rec.bicycles.racing
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing?hl=enrec.bicycles.racing@googlegroups.com
Today's topics:
* If your name is Schleck... - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/e2cf8420a23a7787?hl=en
* Doping thread...or not? - 5 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/acd35f1d4b7c8a05?hl=en
* The Ride of Shame - Mark Cavendish in 4" heels just like a slut in Manhattan
heading home at 8 AM - 6 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/c69456e1ab39719b?hl=en
* Post-TDF pic for Anton - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/d2bd1e5265538142?hl=en
* Most bizarre moments of final stage - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/7107ac85e5422ced?hl=en
* I thought this might happen. Another positive doping test. - 3 messages, 3
authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/bd7773a949de4688?hl=en
* 2011 TDF a boring race - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/d19806b313dc8185?hl=en
* Crank length selection and seat position. Not just knee over pedal. Is this
correct? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/6c8039f828f97835?hl=en
* Market value of Cervelo & BMC - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/9e4f5f2b3efb3b81?hl=en
* Magilla hasn't earned the red most combative monkey even once this year - 1
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/7546867c817e7030?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: If your name is Schleck...
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/e2cf8420a23a7787?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 8:11 am
From: atriage
On 25/07/2011 15:01, Choppy Warburton wrote:
> On Jul 25, 8:10 am, Scott<hendricks_sc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 25, 5:23 am, thirty-six<thirty-...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Jul 23, 11:37 pm, Scott<hendricks_sc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> On Jul 23, 3:37 pm, thirty-six<thirty-...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>>> On Jul 23, 5:48 pm, Scott<hendricks_sc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>>> On Jul 23, 9:48 am, atriage<atri...@satriage.net> wrote:
>>
>>>>>>> On 23/07/2011 16:40, Adama wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>> Le 23/07/2011 17:12, atriage a écrit :
>>>>>>>>> ...then today's racing didn't necessarily proceed in an advantageous
>>>>>>>>> manner.
>>
>>>>>>>> Looks like "only one TT stage in the Tour" is still one too many for them ...
>>
>>>>>>> Somebody needs to lock them in a wind tunnel with a bicycle for six months.
>>
>>>>>>> --
>>
>>>>>> Much of the time loss seemed to have come from Schleck's tentative
>>>>>> descending, whereas Evans was nailing it in the twistier parts of the
>>>>>> descent. You'd have thought he was riding a crit bike, not a TT bike.
>>
>>>>> It didn't have the curly handlebar but the dropped position is still
>>>>> there. As long as a rider can get his weight forward he is able to
>>>>> control it well at speed. There really isn't a lot of difference once
>>>>> a rider lifts off the saddle and balances the bike into and out of a
>>>>> corner.
>>
>>>> You do know the steering geometry, and therefore the handling, is
>>>> significantly different between a TT bike and regular road bike,
>>>> right?
>>
>>> No! What are these significant differences?
>>
>> A good TT bike is designed to be very stable at speed in a straight or
>> reasonable straight line, stable enough to keep the front end from
>> being too affected by strong cross winds. Bikes that are super stable
>> in a straight line tend not to turn well, not without significant
>> steering input.
>>
>> You can start w/ the trail figures for the fork/headtube angle. Then
>> there's also the typically ever so slightly shorter chainstay, coupled
>> with the significantly steeper seattube angle, placing the weight of
>> the rider much further forward. The much lower bars will put the
>> weight of the rider lower. You may say that once the rider stands on
>> the pedals the seattube angle doesn't matter, but the position of the
>> bars changes everything about the position of the rider's CoG compared
>> to a standard road bike position.
>>
>> Like I said, you can learn to ride a TT bike down a mtn, but I doubt
>> anyone who's not a supreme bike handler could do it well the first
>> time they try as it's not intuitive.
>
> So practicing is somehow beneficial ? What about training ? Does it
> help to train ?
The best way to learn to ride a TT bike downhill is to change your name to
Fabian and go live in Switzerland.
