Tuesday, June 21, 2011

rec.bicycles.racing - 22 new messages in 11 topics - digest

Buzz It
rec.bicycles.racing
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing?hl=en

rec.bicycles.racing@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* Scott Moninger finally gets his chance - 4 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/91311a6061709a8d?hl=en
* Monkey beatings will now commence... - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1546a5392841449d?hl=en
* Looks like Schleck is delusional - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/66d3b2bcffca979a?hl=en
* Versus is following up stage coverage with movies - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/3d46826623991b3f?hl=en
* Can you win the TdF if you TT like a Fred? - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/a782cd166629d8d0?hl=en
* Rick Perry - The official jackass and jackhole of Texas - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/f233d40b1306fb98?hl=en
* (No Subject) - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/91c806212bd4d165?hl=en
* More cyclists to fall than just Lanceypoo - 2 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1aa32732e46b3893?hl=en
* Lance Is Selling One Of His Houses To Pay For Attorneys - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/e6e82895b72a5da6?hl=en
* What about Indurain? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/39f93825c13375aa?hl=en
* CNBC on Armstrong - 2 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1644748500078f18?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Scott Moninger finally gets his chance
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/91311a6061709a8d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 4:31 pm
From: MagillaGorilla


Anton Berlin wrote:

> Lance made his millions via doping - now Scott can make his because he
> didn't dope.
>
> http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jTI9p0lZ7kWyu2jMoYZD8DrCpKYg?docId=417b16556254480691ea9c263445196a

Moninger already sued Vitamin Cottage years ago as well as the supplement manufacturer and settled out of court.

Magilla

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 4:51 pm
From: Fred Flintstein


On 6/20/2011 6:31 PM, MagillaGorilla wrote:
> Anton Berlin wrote:
>
>> Lance made his millions via doping - now Scott can make his because he
>> didn't dope.
>>
>> http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jTI9p0lZ7kWyu2jMoYZD8DrCpKYg?docId=417b16556254480691ea9c263445196a
>
> Moninger already sued Vitamin Cottage years ago as well as the supplement manufacturer and settled out of court.
>
> Magilla
>

You should edit Moninger's Wikipedia page and to include that
information. Heh.

F


== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 10:37 pm
From: Zenon


On Jun 20, 4:51 pm, Fred Flintstein <bob.schwa...@sbcREMOVEglobal.net>
wrote:
> On 6/20/2011 6:31 PM, MagillaGorilla wrote:
>
> > Anton Berlin wrote:
>
> >> Lance made his millions via doping - now Scott can make his because he
> >> didn't dope.
>
> >>http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jTI9p0lZ7kWyu2jMoYZ...
>
> > Moninger already sued Vitamin Cottage years ago as well as the supplement manufacturer and settled out of court.
>
> > Magilla
>
> You should edit Moninger's Wikipedia page and to include that
> information. Heh.
>
> F

.
.
.
.
While you're at it, tell pezcyclingnews.com that there is something
wrong with this picture...
.
http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos/interviews/moninger/moninger-cadet.jpg
.
.
.


== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Jun 21 2011 12:00 am
From: Frederick the Great


In article
<32d6111f-fb9c-49d6-bfe1-7b9b114811fc@q12g2000prb.googlegroups.com>,
Zenon <zenon_jaskula@hotmail.com> wrote:

> On Jun 20, 4:51 pm, Fred Flintstein <bob.schwa...@sbcREMOVEglobal.net>
> wrote:
> > On 6/20/2011 6:31 PM, MagillaGorilla wrote:
> >
> > > Anton Berlin wrote:
> >
> > >> Lance made his millions via doping - now Scott can make his because he
> > >> didn't dope.
> >
> > >>http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jTI9p0lZ7kWyu2jMoYZ...
> >
> > > Moninger already sued Vitamin Cottage years ago as well as the supplement manufacturer and settled out of court.
> >
> > > Magilla
> >
> > You should edit Moninger's Wikipedia page and to include that
> > information. Heh.
> .
> While you're at it, tell pezcyclingnews.com that there is something
> wrong with this picture...
> .
> http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos/interviews/moninger/moninger-cadet.jpg

Yeah, the reflectors on those pedals.

