t8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> >>>>> devastating hits ???  Are you kidding me ???
>
> >>>>> It will be a foul to light another guy up ???
>
> >>>>> What exactly is wrong with a devastating hit ??? This is not "helmet
> >>>>> to helmet".  This is a new item that they are introducing.  Are you
> >>>>> not supposed to lay devastating hits on the other players ??? They are
> >>>>> talking about changing the game.  Why not just put a red shirt and
> >>>>> flags on the players ???
>
> >>>> There is only one rational answer.  Over the last couple of decades, maybe
> >>>> even less than that, the size and speed of the players has gotten way out of
> >>>> hand.  You simply can not play the game as we know and understand it with
> >>>> guys this big and not have "devastating" results.  If they had ever done
> >>>> anything about steroids in the beginning some of this would not be
> >>>> happening.  We could have a lot of taller players who did not approcach 400
> >>>> pounds.  The "bigger, faster, stronger revolution" seemed like a great idea
> >>>> and it was not thought out very well, now they are reaping the results of
> >>>> those decisions.  I don't see any way around this at all.  Either they will
> >>>> change the game, or someone will get killed.  This is very interesting if
> >>>> you view it from a perspective of social change.  Again, I suggest a good
> >>>> read, "How Football Explains America" by Sal Palantonio.
>
> >>> I urge you both to listen to the Mike and Mike in the morning highlights.
>
> >>> The league is out of its mind. There are no plans to distinguish between
> >>> intent and an offensive player repositioning himself (e.g., ducking).
> >>> There is no distinction between a helmet to helmet launching by the Pats
> >>> Brandon M, and the shoulder of Leonhard.
>
> >>> Worse, officials are encouraged to throw players out of the game at the
> >>> time of infringement. Can you imagine Leonhard taken out of the game for
> >>> a bad call.
>
> >>> Golic was not a happy camper and if you listen to the sections by M Hoge
> >>> and Carter and then listen to the section with the league's Anderson you
> >>> will get a sense of how deeply out of touch the NFL is and how (bad)
> >>> officiating will become even more likely to determine winners and losers
> >>> and playoff teams.
>
> >>> harlan
>
> >> Sometimes the difference between a clean shoulder and a dirty helmet is
> >> bad aim.  Or geometry.
>
> >> I'm in the minority that thinks players already avoid leading with the
> >> crown of their helmets, generally.  Paralysis is worse than suspensions,
> >> so there's already a good reason for them not to do it.  I don't buy
> >> that players are going out there trying to injure fellow players.
>
> > WTF ??? please go watch some highlights of Chuck Ceicel, Tatum,
> > Atwater, Concrete Charlie, Night Train, etc  and tell me that are not
> > interested in causing injury
>
> Never heard of 'em.  :p  Welcome to this century, Michael.  Or, as I
> call it, the "it's just business, man" era of the NFL.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

ray lewis ??? he's not trying to ko people ??? dunta robinson ??? no
intent there ???


== 5 of 9 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:27 pm
From: Michael


On Oct 19, 5:47 pm, MZ <m...@nospam.void> wrote:
> On 10/19/2010 4:30 PM, John C TX wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > X-No-Archive: Yes
>
> >> How, exactly, does one define "blatant" and "egregious"?  Even the best
> >> officials couldn't be able to pick those out.
>
> > If the refs catch it they flag him.  That is what happened, correct?
>
> > That video is tough to find online but I saw it on TV.
>
> >> Was Meriweather trying to intentionally hurt (his friend) Todd Heap?  Or
> >> was he just trying to make a big hit (like the one Chung made earlier
> >> which directly caused an incompletion on a key 3rd down)?
>
> > I didn't see the game.  I saw the clip once so I didn't see what Chung
> > did.
>
> > It doesn't matter if intentions were not to hurt him his actions did
> > and did it illegally. What I saw from Merriwaether was foul play.  He
> > he could have hit him with his shoulder.  He could have avoided the
> > head.
>
> >> I'm with Michael on this.  No matter how you slice it, it's bad for
> >> football.  Good for player safety?  Maybe.  But I think at some point,
> >> we all have to sit down and come to grips with the fact that football is
> >> a violent sport and lots of these guys are going to have long lasting
> >> effects and there's very little that can be done about it without
> >> destroying the game.
>
> > How are they destroying the game by enforcing the current rules?  Both
> > Robinson&  Merriweather's hit were dirty.
>
> Dirty?  Give me a break.  Careless, possibly.  It hasn't seemed to occur
> to anyone here that Meriweather just isn't a very good player, and he's
> a notoriously shitty tackler who's been benched and is trying to add a
> physical dimension to his game but doesn't know how.  But "dirty"
> implies that you're trying to do harm.  I don't buy it.  Especially when
> you consider that the two guys in question are friends and hang out off
> the field.
>
> Fans are drama queens.  Everybody watches too much WWF.  They think guys
> are going to hit other guys with steel chairs when the ref turns his
> back.  Players will make mistakes...all the time, and hopefully
> tightening up certain rules can help keep them from making some
> mistakes.  But the problem I see is that the NFL thinks that they can
> eradicate something, and they can't.  And the game will suffer in their
> quest to do so.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

i still think they should let players use metal pipes...