--
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 8:16 am
From: Jimmy July
On 7/25/2011 7:01 AM, Choppy Warburton wrote:
> On Jul 25, 8:10 am, Scott<hendricks_sc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 25, 5:23 am, thirty-six<thirty-...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Jul 23, 11:37 pm, Scott<hendricks_sc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> On Jul 23, 3:37 pm, thirty-six<thirty-...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>>> On Jul 23, 5:48 pm, Scott<hendricks_sc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>>> On Jul 23, 9:48 am, atriage<atri...@satriage.net> wrote:
>>
>>>>>>> On 23/07/2011 16:40, Adama wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>> Le 23/07/2011 17:12, atriage a écrit :
>>>>>>>>> ...then today's racing didn't necessarily proceed in an advantageous
>>>>>>>>> manner.
>>
>>>>>>>> Looks like "only one TT stage in the Tour" is still one too many for them ...
>>
>>>>>>> Somebody needs to lock them in a wind tunnel with a bicycle for six months.
>>
>>>>>>> --
>>
>>>>>> Much of the time loss seemed to have come from Schleck's tentative
>>>>>> descending, whereas Evans was nailing it in the twistier parts of the
>>>>>> descent. You'd have thought he was riding a crit bike, not a TT bike.
>>
>>>>> It didn't have the curly handlebar but the dropped position is still
>>>>> there. As long as a rider can get his weight forward he is able to
>>>>> control it well at speed. There really isn't a lot of difference once
>>>>> a rider lifts off the saddle and balances the bike into and out of a
>>>>> corner.
>>
>>>> You do know the steering geometry, and therefore the handling, is
>>>> significantly different between a TT bike and regular road bike,
>>>> right?
>>
>>> No! What are these significant differences?
>>
>> A good TT bike is designed to be very stable at speed in a straight or
>> reasonable straight line, stable enough to keep the front end from
>> being too affected by strong cross winds. Bikes that are super stable
>> in a straight line tend not to turn well, not without significant
>> steering input.
>>
>> You can start w/ the trail figures for the fork/headtube angle. Then
>> there's also the typically ever so slightly shorter chainstay, coupled
>> with the significantly steeper seattube angle, placing the weight of
>> the rider much further forward. The much lower bars will put the
>> weight of the rider lower. You may say that once the rider stands on
>> the pedals the seattube angle doesn't matter, but the position of the
>> bars changes everything about the position of the rider's CoG compared
>> to a standard road bike position.
>>
>> Like I said, you can learn to ride a TT bike down a mtn, but I doubt
>> anyone who's not a supreme bike handler could do it well the first
>> time they try as it's not intuitive.
>
> So practicing is somehow beneficial ? What about training ? Does it
> help to train ?
Not to the best of A. Schleck's knowledge.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Doping thread...or not?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/acd35f1d4b7c8a05?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 8:14 am
From: atriage
On 25/07/2011 16:07, BL wrote:
> On 7/24/2011 9:12 PM, ilan wrote:
>> On Jul 24, 6:23 pm, atriage<atri...@satriage.net> wrote:
>>> So the winners average speed this year is 1.1 mph below LA's 2005 peak (all time
>>> highest) speed but higher than Bertie Dopador's last year. It's 0.1mph below
>>> Pantani's winning average in 1998 when Marco's haemocrit levels were off the
>>> scale
>>> (allegedly).http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/07/news/tour-de-france-winners-an...
>>>
>>> --
>>
>> Well, I certainly enjoyed the "Anti-doping experts believe in credible
>> figures" article on CyclingNews
>> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/2011-tour-de-france-the-cleanest-in-recent-years
>>
>> The two remarks I enjoyed most were:
>>
>> 1. riders have appeared to cross the finish line in more obvious
>> states of fatigue than in the recent past.
>>
>> 2. Grappe said he feared future possibilities of "manipulating the
>> muscle fibers, the central nervous system and the tolerance threshold
>> to pain."
>>
>> They are so ludicrous that they don't even need to be explicitly
>> refuted. I find these supposed experts contemptible, and yet they are
>> necessary for my well-being -- I'm so insecure that their mediocrity
>> makes me feel better about myself.
>>
>> -ilan
> Blocking pain, eh. Isn't that something of what amphetamines do? So we will see
> the dopers in future fall off the bike like Simpson. Lovely.