--
Old Fritz

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Monkey beatings will now commence...
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1546a5392841449d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 4:51 pm
From: MagillaGorilla


birdbrain wrote:

> On Jun 19, 8:49 pm, MagillaGorilla <magi...@sandiegozoo.com> wrote:
> > I've been watching you people ...you never when or where, but I was
> > watching.  Now I'm goona kick the snot out of some people.
> >
> > Magilla
>
> I'll tee one up for you.
>
> I think Levi and Horner are having success now because they're
> protected
> riders. Now that they don't have to support LA, AC or CFE we're
> seeing
> what they can really do.

Levi's gonna show up to the le Tour with his off-score pegged at 132.9
(again) and Horny's gonna be in for a rude awakening....and they won't
be riding for each other since Radio Shat is pulling its sponsorship
after this year.

Magilla

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 9:29 pm
From: Rik Van Slick


On Jun 19, 11:49 pm, MagillaGorilla <magi...@sandiegozoo.com> wrote:
> I've been watching you people ...you never when or where, but I was
> watching.  Now I'm goona kick the snot out of some people.
>
> Magilla

Welcome back!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Looks like Schleck is delusional
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/66d3b2bcffca979a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 4:53 pm
From: MagillaGorilla


Choppy Warburton wrote:

> http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110615/sp_wl_afp/cyclingsuiluxfratour_20110615170057
>
> The only "6 way" will be the race for 2nd and if Liz Hatch shows up
> drunk one night.

Nice post, Chop.

Magilla


== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 4:58 pm
From: ilan


On Jun 15, 8:46 pm, Choppy Warburton <choppywarbur...@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110615/sp_wl_afp/cyclingsuiluxfratour_2...
>
> The only "6 way" will be the race for 2nd and if Liz Hatch shows up
> drunk one night.

That article is ridiculous, Andy Schleck right now has a 50%
probability of winning the Tour de France. The 2010 Tour de France,
that is: Given the lack of knowledge of CAS's decision, the scientific
assumption is to assume it has a 50% chance of suspending him for his
2010 Tour positive and giving the win to Andy Schleck.

-ilan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Versus is following up stage coverage with movies
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/3d46826623991b3f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 4:33 pm
From: Fredmaster of Brainerd


On Jun 20, 1:16 pm, Jimmy July <F...@Burger.com> wrote:
> On 6/20/2011 11:03 AM, Frederick the Great wrote:
>
> > Looks as if there are not as many LANCE fanboys around here
> > as I thought.
>
> Lance fanboy: noun, 1. A person who disagrees with Brian Lafferty.
>
> Since BL has not yet entered an opinion in this thread, how do you know
> if there are any LA fanboys?

Kill them all; for LANCE will know his own.

Fredmaster Ben


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 5:44 pm
From: Jimmy July


On 6/20/2011 3:47 PM, Frederick the Great wrote:
> In article<4dffaa95@news.x-privat.org>, Jimmy July<Fred@Burger.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 6/20/2011 11:03 AM, Frederick the Great wrote:
>>
>>> Looks as if there are not as many LANCE fanboys around here
>>> as I thought.
>>
>> Lance fanboy: noun, 1. A person who disagrees with Brian Lafferty.
>>
>> Since BL has not yet entered an opinion in this thread, how do you know
>> if there are any LA fanboys?
>
> Hm, what right do I have to think, huh?
>

The proper response would be to question BL's definition. Since it was I
who passed it on, your response is unnecessarily reasonable. Throw me a
"fucktard", or something.