== 6 of 9 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:30 pm
From: MZ


On 10/19/2010 5:59 PM, Ron wrote:
> On Oct 19, 5:40 pm, MZ<m...@nospam.void> wrote:
>> On 10/19/2010 4:26 PM, Michael wrote:
>>
>>> WTF ??? please go watch some highlights of Chuck Ceicel, Tatum,
>>> Atwater, Concrete Charlie, Night Train, etc and tell me that are not
>>> interested in causing injury
>>
>> Never heard of 'em. :p Welcome to this century, Michael. Or, as I
>> call it, the "it's just business, man" era of the NFL.
>
> You've never of Steve Atwater or Jack Tatum? What about Lester Haynes,
> Ronnie Lott or John Lynch? All big hitters that played in the
> secondary.
>

You didn't see the emoticon?


== 7 of 9 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:31 pm
From: MZ


On 10/19/2010 6:22 PM, Michael wrote:
> On Oct 19, 5:40 pm, MZ<m...@nospam.void> wrote:
>> On 10/19/2010 4:26 PM, Michael wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Oct 19, 3:51 pm, MZ<m...@nospam.void> wrote:
>>>> On 10/19/2010 3:24 PM, Harlan Lachman wrote:
>>
>>>>> In article<6tednR8ox7y_NyDRnZ2dnUVZ_oidn...@giganews.com>,
>>>>> "papa.carl44"<papadotc...@nospamverizon.net> wrote:
>>
>>>>>> "Michael"<mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:dc12b00b-19c7-4d1b-8c55-5308cbfb2e94@t8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>>> devastating hits ??? Are you kidding me ???
>>
>>>>>>> It will be a foul to light another guy up ???
>>
>>>>>>> What exactly is wrong with a devastating hit ??? This is not "helmet
>>>>>>> to helmet". This is a new item that they are introducing. Are you
>>>>>>> not supposed to lay devastating hits on the other players ??? They are
>>>>>>> talking about changing the game. Why not just put a red shirt and
>>>>>>> flags on the players ???
>>
>>>>>> There is only one rational answer. Over the last couple of decades, maybe
>>>>>> even less than that, the size and speed of the players has gotten way out of
>>>>>> hand. You simply can not play the game as we know and understand it with
>>>>>> guys this big and not have "devastating" results. If they had ever done
>>>>>> anything about steroids in the beginning some of this would not be
>>>>>> happening. We could have a lot of taller players who did not approcach 400
>>>>>> pounds. The "bigger, faster, stronger revolution" seemed like a great idea
>>>>>> and it was not thought out very well, now they are reaping the results of
>>>>>> those decisions. I don't see any way around this at all. Either they will
>>>>>> change the game, or someone will get killed. This is very interesting if
>>>>>> you view it from a perspective of social change. Again, I suggest a good
>>>>>> read, "How Football Explains America" by Sal Palantonio.
>>
>>>>> I urge you both to listen to the Mike and Mike in the morning highlights.
>>
>>>>> The league is out of its mind. There are no plans to distinguish between
>>>>> intent and an offensive player repositioning himself (e.g., ducking).
>>>>> There is no distinction between a helmet to helmet launching by the Pats
>>>>> Brandon M, and the shoulder of Leonhard.
>>
>>>>> Worse, officials are encouraged to throw players out of the game at the
>>>>> time of infringement. Can you imagine Leonhard taken out of the game for
>>>>> a bad call.
>>
>>>>> Golic was not a happy camper and if you listen to the sections by M Hoge
>>>>> and Carter and then listen to the section with the league's Anderson you
>>>>> will get a sense of how deeply out of touch the NFL is and how (bad)
>>>>> officiating will become even more likely to determine winners and losers
>>>>> and playoff teams.
>>
>>>>> harlan
>>
>>>> Sometimes the difference between a clean shoulder and a dirty helmet is
>>>> bad aim. Or geometry.
>>
>>>> I'm in the minority that thinks players already avoid leading with the
>>>> crown of their helmets, generally. Paralysis is worse than suspensions,
>>>> so there's already a good reason for them not to do it. I don't buy
>>>> that players are going out there trying to injure fellow players.
>>
>>> WTF ??? please go watch some highlights of Chuck Ceicel, Tatum,
>>> Atwater, Concrete Charlie, Night Train, etc and tell me that are not
>>> interested in causing injury
>>
>> Never heard of 'em. :p Welcome to this century, Michael. Or, as I
>> call it, the "it's just business, man" era of the NFL.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> ray lewis ??? he's not trying to ko people ??? dunta robinson ??? no
> intent there ???