The bookmakers will start offering odds on how far up Ventoux they'll get before
this happens.
--
== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 10:36 am
From: BL
On 7/25/2011 11:14 AM, atriage wrote:
> On 25/07/2011 16:07, BL wrote:
>> On 7/24/2011 9:12 PM, ilan wrote:
>>> On Jul 24, 6:23 pm, atriage<atri...@satriage.net> wrote:
>>>> So the winners average speed this year is 1.1 mph below LA's 2005
>>>> peak (all time
>>>> highest) speed but higher than Bertie Dopador's last year. It's
>>>> 0.1mph below
>>>> Pantani's winning average in 1998 when Marco's haemocrit levels were
>>>> off the
>>>> scale
>>>> (allegedly).http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/07/news/tour-de-france-winners-an...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>
>>> Well, I certainly enjoyed the "Anti-doping experts believe in credible
>>> figures" article on CyclingNews
>>> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/2011-tour-de-france-the-cleanest-in-recent-years
>>>
>>>
>>> The two remarks I enjoyed most were:
>>>
>>> 1. riders have appeared to cross the finish line in more obvious
>>> states of fatigue than in the recent past.
>>>
>>> 2. Grappe said he feared future possibilities of "manipulating the
>>> muscle fibers, the central nervous system and the tolerance threshold
>>> to pain."
>>>
>>> They are so ludicrous that they don't even need to be explicitly
>>> refuted. I find these supposed experts contemptible, and yet they are
>>> necessary for my well-being -- I'm so insecure that their mediocrity
>>> makes me feel better about myself.
>>>
>>> -ilan
>> Blocking pain, eh. Isn't that something of what amphetamines do? So we
>> will see
>> the dopers in future fall off the bike like Simpson. Lovely.
>
> The bookmakers will start offering odds on how far up Ventoux they'll
> get before this happens.
>
You got that right. :-)
== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 11:51 am
From: RicodJour
On Jul 24, 9:12 pm, ilan <ilan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Well, I certainly enjoyed the "Anti-doping experts believe in credible
> figures" article on CyclingNewshttp://www.cyclingnews.com/news/2011-tour-de-france-the-cleanest-in-r...
>
> The two remarks I enjoyed most were:
>
> 1. riders have appeared to cross the finish line in more obvious
> states of fatigue than in the recent past.
Holy shit. I just realized that I was a doper in high school! The
lacrosse and soccer (football to the wanker crowd) coach used to have
us do wind sprints at the end of practice. The guy who won the wind
sprint got to stop and go have a nice cool drink from the water
bucket. I was fast, but not the fastest so I saved my energy for the
sprints I could win, but if the coach saw you dogging it, he'd make
you run laps. So I developed a quite convincing Gasp!-I'm-DYING! look
when doing the preliminary sprints. I had no idea that I was covering
up for being a doper.
Maybe acting lessons will become required for dopers so they'll look
convincingly drained at the end of a tough stage.
R
== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 12:46 pm
From: Simply Fred
RicodJour wrote:
> Maybe acting lessons will become required for dopers so they'll look
> convincingly drained at the end of a tough stage.
I think they teach that at the LANCE academy in the 2nd semester as the
1st semester is dedicated to The Shit that will Kill them 101.
== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 1:03 pm
From: atriage
On 25/07/2011 20:46, Simply Fred wrote:
> RicodJour wrote:
>> Maybe acting lessons will become required for dopers so they'll look
>> convincingly drained at the end of a tough stage.
>
> I think they teach that at the LANCE academy in the 2nd semester as the 1st
> semester is dedicated to The Shit that will Kill them 101.
>
LMAO.
--
==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Ride of Shame - Mark Cavendish in 4" heels just like a slut in
Manhattan heading home at 8 AM
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/c69456e1ab39719b?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 8:25 am
From: atriage
On 24/07/2011 22:19, Uncle Dave wrote:
> On Jul 24, 4:57 pm, Anton Berlin<truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Looks like they'll give the green points jersey to anyone whether they
>> actually race or just follow the route of the tour in the autobus,
>> stopping for croissants, leisurely riding through the mountains and
>> taking in the scenery.