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 11:43 pm
From: Ronko


In article <fb3e73d1-7628-4754-8ddf-
d09bce066843@a31g2000vbt.googlegroups.com>,
ricodjour@worldemail.com says...
>
>
>On Jun 20, 12:00�am, "Mike Jacoubowsky"
<Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
>wrote:
>> "RicodJour" <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> > Notably, American Flyers, that seminal work of semi-fiction with
>> > engrossing writing, wonderful acting (other than the people on
screen)
>> > and Alexandra Paul's tits, that has captivated cycling fans
worldwide
>> > (if you include just the US).
>>
>> > Why aren't they showing Stars and Watercarriers, A Sunday in
Hell, The
>> > Triplets of Belleville or something like that? �A real cycling movie
>> > that would keep viewers riveted (with apologies to Phil Liggett) to
>> > their seats.
>>
>> > How can we convince Versus to up the ante to some real movies?
>> > Is there a Freds United non-profit (FU.org) promoting a cycling
>> > agenda?
>> > Could we start a really annoying email campaign?
>> > Snarky YouTube videos?
>>
>> > Any and all suggestions are welcome (unless you're just a
douchebag
>> > with doping issues eating away at your brain). �Thanks.
>>
>>
>> #1: I'm with Fred(erick the Great) and vote for Dodgeball, even if
you
>> cut out Lance's part. Great movie
>>
>> #2: See #1. I don't think any of the great movies you mention
would play
>> to the VS audience. You brought up yourself one of the reasons
American
>> Flyers might fit in. But my choice #2 would be Breaking Away.
>
>Two reasons. Two small, pointed, and perky reasons. :)
>
>R
Well "American Flyer" at least had bicycles in it. And the credits said
Eddie Merckx but I really couldn't watch much of it. Silly writing, bad
acting and the female "leads" were ok looking but particularly lousy
actors. Yes, "A Sunday in Hell" would have been much better, or the
Tripletts.


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Can you win the TdF if you TT like a Fred?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/a782cd166629d8d0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 4:49 pm
From: ilan


On Jun 21, 1:28 am, Ben Trovato <benn.trov...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Jun 20, 10:28 am, ilan <ilan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > This is consistent with my current thoughts about time trialing, I
> > think it comes down to learning how to pedal and for many riders that
> > is just too hard (learning) people underestimate the stupidity of
> > professional riders. That goes a long way to explaining Armstrong's
> > improvement, as well as smart guys like Jalabert or Kelly. Look at
> > Vinokourov who can't time trial, though he's definitely not an idiot,
> > his pedaling technique has been proved mediocre, e.g., his two up
> > sprint against Comesso in the Tour in which he was ridiculously
> > overgeared.
>
> The Dunning-Krueger effect comes to mind... although you'd think a
> hard number like time would have a mitigating effect, some people are
> just impervious to the to the reality principle.

Well successful guys like Cunego, etc., have been winning ever since
they started racing, and continued winning as professionals, so it may
be inconceivable for them to change their whole riding style. The
Schlecks may become the paroxysm now that they are running their own
team.

That's what makes the Armstrong case so exceptional, a rider who
completely changes his riding style, including the simple act of
pedaling, in order to progress as a rider.

It's hard to think of other examples. I just read of a biography of
Robert Millar, and it turns out that he never did any training on
mountains, he mostly did Belgian kermesses in order to learn how to
improve his obvious weakness riding in fast, flat, rough pavement
situations with big heavy guys. Sounds like the training the Shlecks
should be doing.....

-ilan


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 8:09 pm
From: Brad Anders


Regarding the TdS debacle of Cunego, he had a crap position on his
bike, rocked all over the place, and had a really plodding cadence.
Didn't look like he worked on his ITT stuff at all. Plus that
atrocious pink fork. When I saw that poke into the frame, I knew he
was going to get his ass kicked.


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 9:56 pm
From: "A. Dumas"


ilan wrote:
> be inconceivable for them to change their whole riding style. The
> Schlecks may become the paroxysm now that they are running their own
> team.

I did not know its meaning and had to look it up. So, while I am not a
great expert on the correct use of the word paroxysm, I ask: did you
mean paragon? To me that seems to fit better. Anyway, not first use.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Rick Perry - The official jackass and jackhole of Texas
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/f233d40b1306fb98?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 5:48 pm
From: Jimmy July


On 6/20/2011 2:41 PM, Phil H wrote:
> On Jun 20, 2:14 pm, Steven Bornfeld<bornfeldm...@dentaltwins.com>
> wrote:
>> On 6/20/2011 4:30 PM, Anton Berlin wrote:
>>
>> Thanks for keeping us up to speed. This election season should be
>> loads of fun. Not.
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> --
>> Mark& Steven Bornfeld DDShttp://www.dentaltwins.com
>> Brooklyn, NY
>> 718-258-5001
>
> Hech that was so funny......God answers all your prayers, and
> sometimes the answer is no!

