alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets?hl=enalt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets@googlegroups.com
Today's topics:
* Hugh Douglas: "Jets Are Fearless" - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/80e28ce6e40d6fbb?hl=en
* Ducasse - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/be47ce8f51a0966e?hl=en
* Sanchez and Schott: How we'll know who to blame this year. - 4 messages, 4
authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/3714871c4c061465?hl=en
* Importance of Secondary: GB Shredding NO - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/3442d902f64a1c3c?hl=en
* Young & Fearless v. Old & Cowardly - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/39a03d5ac411e71f?hl=en
* Where's Wald...errr, buRford? - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/9f219c979f38cac4?hl=en
* Defense, O-Line, QB: Jets v. Cowboys, In General - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/1164eaba7ff247be?hl=en
* HOUSTON TEXANS 2011 DIVISION WINNERS - 4 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/a3f1e2648f2b8868?hl=en
* Jets preview via PFR.com - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/6a234c0a87891dad?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Hugh Douglas: "Jets Are Fearless"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/80e28ce6e40d6fbb?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 9 2011 11:07 pm
From: Grinch
On Friday, September 9, 2011 2:00:29 AM UTC-4, JetsLife wrote:
> On Sep 9, 1:37 am, Grinch <oldn...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> > On Thursday, September 8, 2011 11:15:40 PM UTC-4, JetsLife wrote:
> > > *Finally* someone more eloquent than me summing up what I always try
> > > to get at with these Jets.
> >
> > > And Hugh Douglas's comments were specifically regarding Rex & Sanchez:
> > > they're fearless, they have swagger. When they got knocked down it
> > > doesn't bother them. They get right back up.
> >
> > > I've been harping on "toughness" for the past year or two ...
> >
> > Yup. And when "toughness" finally gets our QB ranked higher than 27th by rating and 29th by completion pct, let us know. So far, toughness and swagger haven't proved much of a substitute for being able to read the D and accurately hit the open man.
> >
> > Personally, I'd feel a lot better if Hugh had said the Jets had the *smartest* QB and HC around, and the toughest linemen in the league.
> >
> > I mean, Rex, gee, is he still over 300 pounds after the operation? "Tough"? Really??? I suppose he could roll himself up off his back if knocked down, but it's not really a job requirement as he has a whole staff of assistants who'd lift him up quickly enough -- but *brains* is a requirement!
> >
> > > Hugh summed it up better than me:
> >
> > > The Jets are fearless and got swagger.
> >
> > > And to me that's another way of saying: they want it. And want to,
> > > true desire and passion to get something, have always been at the root
> > > of achievment.
> >
> > Every team in the league is loaded with toughness and swagger. Everybody has to be full of that to be just competitive, to be there. To win takes a lot more: Talent, brains, fast thinking, poise under pressure, professionalism.
> >
> > All across the league this week tough, swaggering players have been mocking Sanchez over his ever-so-tough GQ profile.
> >
> > http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82204d24/article/packers-rodger...
> >
> > Well, maybe it was "tough", in a certain way, for Mark to say he wanted to go over and punch out Rex for thinking about benching him, and to fight in the huddle against Rex's giving Brunell extra reps, for no other reason than that his own play was sucking. And that it took Schott to stop him. (Hey, and youze guys say Schott doesn't earn his pay. He stopped a mutiny and civil war!)
> >
> > But was it *smart* (poised? professional?) to act that way -- and then tell the whole story in GQ? I'm trying to imagine another QB saying, in GQ, "That bastard was thinking of sitting me, and was actually cutting my reps, just because my play was stinking. So I was headed over to punch out Parcells/ Cowher/ Shula/ Noll/ ..." :-)
> >
> > Yet Rex humored the spoiled baby about the whole incident, both when it happened and when it hit print. Looks to me like Rex is a lot more smart than tough -- which is the way it *should* be. Good for him.
> >
> > ~~~~~http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/football/nfl/08/15/mark.sanchez...
> >
> > "In the GQ article, Sanchez also discusses ... the challenges of dating and his appreciation for Justin Bieber and the TV show 'Glee.'
> >
> > "Sanchez, who enjoys Broadway performances, sees a comparison between being on stage and playing on the football field."
> > ~~~~~
> >
> > Wow, that will sure put fear of his toughness into opposing blitzing linebackers!
> >
> > But I don't care if it does or it doesn't.