>>
>> Even getting motorized - Gruber like assists up the hard parts.
>>
>> The gruppetto is an embarrassment to the legitimate riders that finish
>> the Tour by earning the honor rather than by exemption and favor.
>>
>> Throw out this lousy rule and throw out the lousy riders that decide
>> to coast and soft pedal to Paris.
>>
>> I prefer to watch 80 cyclists ride into Paris over 140 dubious
>> achievers.
>
> Although it's always nice to see your fellow countrymen win something,
> I think the decision to make more points available during the stages
> was wrong. Although there is more to HTC than Cavendish, they are the
> only team built around a sprinter. (If there were others they were
> pretty bad at it so forget them.) Making more points so easily
> available to the sprinters has made the green jersey the sprinters'
> jersey. I don't think it was intended to be that, rather it rewarded
> the rider who was consistently highly placed throughout rather than
> just on those stages where the race was decided. A battler. The sort
> of rider I like to see winning it is a Gilbert (or Jalabert indeed
> anyone whose name ends in "lbert") - somebody who tries like fuck and
> blows up on a regular basis because of it. There have been sprinters
> who have won it in the past purely on merit, for example Abdou who
> never enjoyed the kind of team protection that Cavendish does or
> Kelly. The decision to waive the time barrier twice was a travesty
> IMHO. So I agree pretty much entirely with the sentiment here, the
> green jersey definitely got devalued in this Tour to the point where
> it smacks of a fix.
>
> Happily, the cricket was much more exciting
Morning Tuffers [see note 1]
> well anything is more exciting than the last stage in the Tour
You are Magilla and I claim my 3 cents.
> since they added a 100-odd km
> neutralised zone - so I only saw the last few km. Horribly
> predictable mush for the masses.
Nice bit of elitism there, maybe all spectators should be required to be able to
name all the winners of the last 50 editions of Paris-Nice...that would make sense.
Note 1. For the benefit of USAians Tuffers (Phil Tufnell) was an English cricket
player who was a *bit* challenged in the grey matter department. When England
were playing in Australia the Aussie fans used to yell "Hey Tuffers, lend us yer
brain, we're building an idiot"
--
== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 9:55 am
From: Uncle Dave
On Jul 25, 4:25 pm, atriage <atri...@satriage.net> wrote:
> On 24/07/2011 22:19, Uncle Dave wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jul 24, 4:57 pm, Anton Berlin<truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> Looks like they'll give the green points jersey to anyone whether they
> >> actually race or just follow the route of the tour in the autobus,
> >> stopping for croissants, leisurely riding through the mountains and
> >> taking in the scenery.
>
> >> Even getting motorized - Gruber like assists up the hard parts.
>
> >> The gruppetto is an embarrassment to the legitimate riders that finish
> >> the Tour by earning the honor rather than by exemption and favor.
>
> >> Throw out this lousy rule and throw out the lousy riders that decide
> >> to coast and soft pedal to Paris.
>
> >> I prefer to watch 80 cyclists ride into Paris over 140 dubious
> >> achievers.
>
> > Although it's always nice to see your fellow countrymen win something,
> > I think the decision to make more points available during the stages
> > was wrong. Although there is more to HTC than Cavendish, they are the
> > only team built around a sprinter. (If there were others they were
> > pretty bad at it so forget them.) Making more points so easily
> > available to the sprinters has made the green jersey the sprinters'
> > jersey. I don't think it was intended to be that, rather it rewarded
> > the rider who was consistently highly placed throughout rather than
> > just on those stages where the race was decided. A battler. The sort
> > of rider I like to see winning it is a Gilbert (or Jalabert indeed
> > anyone whose name ends in "lbert") - somebody who tries like fuck and
> > blows up on a regular basis because of it. There have been sprinters
> > who have won it in the past purely on merit, for example Abdou who
> > never enjoyed the kind of team protection that Cavendish does or
> > Kelly. The decision to waive the time barrier twice was a travesty
> > IMHO. So I agree pretty much entirely with the sentiment here, the
> > green jersey definitely got devalued in this Tour to the point where
> > it smacks of a fix.