Sometimes it's "Here's a plague of locusts up your ass." Not that he's
done that since Fall of 2000, or so.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: (No Subject)
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/91c806212bd4d165?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 5:58 pm
From: Kulin Remailer


==============================================================================
TOPIC: More cyclists to fall than just Lanceypoo
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1aa32732e46b3893?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 6:22 pm
From: MagillaGorilla


Andy Coggan wrote:

> On Jun 6, 8:09 am, Anton Berlin <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > No doubt the GJ talked to Levi, Lim ---- hmmmm... that reminds me Andy
> > is lurking in here.
> >
> > What say you Coggan?
> >
> > THE ACCUSATION:In 2005, he helped Levi Leipheimer with doping during
> > the Tour de France.
> >
> > THE EXCERPT:"I had learned at this point how to do most of the
> > transfusion technicals and other things on my own so I hired Allen Lim
> > as my assistant to help with details and logistics. He helped Levi
> > Leipheimer and I prepare the transfusions for Levi and I and made sure
> > they were kept at the proper temperature. We both did two seperate
> > transfusions that Tour however my hematocrit was too low at the start
> > so I did my first one a few days before the start so as to not start
> > with a deficit."
> >
> > THE REACTION: International Cycling Union (UCI) president Pat McQuaid
> > said Landis' allegations were "scandalous and mischievous." The
> > governing body said it regretted that Landis accused former teammates
> > without allowing U.S. cycling and anti-doping authorities time to
> > investigate.
>
> I'd say that I'd still be surprised to learn that Lim was involved.
> (Although if it ultimately turns out that he was, just think of the
> embarrasment for the University of Colorado, the Boulder Center for
> Sports Medicine, Saris, etc.!)
>
> Andy Coggan

Lim denied everything before the grand jury. He, along with Lance, think
this is some kind of game played with lawyers. Lim will go to jail for
perjury. He just doesn't know it yet and thinks the feds are like the
UCI...boy, is Jackie Chan in for a big surprise.

Did you see when reporters confronted Lim at the Tour of California - they
guy couldn't even deny Landis' allegations.

It's so obvious that Lim is part of 'the program.' Why do you think Lance
hired him for several hundred thousand dollars/year?

Magilla

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 6:35 pm
From: MagillaGorilla


BL wrote:

> On 6/6/2011 12:31 PM, Anton Berlin wrote:
> > On Jun 6, 11:23 am, Andy Coggan<acog...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >> On Jun 6, 8:09 am, Anton Berlin<truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> No doubt the GJ talked to Levi, Lim ---- hmmmm... that reminds me Andy
> >>> is lurking in here.
> >>
> >>> What say you Coggan?
> >>
> >>> THE ACCUSATION:In 2005, he helped Levi Leipheimer with doping during
> >>> the Tour de France.
> >>
> >>> THE EXCERPT:"I had learned at this point how to do most of the
> >>> transfusion technicals and other things on my own so I hired Allen Lim
> >>> as my assistant to help with details and logistics. He helped Levi
> >>> Leipheimer and I prepare the transfusions for Levi and I and made sure
> >>> they were kept at the proper temperature. We both did two seperate
> >>> transfusions that Tour however my hematocrit was too low at the start
> >>> so I did my first one a few days before the start so as to not start
> >>> with a deficit."
> >>
> >>> THE REACTION: International Cycling Union (UCI) president Pat McQuaid
> >>> said Landis' allegations were "scandalous and mischievous." The
> >>> governing body said it regretted that Landis accused former teammates
> >>> without allowing U.S. cycling and anti-doping authorities time to
> >>> investigate.
> >>
> >> I'd say that I'd still be surprised to learn that Lim was involved.
> >> (Although if it ultimately turns out that he was, just think of the
> >> embarrasment for the University of Colorado, the Boulder Center for
> >> Sports Medicine, Saris, etc.!)
> >>
> >> Andy Coggan
> >
> > Was Lim called before the GJ ? He seems he would have been given that
> > he could provide first hand evidence on a number of riders associated
> > with Lance.
> This is all too funny. I've always wondered why the power transmission
> from Floyd's bike suddenly went bad on that climb. ROTFL!
> Anyone know if Chris Charmichael has been called before the GJ?

Doping really doesn't do anything to power levels..or at least not enough to
see decisively. What doping does it cause one to fatigue later. That's why
the blood profile of a doper is generally to have consistent hematocrit
during a 3-week race and power numbers that look relatively normal but show
delayed signs of fatigue. It's not gonna be a graph that looks like the
Himalayas popping up in Kansas.