KO people, or injure them?

It's one thing to deliver a crushing blow (which every single player on
the field should be trying to do, btw). It's another thing to deliver a
cheap shot.


== 8 of 9 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:35 pm
From: Michael


On Oct 19, 6:31 pm, MZ <m...@nospam.void> wrote:
> On 10/19/2010 6:22 PM, Michael wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 19, 5:40 pm, MZ<m...@nospam.void>  wrote:
> >> On 10/19/2010 4:26 PM, Michael wrote:
>
> >>> On Oct 19, 3:51 pm, MZ<m...@nospam.void>    wrote:
> >>>> On 10/19/2010 3:24 PM, Harlan Lachman wrote:
>
> >>>>> In article<6tednR8ox7y_NyDRnZ2dnUVZ_oidn...@giganews.com>,
> >>>>>     "papa.carl44"<papadotc...@nospamverizon.net>      wrote:
>
> >>>>>> "Michael"<mjd1...@verizon.net>      wrote in message
> >>>>>>news:dc12b00b-19c7-4d1b-8c55-5308cbfb2e94@t8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> >>>>>>> devastating hits ???  Are you kidding me ???
>
> >>>>>>> It will be a foul to light another guy up ???
>
> >>>>>>> What exactly is wrong with a devastating hit ??? This is not "helmet
> >>>>>>> to helmet".  This is a new item that they are introducing.  Are you
> >>>>>>> not supposed to lay devastating hits on the other players ??? They are
> >>>>>>> talking about changing the game.  Why not just put a red shirt and
> >>>>>>> flags on the players ???
>
> >>>>>> There is only one rational answer.  Over the last couple of decades, maybe
> >>>>>> even less than that, the size and speed of the players has gotten way out of
> >>>>>> hand.  You simply can not play the game as we know and understand it with
> >>>>>> guys this big and not have "devastating" results.  If they had ever done
> >>>>>> anything about steroids in the beginning some of this would not be
> >>>>>> happening.  We could have a lot of taller players who did not approcach 400
> >>>>>> pounds.  The "bigger, faster, stronger revolution" seemed like a great idea
> >>>>>> and it was not thought out very well, now they are reaping the results of
> >>>>>> those decisions.  I don't see any way around this at all.  Either they will
> >>>>>> change the game, or someone will get killed.  This is very interesting if
> >>>>>> you view it from a perspective of social change.  Again, I suggest a good
> >>>>>> read, "How Football Explains America" by Sal Palantonio.
>
> >>>>> I urge you both to listen to the Mike and Mike in the morning highlights.
>
> >>>>> The league is out of its mind. There are no plans to distinguish between
> >>>>> intent and an offensive player repositioning himself (e.g., ducking).
> >>>>> There is no distinction between a helmet to helmet launching by the Pats
> >>>>> Brandon M, and the shoulder of Leonhard.
>
> >>>>> Worse, officials are encouraged to throw players out of the game at the
> >>>>> time of infringement. Can you imagine Leonhard taken out of the game for
> >>>>> a bad call.
>
> >>>>> Golic was not a happy camper and if you listen to the sections by M Hoge
> >>>>> and Carter and then listen to the section with the league's Anderson you
> >>>>> will get a sense of how deeply out of touch the NFL is and how (bad)
> >>>>> officiating will become even more likely to determine winners and losers
> >>>>> and playoff teams.
>
> >>>>> harlan
>
> >>>> Sometimes the difference between a clean shoulder and a dirty helmet is
> >>>> bad aim.  Or geometry.
>
> >>>> I'm in the minority that thinks players already avoid leading with the
> >>>> crown of their helmets, generally.  Paralysis is worse than suspensions,
> >>>> so there's already a good reason for them not to do it.  I don't buy
> >>>> that players are going out there trying to injure fellow players.
>
> >>> WTF ??? please go watch some highlights of Chuck Ceicel, Tatum,
> >>> Atwater, Concrete Charlie, Night Train, etc  and tell me that are not
> >>> interested in causing injury
>
> >> Never heard of 'em.  :p  Welcome to this century, Michael.  Or, as I
> >> call it, the "it's just business, man" era of the NFL.- Hide quoted text -
>
> >> - Show quoted text -
>
> > ray lewis ??? he's not trying to ko people ??? dunta robinson ??? no
> > intent there ???
>
> KO people, or injure them?
>
> It's one thing to deliver a crushing blow (which every single player on
> the field should be trying to do, btw).  It's another thing to deliver a
> cheap shot.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

a good solid club or metal pipe would really add some spice to the
game...