>
> > Happily, the cricket was much more exciting
>
> Morning Tuffers [see note 1]
>
> > well anything is more exciting than the last stage in the Tour
>
> You are Magilla and I claim my 3 cents.
So explain to me what is so exciting about watching a bunch of lycra-
clad poofs chatting and swigging champagne whilst leisurely riding
their bikes through the countryside? (And I use the term "poof"
advisedly in a purely illustrative and non-sexual sense.)
>
> > since they added a 100-odd km
> > neutralised zone - so I only saw the last few km. Horribly
> > predictable mush for the masses.
>
> Nice bit of elitism there, maybe all spectators should be required to be able to
> name all the winners of the last 50 editions of Paris-Nice...that would make sense.
Happily, now that's over we can get back to the real racing in a week
or three. I wonder how many real bike fans turn out on the Tour route
to watch? Not many compared to other races would be my guess. Fair
weather fans making a lot of noise and a nuisance of themselves.
Speaking of the cricket, there's a lot to be said sometimes for not
having any work. Really good game all in all and an exciting and
satisfying end today. I've tried watching baseball on ESPN America
but nobody seems to do anything.
UD
== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 1:02 pm
From: atriage
On 25/07/2011 17:55, Uncle Dave wrote:
> > The sort
>> > of rider I like to see winning it is a Gilbert (or Jalabert indeed
>> > anyone whose name ends in "lbert") - somebody who tries like fuck and
>> > blows up on a regular basis because of it. There have been sprinters
>> > who have won it in the past purely on merit, for example Abdou who
>> > never enjoyed the kind of team protection that Cavendish does or
>> > Kelly. The decision to waive the time barrier twice was a travesty
>> > IMHO.
A totally inconsistent statement and indicative of some bias on your
part...here's the punchline:-
Gilbert finished in the bus on stage 19...if you're gonna enforce the cut
consistently then fast Phil wouldn't have been in Paris, along with such other
*minor* luminaries like Fabian Cancellara. Or are you gonna say that a bus with
Fast Phil in it is OK to continue but one with Marvellous Mark isn't for some
reason. Maybe you should write to ASO and explain your thinking. Another thing
[while I'm at it] road cycle racing is a team sport, Cavendish wins sure but who
really wins in HTC Highroad because Frank put together by far the best team for
flat/rolling stages. No arguments please, the results speak for themselves, it's
no good whining that Cavendish is protected....the whole FUCKING point is
exactly that, that's what HTC do.
== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 1:35 pm
From: Frederick the Great
In article <8f2dnSe3fYRTF7DTnZ2dnUVZ8m2dnZ2d@brightview.co.uk>,
atriage <atriage@satriage.net> wrote:
> (Phil Tufnell) was an English cricket
> player who was a *bit* challenged in the grey matter department. When England
> were playing in Australia the Aussie fans used to yell "Hey Tuffers, lend us yer
> brain, we're building an idiot"
Didn't his brother, Nigel, play in a heavy metal band?
--
Old Fritz
== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 1:38 pm
From: Choppy Warburton
On Jul 25, 3:02 pm, atriage <atri...@satriage.net> wrote:
> On 25/07/2011 17:55, Uncle Dave wrote:
>
> > > The sort
> >> > of rider I like to see winning it is a Gilbert (or Jalabert indeed
> >> > anyone whose name ends in "lbert") - somebody who tries like fuck and
> >> > blows up on a regular basis because of it. There have been sprinters
> >> > who have won it in the past purely on merit, for example Abdou who
> >> > never enjoyed the kind of team protection that Cavendish does or
> >> > Kelly. The decision to waive the time barrier twice was a travesty
> >> > IMHO.
>
> A totally inconsistent statement and indicative of some bias on your
> part...here's the punchline:-
> Gilbert finished in the bus on stage 19...if you're gonna enforce the cut
> consistently then fast Phil wouldn't have been in Paris, along with such other
> *minor* luminaries like Fabian Cancellara. Or are you gonna say that a bus with
> Fast Phil in it is OK to continue but one with Marvellous Mark isn't for some
> reason. Maybe you should write to ASO and explain your thinking. Another thing
> [while I'm at it] road cycle racing is a team sport, Cavendish wins sure but who
> really wins in HTC Highroad because Frank put together by far the best team for
> flat/rolling stages. No arguments please, the results speak for themselves, it's
> no good whining that Cavendish is protected....the whole FUCKING point is
> exactly that, that's what HTC do.