Magilla


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Lance Is Selling One Of His Houses To Pay For Attorneys
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/e6e82895b72a5da6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 8:35 pm
From: MagillaGorilla


Brad Anders wrote:

> On Jun 4, 9:55 pm, Zenon <zenon_jask...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > http://www.gottesmanresidential.com/homes/DeadMansHole/index.htm
>
> LA's worth an insane amount of money, I'm sure paying for lawyers
> isn't a major issue.

Lawyers can bankrupt Lance...not to mention when he's convicted the U.S.
Attorney will likely ask for a substantial fine. It might not put dude
in the poorhouse, but he will take abig hit.

Then SCA is gonna want its 5 million back...then Floyd's lawsuit will
jab his jaw.

This is gonna be fun.

Magilla

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What about Indurain?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/39f93825c13375aa?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 8:37 pm
From: Jimmy July


On 6/20/2011 10:41 AM, RicodJour wrote:
> On Jun 20, 12:28 pm, Jimmy July<F...@Burger.com> wrote:
>> On 6/20/2011 1:56 AM, Simply Fred wrote:
>>
>>> William Fred wrote:
>>>> So it's not all skittles and ice cream, although I'm not sure what
>>>> skittles
>>>> are exactly, or even if I would like them.
>>
>>> <http://mixthatdrink.com/skittles-vodka-tutorial/>
>>
>> That looks like something an 18 year old would drink.
>
> I think that's the idea.
>

And when I was 18, it was LEGAL!


==============================================================================
TOPIC: CNBC on Armstrong
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/1644748500078f18?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 9:09 pm
From: "Mike Jacoubowsky"


"RicodJour" <ricodjour@worldemail.com> wrote in message
news:9279cf4d-2e5b-4db9-a2f1-0ff465974a05@28g2000yqu.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 20, 3:02 pm, Fred Flintstein <bob.schwa...@sbcremoveglobal.net>
wrote:
> On 6/20/2011 1:33 PM, William R. Mattil wrote:
>
> > On 6/20/2011 1:27 PM, Choppy Warburton wrote:
>
> >>> I'm curious. Is doping for an athletic contest illegal in the US?
>
> >>> F
>
> >> It is if you signed a contract where you said you wouldn't dope you
> >> stupid fucking dumbass.
>
> > Engage your brain before typing ....... A contract does not make
> > doping
> > illegal or legal.
>
> > Sheesh .... Not even July and the nutcases are out
>
> > Bill
>
> It's important to build form gradually, so as to not peak too early.
> The end of July is a long way off. The ape has the right idea.
> Lafferty
> is already showing signs of fading.
=========
I find it curious that chimpissimo was nowhere to be seen in the early
season, and then he's all over the place like a bum on baloney. Maybe
he was in Mexico with Rasmussen and his wife. Relaxing. Yeah, that's
it.

R
=========

Actually, I thought our resident ape was off to a slow start. He began a
couple of threads, but hasn't come back much to maintain them. It's like
he's fertilizing the fields but not bothering to tend them afterward.
Sad, because there's the slightest hint of content, almost quality, in
some of his recent posts.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 20 2011 9:16 pm
From: "Mike Jacoubowsky"

"Anton Berlin" <truth_88888@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:da98a055-b14b-445b-866d-5b838bad4a29@34g2000pru.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 20, 1:33 pm, "William R. Mattil" <wrmat...@ix.netcom.com>
wrote:
> On 6/20/2011 1:27 PM, Choppy Warburton wrote:
>
>
>
> >> I'm curious. Is doping for an athletic contest illegal in the US?
>
> >> F
>
> > It is if you signed a contract where you said you wouldn't dope you
> > stupid fucking dumbass.
>
> Engage your brain before typing ....... A contract does not make
> doping
> illegal or legal.
>
> Sheesh .... Not even July and the nutcases are out
>
> Bill
>
> --
>
> William R. Mattil
>
> http://www.celestial-images.com

========
Dumbass if you promise not to play checkers and you receive
compensation for that promise and then go play checkers it's fraud.

If Armstrong didn't make a promise to NOT DOPE then doping isn't
illegal... but since he did.... eh heh...
========

So you've seen the contract? Has anyone here? Is it posted somewhere?

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


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