== 9 of 9 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:46 pm
From: "papa.carl44"

"MZ" <mark@nospam.void> wrote in message
news:4uednYPQWfuXjyPRnZ2dnUVZ5hadnZ2d@giganews.com...
> On 10/19/2010 4:30 PM, John C TX wrote:
>> X-No-Archive: Yes
>>
>>> How, exactly, does one define "blatant" and "egregious"? Even the best
>>> officials couldn't be able to pick those out.
>>
>> If the refs catch it they flag him. That is what happened, correct?
>>
>> That video is tough to find online but I saw it on TV.
>>>
>>> Was Meriweather trying to intentionally hurt (his friend) Todd Heap? Or
>>> was he just trying to make a big hit (like the one Chung made earlier
>>> which directly caused an incompletion on a key 3rd down)?
>>
>> I didn't see the game. I saw the clip once so I didn't see what Chung
>> did.
>>
>> It doesn't matter if intentions were not to hurt him his actions did
>> and did it illegally. What I saw from Merriwaether was foul play. He
>> he could have hit him with his shoulder. He could have avoided the
>> head.
>>
>>> I'm with Michael on this. No matter how you slice it, it's bad for
>>> football. Good for player safety? Maybe. But I think at some point,
>>> we all have to sit down and come to grips with the fact that football is
>>> a violent sport and lots of these guys are going to have long lasting
>>> effects and there's very little that can be done about it without
>>> destroying the game.
>>
>> How are they destroying the game by enforcing the current rules? Both
>> Robinson& Merriweather's hit were dirty.
>
> Dirty? Give me a break. Careless, possibly. It hasn't seemed to occur
> to anyone here that Meriweather just isn't a very good player, and he's a
> notoriously shitty tackler who's been benched and is trying to add a
> physical dimension to his game but doesn't know how. But "dirty" implies
> that you're trying to do harm. I don't buy it. Especially when you
> consider that the two guys in question are friends and hang out off the
> field.
>
> Fans are drama queens. Everybody watches too much WWF. They think guys
> are going to hit other guys with steel chairs when the ref turns his back.
> Players will make mistakes...all the time, and hopefully tightening up
> certain rules can help keep them from making some mistakes. But the
> problem I see is that the NFL thinks that they can eradicate something,
> and they can't. And the game will suffer in their quest to do so.

Well said...and the League is pandering to people who do not remotely
understand the game. Anybody who thinks you can control these hits
completely has NEVER played the game to any extent.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cimini calling out Schott...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/8a00fcc1c9584bba?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:07 pm
From: buRford


Cimini's always covering Schott's derriere, & has never said a bad word about him, so this
is kind of interesting coming from him.
I haven't watched the game again... I thought someone had posted that the original
playcall, was a short pass to the first down marker, or something similar. Cimini's an
ass, but even so, if what he's saying is true, my great esteem for Schott has really taken
a hit. Someone who recorded the game... please tell me Cimini is wrong!


Tuesday, October 19, 2010
Jets win on ill-conceived play
By Rich Cimini

If you're a New York Jets fan, it's a case of, "All's well that ends well." But take a
closer look at the Mile High Miracle --Renaldo Hill's 46-yard pass-interference penalty on
Santonio Holmes -- and you will see it wasn't a well-designed play by the Jets.

On a fourth-and-6 from the Denver Broncos' 48, the Jets sent four receivers on vertical
routes -- Holmes on the backside, with Braylon Edwards, Jerricho Cotchery and Dustin
Keller in "trips" to the right. After studying the replay, a revelation: There was no
safety valve because LaDainian Tomlinson stayed in to block.

As it turned out, Tomlinson probably didn't have to stay in to block because the Broncos
rushed only four, with a fifth coming on a delayed blitz. That left six blocking five.
With four receivers downfield, and no check-down options, Mark Sanchez had no choice but
to heave it. There was no escape route. If he had tried to run, he would've been dropped
immediately. It was nice of Rex Ryan to praise Sanchez for having the presence of mind to
throw it deep, but, really, what else was there to do?

The officials made the right call -- it was pass interference -- an utterly dumb play by
Hill. If the pass had fallen incomplete, fans would be complaining about Brian
Schottenheimer's play call in that situation. The Jets should've had a receiver in the
short to intermediate range -- a "sticks" option -- but they took the all-or-nothing
approach. Afterward, Sanchez said it best: "We stole a win."