Atriage, you really enjoy the taste of Cavengoo sliding down your
throat.
== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 1:48 pm
From: atriage
On 25/07/2011 21:38, Choppy Warburton wrote:
> On Jul 25, 3:02 pm, atriage<atri...@satriage.net> wrote:
>> On 25/07/2011 17:55, Uncle Dave wrote:
>>
>>> > The sort
>>>> > of rider I like to see winning it is a Gilbert (or Jalabert indeed
>>>> > anyone whose name ends in "lbert") - somebody who tries like fuck and
>>>> > blows up on a regular basis because of it. There have been sprinters
>>>> > who have won it in the past purely on merit, for example Abdou who
>>>> > never enjoyed the kind of team protection that Cavendish does or
>>>> > Kelly. The decision to waive the time barrier twice was a travesty
>>>> > IMHO.
>>
>> A totally inconsistent statement and indicative of some bias on your
>> part...here's the punchline:-
>> Gilbert finished in the bus on stage 19...if you're gonna enforce the cut
>> consistently then fast Phil wouldn't have been in Paris, along with such other
>> *minor* luminaries like Fabian Cancellara. Or are you gonna say that a bus with
>> Fast Phil in it is OK to continue but one with Marvellous Mark isn't for some
>> reason. Maybe you should write to ASO and explain your thinking. Another thing
>> [while I'm at it] road cycle racing is a team sport, Cavendish wins sure but who
>> really wins in HTC Highroad because Frank put together by far the best team for
>> flat/rolling stages. No arguments please, the results speak for themselves, it's
>> no good whining that Cavendish is protected....the whole FUCKING point is
>> exactly that, that's what HTC do.
>
> Atriage, you really enjoy the taste of Cavengoo sliding down your
> throat.
SIT AND SPIN, FAGGOT BOI
|U|
| |
| |
_| |_
| | | |-.
/| ` |
| | |
| |
\ /
| |
| |
--
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Post-TDF pic for Anton
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/d2bd1e5265538142?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 9:37 am
From: Dwayne
http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos/races11/tdf11/tdf11st21eh-pilsner.jpg
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 10:47 am
From: Anton Berlin
On Jul 25, 11:37 am, Dwayne <dwayne_dillh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos/races11/tdf11/tdf11st21eh-pilsne...
What is she doing out in the daylight ? She's not supposed to leave
her cave until after midnight.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Most bizarre moments of final stage
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/7107ac85e5422ced?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 9:05 am
From: Ben Trovato
On Jul 24, 5:40 pm, ilan <ilan...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I am not sure how to order these:
>
> 1. Head of France Television sports Daniel Bilalian talking about this
> year's Tour and the inspiring performance of Thierry Voeckler.
>
Did he confound "Thomas Voeckler" and "Thierry Adam"?
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 10:46 am
From: Jim Feeley
Ben Trovato <benn.trovato@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 24, 5:40 pm, ilan <ilan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I am not sure how to order these:
>>
>> 1. Head of France Television sports Daniel Bilalian talking about this
>> year's Tour and the inspiring performance of Thierry Voeckler.
>>
>
> Did he confound "Thomas Voeckler" and "Thierry Adam"?
Thierry Voeckler is the name of a driver for France TV. No relation to
Thomas, but one of his most-valued domestiques.
--
Jim
Jim Feeley
POV Media
==============================================================================
TOPIC: I thought this might happen. Another positive doping test.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/bd7773a949de4688?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 10:16 am
From: atriage
On 25/07/2011 15:02, Choppy Warburton wrote:
> They were planning to do a urine test but it appears she drank it
> thinking it was RedBull and vodka shooter.
Her urine was probably higher proof than most spirits.