> >
> > He could spend the next summer dressed up in a Tinkerbell suit prancing across the stage in a West Village musical and *if* it was after he'd hit 65% of his passes during this season he'd be my main man, I'd be his biggest fan.
> >
> > But if after a third season with a 27th-ranked passer rating and under-55% completion pct he spends the summer winning the Ultimate Fighting World Championship, I'll tell him to use it to go get a job as a male model.
>
> Oh Grinchy, you are a classically stupid idiot. Hiding behind your
> classic lawyer cowardice, unwilling to your risk Jets fan emotion.
> Unwilling to go to the game Sunday cause you're a coward.
>
> It's okay. You have made your self plain by now. Me, I'm a wild
> businessman where feircelessness, on a physical and thinking level
> does come in to play. It's why I'm retired at 35 - or did that escape
> you.
>
> One week you love the Jets the next you tear them down.
>
> All you can do is cite stats. If we went by you're approach, Mangini
> would still be our head coach.
>
> You're a foolish fool who hides behind stats and wouldn't know a good
> Jets team if it smashed you in the face. You reside in a world of
> cowardice and fear. If you disagree I will be happy to meet you any
> time in the parking lot so we can share a beer and end your arrogant
> war - on us all in here.
>
> ALL YOU KNOW HOW TO DO IS NITPICK, FIGHT & HATE UNTIL YOU'RE OWN SON
> SEES A GREAT VICTORY OVER HOUSTON LAST YEAR. AND THEN UR ALL HUNKY
> DORY OH MAYBE THE CURSE IS BROKEN!!
>
> And then you are seen for what you are.
>
> Fuck you Grinch: you ARE the curse, the ingrained negativity infecting
> the positive vibrations.
Hmm... so along with toughness,, toughness, toughness, do "poise" and "self control" appear on your list of winners' attributes anyhere?
Just asking. :-)
> Most of all, you are a coward Jets fan. You don't have the $, balls or
> belief to go nuts at the game Sunday. If so prove me wrong: show up
> loud with me and I'm buying. I altered a biz trip just for it. You -
> all you do is talk shit. No, you don't want the Jets to win - all you
> want is for you to win argument.
>
> Typical scumbag lawyer. I know you're type and I walk over you. You're
> bark is always WAY bigger than bite when we hit you back so hard you
> never it was coming. Keep your evil negative lawyer shit to yourself
> would ya.
>
> The rest of us have a game to play Sunday. FUCK YOU GRINCH
Dude, why angry at me? I'm not the one who said The Sanchize's GQ spread was "embarassing".
That was Aaron Rodgers and the guys on the Cowboys and the other players who said that.
But you don't have to take their word for it. See for yourself. Here's a GQ video on it:
http://www.gq.com/video/videos/mark-sanchez-new-york-jets-gq-interview
And here's a part of the part of the article that's online:
~~~~
Maybe the most striking thing about Sanchez's home is what's on the DVR. Holding a white towel around his waist, heading for the shower, he flips through his saved shows. A documentary about Justin Bieber? Episodes of Glee? The quarterback of the New York Jets is a Gleek and a Belieber?
Yes, he says, failing to notice the tone of incredulity.
The DVR squares with Sanchez's unabashed love of show tunes. It seems too perfect that the successor to Broadway Joe is a fan of Broadway musicals, but there you have it.
While you're likely to bump into other New York athletes at Scores, you're more likely to find Sanchez at the Lunt-Fontanne Theatre. He's seen just about every show out there, many of them multiple times. His truck is cluttered with cast albums. So ubiquitous is Sanchez in the theater district that he was a presenter at last year's Tonys.
Aside from just enjoying the music, Sanchez says he feels a kinship with Broadway performers. "Their life is so regimented—like mine. They have eight shows a week. They have to take care of their bodies, stretch, eat right, take care of their voices. You know, their voice is like my arm."
Pants and sneakers by Nike. Hat by Noff. Necklace by Cartier. Watch by Rolex at Tourneau.
http://www.gq.com/sports/profiles/201109/mark-sanchez-gq-september-2011-cover-story#slide=3
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Tough! Tough! Tough! Tough! Tough! Tough! Tough!
:-)
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 9:17 am
From: Harlan Lachman
In article
<c592f475-aca8-4ac6-b02f-0558f91092a0@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com
>,
Grinch <oldnasty@mindspring.com> wrote:
> On Thursday, September 8, 2011 11:15:40 PM UTC-4, JetsLife wrote:
> > *Finally* someone more eloquent than me summing up what I always try
> > to get at with these Jets.