Other thoughts and observations after breaking down the tape:

HAVING A BLAST: On Tomlinson's game-winning TD run, moments after the pass interference,
he received nice blocks from FB Tony Richardson and LG Matt Slauson. It was the Jets'
"Blast" running play, their bread-and-butter in short yardage. Slauson blew open a huge
hole, a nice way to end a play that almost started with disaster. He got his feet tangled
with Sanchez, who stumbled as he pulled away from center. Some Denver defenders appeared
to let Tomlinson score on purpose, but coach Josh McDaniels said that wasn't the case.
Just soft defense, I suppose.

STRETCH MARKS: On Tomlinson's 20-yard TD, the key blocks were thrown by rookie FB John
Conner and LT D'Brickashaw Ferguson. This was a vintage "stretch" play to the left.
Conner, in an off-set I, took out Mr. Interference, Hill. (Not a wonderful couple of plays
there for Hill.) Ferguson got to the second level and did a nice job of walling off LB
Mario Haggan. Ferguson, in case you haven't noticed, has been outstanding over the last
four games.

NOT USING YOUR HEAD: That was a terrible personal-foul call on S Jim Leonhard, who was
flagged for a helmet-to-helmet hit on WR Brandon Lloyd. He led with his right shoulder,
not his head. His helmet may have grazed Lloyd's helmet in an incidental manner, but it's
clear that Leonhard's shoulder delivered the brunt of the hit. As everybody knows, the
league is cracking down on shots to the head. Leonhard said he would appeal a fine.

PACKING A WALLOP: CB Darrelle Revis didn't look like a guy with a cranky hamstring when he
blew up WR Eddie Royal in the third quarter, exploding into Royal to break up a short
pass. Fans have been getting on Revis for his performance -- he allowed four completions
for 66 yards, including a TD -- but he really didn't play that badly. With an extra week
to rest during the bye, he should, in theory, be 100% for the Green Bay Packers.

OOPS: By the way, the touchdown he allowed -- 17 yards to Demaryius Thomas -- should've
been challenged by the Jets. He bobbled and didn't get both feet down.

TWIN PICKS: Sanchez' two interceptions had a common denominator: He didn't see the
underneath coverage.

Pick No. 1 -- Sanchez followed Cotchery on an in-cut, seeing CB Champ Bailey on Cotchery
the whole way. Sanchez thought it was man-to-man coverage, but it was a combination
coverage. LB Jason Hunter was sitting in a "hook" zone and made the interception.

Pick No. 2 -- Sanchez was looking for Keller, who was covered by CB Nate Jones. It seemed
to be man-to-man, as Jones was running with Keller, but it actually was a bracket
coverage. Jones fell off, passing him off to CB Syd'Quan Thompson, who was in a zone.
Interception. Sanchez seems to have a blind spot when it comes to those kind of passes.

CAUGHT SLEEPING: On the Broncos' surprise onsides kick, the Jets got caught cheating, big
time. At first glance, it looks like Kenwin Cummings was the guy who bailed out too soon,
but it was actually Brodney Pool. He had retreated 12 yards by the time the ball was
kicked.

WHERE'S VERNON?: After showing some early promise, DE/OLB Vernon Gholston has all but
disappeared -- again. He barely got on the field in Denver. Recently-signed Trevor Pryce
has taken over Gholston's spot in the D-line rotation and, now that Calvin Pace is
healthy, Gholston really isn't needed at outside linebacker.

NO DEALS: As expected, the Jets didn't make any trades before Tuesday's trading deadline.


== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 3:34 pm
From: Keith Keller


Disclaimer: I haven't watched the play either.

On 2010-10-19, buRford <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote:
> Cimini's always covering Schott's derriere, & has never said a bad word about him, so this
> is kind of interesting coming from him.
> I haven't watched the game again... I thought someone had posted that the original
> playcall, was a short pass to the first down marker, or something similar. Cimini's an
> ass, but even so, if what he's saying is true, my great esteem for Schott has really taken
> a hit. Someone who recorded the game... please tell me Cimini is wrong!
>
>
> Tuesday, October 19, 2010
> Jets win on ill-conceived play
> By Rich Cimini

[snip]

> On a fourth-and-6 from the Denver Broncos' 48, the Jets sent four receivers on vertical
> routes -- Holmes on the backside, with Braylon Edwards, Jerricho Cotchery and Dustin
> Keller in "trips" to the right. After studying the replay, a revelation: There was no
> safety valve because LaDainian Tomlinson stayed in to block.
>
> As it turned out, Tomlinson probably didn't have to stay in to block because the Broncos
> rushed only four, with a fifth coming on a delayed blitz. That left six blocking five.
> With four receivers downfield, and no check-down options, Mark Sanchez had no choice but
> to heave it.

Cimini is complaining about the play call, but how was he supposed to
know how many men Denver would rush? If you'd fault the play call for
anything, it'd be that either a) Sanchez didn't have an audible option
to send Tomlinson out, or b) Sanchez had an audible option but wasn't
able to read the defense to guess how many they would rush.