--
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 1:12 pm
From: Ben Trovato
On Jul 25, 5:24 am, Davey Crockett <r...@azurservers.com> wrote:
> atriage a écrit profondement:
>
> | On 25/07/2011 04:26, ilan wrote:
> | > On Jul 25, 5:14 am, Vagina Gorilla<vaginagori...@gmail.com> wrote:
> | >>http://tinyurl.com/3sm7f2c
> | >
> | > Fairness dictates waiting for confirmation by the B sample.
> | >
>
> | CAS will wait till she appears in person before making an appeal decision.
>
> No need for that
>
> Marie Stuart, Reine d'Ecosse set a precedeent 500 years ago.
>
> She had Lord Huntley dug up and hauled his ass into court to be found
> Guilty of Treason.
>
> Then she hung the Wanker
>
> No information is available on whether Huntley put up a good defense or
> not
>
> The Parasite Class of Kings, Queens, Dukes etc., of course, are not
> renowned for Grey Matter, but the Stuart Branch takes the Biscuit.
>
> Why ever would a beleagured Catholic Queen in a Nominally Protestant
> Land upset the Huntleys, the Only Catholic family of any Stature in
> HaggisReich who would support her and more importantly have put 10,000
> loyal soldiers at her back when she had only Bothwell's few Borderers
> otherwise to support her when her Bastard, strained through the sheets,
> half Brother, James, was running her out of HaggisReich for an Up Close
> and Personal Rendezvous in what passed in Elizabethan England as a
> Prototypical Chop-Square??
>
> Go Figure
>
> --
> Davey Crocketthttp://azurservers.com
Mary Stuart hardly set the precedent, she followed one at least
several centuries old, practiced by various popes against their
predecessors. The posthumous trial of the 4th Earl of Huntly after
his death from apoplexy served to forfeit Huntly property to the
Scottish crown, though it was eventually restored to his son, the 5th
Earl.
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 1:16 pm
From: Simply Fred
Davey Crockett wrote:
>> No need for that
>> Marie Stuart, Reine d'Ecosse set a precedeent 500 years ago.
>> She had Lord Huntley dug up and hauled his ass into court to be found
>> Guilty of Treason.
>> Then she hung the Wanker
Ben Trovato wrote:
> Mary Stuart hardly set the precedent, she followed one at least
> several centuries old, practiced by various popes against their
> predecessors. The posthumous trial of the 4th Earl of Huntly after
> his death from apoplexy served to forfeit Huntly property to the
> Scottish crown, though it was eventually restored to his son, the 5th
> Earl.
Sounds like the kind of stuff they'd do in Texas or Iran.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: 2011 TDF a boring race
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/d19806b313dc8185?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 12:40 pm
From: "FAT"
As bad as the NBA. Turn it on right at the end, tie score, see what
happens. Boring until then.
"Randall" wrote in message
news:90372c91-2a45-4125-830f-0250e76408ca@g5g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
This years TDF was one of the most boring ones I have seen in decades.
This year did not not have a patron and race is less exciting. The
leaders spent most of the tour watching each other. Hopefull we will
see more panache next year.
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 12:44 pm
From: atriage
On 25/07/2011 20:40, FAT wrote:
> As bad as the NBA. Turn it on right at the end, tie score, see what happens.
> Boring until then.
Shut the fuck up you top-posting pant-stain.
--
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Crank length selection and seat position. Not just knee over pedal. Is
this correct?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/6c8039f828f97835?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 12:59 pm
From: thirty-six
On Jul 25, 3:13 pm, landotter <landot...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 25, 12:27 am, thirty-six <thirty-...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I hypothesise that the correct maximum crank length for any distance
> > rider is that which sets the pedal axle not behind the sit spots made
> > upon the saddle by the ischial projections but as near to it. The
> > knee should also not pass forward of the pedal axle in the forward
> > position so limiting the smallest size and saddle position.
>
> > The crank length when at the maximum then sets the seat to bottom
> > bracket position very closely. 170mm cranks give me no leeway in
> > position and my seat position is set at 74deg. This limitation of
> > position causes discomfort in my back after about 5 hours (or less).
> > A 5mm shorter crank permits a 5mm position change on the saddle,
> > necessary to get on the rivet and also useful when climbing. My other
> > bike allows this mobility and I may ride 8 hours without incident.
> > The position changes are not necessarily concious efforts.
>
> > With accurate measurements of pelvis to knee and knee to pedal spindle
> > then accurate suggestions of crank lengths may be made using
> > trigonometry.
>
> > Have I overlooked something which also would have a bearing on crank
> > length choice not covered by the method I present?
>
> With proper saddle height and cleat position--everything else usually
> falls right into place. A long femur might want the saddle back a cm
> or two, and a short torso might beg for a compact stem. I'm not a
> professional fitter, but there's really no substitute for putting a
> body on a trainer and listening to it.
I've realised that what I have said could be simplified to use cranks
less than half the length of the upper leg and the position will
follow. I've given you the reasons why.
If the cranks are short it gets pretty hard to get sufficiently out
of position to cause a problem but position may need refinement with
crank lengthening. As others have found, handlebar position is not
quite so critical and 10 or 15mm in stem length or height increments
will satisfy all but The Great Eddy. Long cranks however will make
handlebar position more critical (for a distance cyclist) as the
naturally economic leg position is restricted in the saddle.
How do typical Tour riders get on with 172mm cranks steaming up the
Alps? Why, they soak their feet in phosphates each night to grow
their legs longer.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Market value of Cervelo & BMC
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/9e4f5f2b3efb3b81?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 1:35 pm
From: Ryan Cousineau
On Jul 24, 10:07 pm, Randall <randall.shim...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Does anyone have any idea of what Cervelo or BMC is worth...? It's
> hard to tell because these are private companies. But I still find it
> hard to believe they can afford to sponsor a pro team. Cervelo is no
> longer a main sponsor however.
As you said, Cervelo is no longer a title sponsor. I think we can
safely assume Garmin has deeper pockets.
http://lavamagazine.com/features/kona/bike-count#axzz1T9KLLD23
The 2010 Ironman bike count* found somewhere close to a million
dollars in Cervelos at the event. 468 bikes, more than 1/4 of the
total. USA Triathlon says they have 135k members, which is way higher
than I expected. So that argues that you're not crazy if you think
Cervelo has sold 30,000 bicycles just to American tri-geeks serious
enough to do at least a sprint Tri.
A little hand-waving suggests to me that their annual sales are
probably in the 10-50 thousand bikes, which is a big range, but only
one order of magnitude. Let's call that annual revenues in the $10-50
million range. I'm probably optimistic, though.
http://www.manta.com/c/mm46ggr/trek-usa
This profile of Trek says they're a company with revenues in the
$20-50 million range. I'm almost certain Cervelo isn't as big as Trek.
I'd assume then that 10,000 bicycles and $10 million annual revenue is
closer to the truth than $50 million.
Either figure is probably not enough to be the sponsor of a ProTour
team. They run in the range of $10 million annual budgets, I think.
($6M for a cheap team?) Title sponsor is probably most of that cost. I
don't think Cervelo could spend so much of its annual revenues on a
ProTour sponsorship, and they said as much when they "merged" with
Garmin. But also, the Cervelo Test Team was a Pro Continental team,
not full ProTour.
Conclusions: CEO/DS Vaughters is running a business on the same
revenue-scale as Cervelo co-founders Vroomen and White, though a very
different sort of company (Garmin-Cervelo has, in a way, 30 customers
(its sponsors), and maybe 5 of those are really crucial to its
existence).
Pro cycling teams are really big fundraising entities, more or less
acting as conduits of sponsor money towards rider salaries and racing
expenses. It's probably one of those businesses where you think that
one thing (bike racing) matters, and in fact your day-to-day business
turns out to be sponsor seduction.
Rihs' milkshake brings all the sponsors to the yard,
*I only follow this survey in search of tri-mocking fodder.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Magilla hasn't earned the red most combative monkey even once this year
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/t/7546867c817e7030?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jul 25 2011 1:41 pm
From: Choppy Warburton
Magilla's found something better to do than obsess
> over someone who hasn't been relevant in 6 years.
Liz Hatch ?
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