But it's also fourth and six--if Sanchez uses a check-down option, and
it comes up short, it's just as useless as no check-down. Also, if a
lineman is beat, Tomlinson is available to pick him up and give Sanchez
more time. So I really don't have any problem with LT staying back to
block.

If Cimini's description of the play is accurate, then I might have a
problem with sending all four receivers deep. At least one of them
could try a medium route, say 8-10 yards.

It's hard to tell from nfl.com's highlights, but one thing you can see
is that the defensive player who almost got to Sanchez right before he
threw the ball was being blocked by Tomlinson. (He may have been ready
to release for a check-down option if he hadn't run into the defensive
lineman right away; perhaps LT decided it was too dangerous to release
with both offensive linemen on either side of him occupied.)

--keith


--
kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us
(try just my userid to email me)
AOLSFAQ=http://www.therockgarden.ca/aolsfaq.txt
see X- headers for PGP signature information

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 4:34 pm
From: Tutor


On Oct 19, 6:07 pm, buRford <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
> Cimini's always covering Schott's derriere, & has never said a bad word about him, so this
> is kind of interesting coming from him.
> I haven't watched the game again... I thought someone had posted that the original
> playcall, was a short pass to the first down marker, or something similar.  Cimini's an
> ass, but even so, if what he's saying is true, my great esteem for Schott has really taken
> a hit.  Someone who recorded the game... please tell me Cimini is wrong!
>
> Tuesday, October 19, 2010
> Jets win on ill-conceived play
> By Rich Cimini
>
> If you're a New York Jets fan, it's a case of, "All's well that ends well." But take a
> closer look at the Mile High Miracle --Renaldo Hill's 46-yard pass-interference penalty on
> Santonio Holmes -- and you will see it wasn't a well-designed play by the Jets.
>
> On a fourth-and-6 from the Denver Broncos' 48, the Jets sent four receivers on vertical
> routes -- Holmes on the backside, with Braylon Edwards, Jerricho Cotchery and Dustin
> Keller in "trips" to the right. After studying the replay, a revelation: There was no
> safety valve because LaDainian Tomlinson stayed in to block.
>
> As it turned out, Tomlinson probably didn't have to stay in to block because the Broncos
> rushed only four, with a fifth coming on a delayed blitz. That left six blocking five.
> With four receivers downfield, and no check-down options, Mark Sanchez had no choice but
> to heave it. There was no escape route. If he had tried to run, he would've been dropped
> immediately. It was nice of Rex Ryan to praise Sanchez for having the presence of mind to
> throw it deep, but, really, what else was there to do?
>
> The officials made the right call -- it was pass interference -- an utterly dumb play by
> Hill. If the pass had fallen incomplete, fans would be complaining about Brian
> Schottenheimer's play call in that situation. The Jets should've had a receiver in the
> short to intermediate range -- a "sticks" option -- but they took the all-or-nothing
> approach. Afterward, Sanchez said it best: "We stole a win."
>
> Other thoughts and observations after breaking down the tape:
>
> HAVING A BLAST: On Tomlinson's game-winning TD run, moments after the pass interference,
> he received nice blocks from FB Tony Richardson and LG Matt Slauson. It was the Jets'
> "Blast" running play, their bread-and-butter in short yardage. Slauson blew open a huge
> hole, a nice way to end a play that almost started with disaster. He got his feet tangled
> with Sanchez, who stumbled as he pulled away from center. Some Denver defenders appeared
> to let Tomlinson score on purpose, but coach Josh McDaniels said that wasn't the case.
> Just soft defense, I suppose.
>
> STRETCH MARKS: On Tomlinson's 20-yard TD, the key blocks were thrown by rookie FB John
> Conner and LT D'Brickashaw Ferguson. This was a vintage "stretch" play to the left.
> Conner, in an off-set I, took out Mr. Interference, Hill. (Not a wonderful couple of plays
> there for Hill.) Ferguson got to the second level and did a nice job of walling off LB
> Mario Haggan. Ferguson, in case you haven't noticed, has been outstanding over the last
> four games.
>
> NOT USING YOUR HEAD: That was a terrible personal-foul call on S Jim Leonhard, who was
> flagged for a helmet-to-helmet hit on WR Brandon Lloyd. He led with his right shoulder,
> not his head. His helmet may have grazed Lloyd's helmet in an incidental manner, but it's
> clear that Leonhard's shoulder delivered the brunt of the hit. As everybody knows, the
> league is cracking down on shots to the head. Leonhard said he would appeal a fine.
>
> PACKING A WALLOP: CB Darrelle Revis didn't look like a guy with a cranky hamstring when he
> blew up WR Eddie Royal in the third quarter, exploding into Royal to break up a short
> pass. Fans have been getting on Revis for his performance -- he allowed four completions
> for 66 yards, including a TD -- but he really didn't play that badly. With an extra week
> to rest during the bye, he should, in theory, be 100% for the Green Bay Packers.
>
> OOPS: By the way, the touchdown he allowed -- 17 yards to Demaryius Thomas -- should've
> been challenged by the Jets. He bobbled and didn't get both feet down.
>
> TWIN PICKS: Sanchez' two interceptions had a common denominator: He didn't see the
> underneath coverage.
>
> Pick No. 1 -- Sanchez followed Cotchery on an in-cut, seeing CB Champ Bailey on Cotchery
> the whole way. Sanchez thought it was man-to-man coverage, but it was a combination
> coverage. LB Jason Hunter was sitting in a "hook" zone and made the interception.
>
> Pick No. 2 -- Sanchez was looking for Keller, who was covered by CB Nate Jones. It seemed
> to be man-to-man, as Jones was running with Keller, but it actually was a bracket
> coverage. Jones fell off, passing him off to CB Syd'Quan Thompson, who was in a zone.
> Interception. Sanchez seems to have a blind spot when it comes to those kind of passes.
>
> CAUGHT SLEEPING: On the Broncos' surprise onsides kick, the Jets got caught cheating, big
> time. At first glance, it looks like Kenwin Cummings was the guy who bailed out too soon,
> but it was actually Brodney Pool. He had retreated 12 yards by the time the ball was
> kicked.
>
> WHERE'S VERNON?: After showing some early promise, DE/OLB Vernon Gholston has all but
> disappeared -- again. He barely got on the field in Denver. Recently-signed Trevor Pryce
> has taken over Gholston's spot in the D-line rotation and, now that Calvin Pace is
> healthy, Gholston really isn't needed at outside linebacker.
>
> NO DEALS: As expected, the Jets didn't make any trades before Tuesday's trading deadline.

In the presser, Rex explicitly said it was supposed to be a "to the
sticks" play, which means that there weren't supposed to have everyone
deep. Either Rex is covering Schott's ass or Cimini has it wrong or a
player or two ran the wrong route. Of course there was supposed to be
a safety valve at or a bot beyong the 1st down marker. Cimini is an
idiot.


== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 4:55 pm
From: "papa.carl44"

"Tutor" <dcat4434@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:54424e71-09a7-4233-b201-d69f39e28ef1@w19g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 19, 6:07 pm, buRford <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
> Cimini's always covering Schott's derriere, & has never said a bad word
> about him, so this
> is kind of interesting coming from him.
> I haven't watched the game again... I thought someone had posted that the
> original
> playcall, was a short pass to the first down marker, or something similar.
> Cimini's an
> ass, but even so, if what he's saying is true, my great esteem for Schott
> has really taken
> a hit. Someone who recorded the game... please tell me Cimini is wrong!
>
> Tuesday, October 19, 2010
> Jets win on ill-conceived play
> By Rich Cimini
>
> If you're a New York Jets fan, it's a case of, "All's well that ends
> well." But take a
> closer look at the Mile High Miracle --Renaldo Hill's 46-yard
> pass-interference penalty on
> Santonio Holmes -- and you will see it wasn't a well-designed play by the
> Jets.
>
> On a fourth-and-6 from the Denver Broncos' 48, the Jets sent four
> receivers on vertical
> routes -- Holmes on the backside, with Braylon Edwards, Jerricho Cotchery
> and Dustin
> Keller in "trips" to the right. After studying the replay, a revelation:
> There was no
> safety valve because LaDainian Tomlinson stayed in to block.
>
> As it turned out, Tomlinson probably didn't have to stay in to block
> because the Broncos
> rushed only four, with a fifth coming on a delayed blitz. That left six
> blocking five.
> With four receivers downfield, and no check-down options, Mark Sanchez had
> no choice but
> to heave it. There was no escape route. If he had tried to run, he
> would've been dropped
> immediately. It was nice of Rex Ryan to praise Sanchez for having the
> presence of mind to
> throw it deep, but, really, what else was there to do?
>
> The officials made the right call -- it was pass interference -- an
> utterly dumb play by
> Hill. If the pass had fallen incomplete, fans would be complaining about
> Brian
> Schottenheimer's play call in that situation. The Jets should've had a
> receiver in the
> short to intermediate range -- a "sticks" option -- but they took the
> all-or-nothing
> approach. Afterward, Sanchez said it best: "We stole a win."
>
> Other thoughts and observations after breaking down the tape:
>
> HAVING A BLAST: On Tomlinson's game-winning TD run, moments after the pass
> interference,
> he received nice blocks from FB Tony Richardson and LG Matt Slauson. It
> was the Jets'
> "Blast" running play, their bread-and-butter in short yardage. Slauson
> blew open a huge
> hole, a nice way to end a play that almost started with disaster. He got
> his feet tangled
> with Sanchez, who stumbled as he pulled away from center. Some Denver
> defenders appeared
> to let Tomlinson score on purpose, but coach Josh McDaniels said that
> wasn't the case.
> Just soft defense, I suppose.
>
> STRETCH MARKS: On Tomlinson's 20-yard TD, the key blocks were thrown by
> rookie FB John
> Conner and LT D'Brickashaw Ferguson. This was a vintage "stretch" play to
> the left.
> Conner, in an off-set I, took out Mr. Interference, Hill. (Not a wonderful
> couple of plays
> there for Hill.) Ferguson got to the second level and did a nice job of
> walling off LB
> Mario Haggan. Ferguson, in case you haven't noticed, has been outstanding
> over the last
> four games.
>
> NOT USING YOUR HEAD: That was a terrible personal-foul call on S Jim
> Leonhard, who was
> flagged for a helmet-to-helmet hit on WR Brandon Lloyd. He led with his
> right shoulder,
> not his head. His helmet may have grazed Lloyd's helmet in an incidental
> manner, but it's
> clear that Leonhard's shoulder delivered the brunt of the hit. As
> everybody knows, the
> league is cracking down on shots to the head. Leonhard said he would
> appeal a fine.
>
> PACKING A WALLOP: CB Darrelle Revis didn't look like a guy with a cranky
> hamstring when he
> blew up WR Eddie Royal in the third quarter, exploding into Royal to break
> up a short
> pass. Fans have been getting on Revis for his performance -- he allowed
> four completions
> for 66 yards, including a TD -- but he really didn't play that badly. With
> an extra week
> to rest during the bye, he should, in theory, be 100% for the Green Bay
> Packers.
>
> OOPS: By the way, the touchdown he allowed -- 17 yards to Demaryius
> Thomas -- should've
> been challenged by the Jets. He bobbled and didn't get both feet down.
>
> TWIN PICKS: Sanchez' two interceptions had a common denominator: He didn't
> see the
> underneath coverage.
>
> Pick No. 1 -- Sanchez followed Cotchery on an in-cut, seeing CB Champ
> Bailey on Cotchery
> the whole way. Sanchez thought it was man-to-man coverage, but it was a
> combination
> coverage. LB Jason Hunter was sitting in a "hook" zone and made the
> interception.
>
> Pick No. 2 -- Sanchez was looking for Keller, who was covered by CB Nate
> Jones. It seemed
> to be man-to-man, as Jones was running with Keller, but it actually was a
> bracket
> coverage. Jones fell off, passing him off to CB Syd'Quan Thompson, who was
> in a zone.
> Interception. Sanchez seems to have a blind spot when it comes to those
> kind of passes.
>
> CAUGHT SLEEPING: On the Broncos' surprise onsides kick, the Jets got
> caught cheating, big
> time. At first glance, it looks like Kenwin Cummings was the guy who
> bailed out too soon,
> but it was actually Brodney Pool. He had retreated 12 yards by the time
> the ball was
> kicked.
>
> WHERE'S VERNON?: After showing some early promise, DE/OLB Vernon Gholston
> has all but
> disappeared -- again. He barely got on the field in Denver.
> Recently-signed Trevor Pryce
> has taken over Gholston's spot in the D-line rotation and, now that Calvin
> Pace is
> healthy, Gholston really isn't needed at outside linebacker.
>
> NO DEALS: As expected, the Jets didn't make any trades before Tuesday's
> trading deadline.

In the presser, Rex explicitly said it was supposed to be a "to the
sticks" play, which means that there weren't supposed to have everyone
deep. Either Rex is covering Schott's ass or Cimini has it wrong or a
player or two ran the wrong route. Of course there was supposed to be
a safety valve at or a bot beyong the 1st down marker. Cimini is an
idiot.

Cimini will still be a buffoon...but there was a receiver just shallow of
the PI call that should not have been in the same area. I think it looks
sometimes like there are too many people in the same place at times...OMHO.
I'd like to see it over again.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What If We Go To The Super Bowl In Dallas And Sanchez Gets Homesick????
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/373c06f700c90507?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 19 2010 4:35 pm
From: Tutor


On Oct 19, 8:55 am, John C TX <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> X-No-Archive: Yes
>
> "mr d...@harvarduniversity.edu" <foster...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > He'd be mere minutes from Mexico!
>
> > He could easily slip across the border!!!!
>
> > We need better border enforcement to stop Sanchez from visiting his
> > Poppy !!!!
>
> > mr dude
>
> We have hit the big time when I see your posts regularly.

at leas he is creative. I like Mr. Dude. You can have the drummer
dreg. What a colossal bore.


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