> >
> > And Hugh Douglas's comments were specifically regarding Rex & Sanchez:
> > they're fearless, they have swagger. When they got knocked down it
> > doesn't bother them. They get right back up.
> >
> > I've been harping on "toughness" for the past year or two ...
>
> Yup. And when "toughness" finally gets our QB ranked higher than 27th by
> rating and 29th by completion pct, let us know. So far, toughness and
> swagger haven't proved much of a substitute for being able to read the D and
> accurately hit the open man.
>
> Personally, I'd feel a lot better if Hugh had said the Jets had the
> *smartest* QB and HC around, and the toughest linemen in the league.
>
> I mean, Rex, gee, is he still over 300 pounds after the operation? "Tough"?
> Really??? I suppose he could roll himself up off his back if knocked down,
> but it's not really a job requirement as he has a whole staff of assistants
> who'd lift him up quickly enough -- but *brains* is a requirement!
>
> > Hugh summed it up better than me:
> >
> > The Jets are fearless and got swagger.
> >
> > And to me that's another way of saying: they want it. And want to,
> > true desire and passion to get something, have always been at the root
> > of achievment.
>
> Every team in the league is loaded with toughness and swagger. Everybody has
> to be full of that to be just competitive, to be there. To win takes a lot
> more: Talent, brains, fast thinking, poise under pressure, professionalism.
>
> All across the league this week tough, swaggering players have been mocking
> Sanchez over his ever-so-tough GQ profile.
>
> http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82204d24/article/packers-rodgers-calls-s
> anchezs-gq-spread-embarrassing
>
> Well, maybe it was "tough", in a certain way, for Mark to say he wanted to go
> over and punch out Rex for thinking about benching him, and to fight in the
> huddle against Rex's giving Brunell extra reps, for no other reason than that
> his own play was sucking. And that it took Schott to stop him. (Hey, and
> youze guys say Schott doesn't earn his pay. He stopped a mutiny and civil
> war!)
>
> But was it *smart* (poised? professional?) to act that way -- and then tell
> the whole story in GQ? I'm trying to imagine another QB saying, in GQ, "That
> bastard was thinking of sitting me, and was actually cutting my reps, just
> because my play was stinking. So I was headed over to punch out Parcells/
> Cowher/ Shula/ Noll/ ..." :-)
>
> Yet Rex humored the spoiled baby about the whole incident, both when it
> happened and when it hit print. Looks to me like Rex is a lot more smart than
> tough -- which is the way it *should* be. Good for him.
>
> ~~~~~
> http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/football/nfl/08/15/mark.sanchez.rex.ryan
> .ap/index.html
>
> "In the GQ article, Sanchez also discusses ... the challenges of dating and
> his appreciation for Justin Bieber and the TV show 'Glee.'
>
> "Sanchez, who enjoys Broadway performances, sees a comparison between being
> on stage and playing on the football field."
> ~~~~~
>
> Wow, that will sure put fear of his toughness into opposing blitzing
> linebackers!
>
> But I don't care if it does or it doesn't.
>
> He could spend the next summer dressed up in a Tinkerbell suit prancing
> across the stage in a West Village musical and *if* it was after he'd hit 65%
> of his passes during this season he'd be my main man, I'd be his biggest fan.
>
> But if after a third season with a 27th-ranked passer rating and under-55%
> completion pct he spends the summer winning the Ultimate Fighting World
> Championship, I'll tell him to use it to go get a job as a male model.
Grinch, while I agree with you that Life (generally and in this post)
is too optimistic/simplistic and with most of what you write, I think
you too are missing something.
The truth is that the Mangini/Herm Jets have been transformed to a team
that went to two consecutive AFC championship games. Last year, they
were the one of only two teams to beat the Pats and they did so twice.
While I am so old it is not likely I will see the team for which I root
win a ring, it is also true that this team is better, better prepared,
and prepared/committed to win enough that they have been more successful
than they have been in decades (absent the all too brief Parcells years).
harlan
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 12:00 pm
From: Señor Patriots
On Sep 10, 11:17 am, Harlan Lachman <har...@eeivt.com> wrote:
> In article
> <c592f475-aca8-4ac6-b02f-0558f9109...@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com
>
> this team is better, better prepared,
> and prepared/committed to win enough that they have been more successful
> than they have been in decades (absent the all too brief Parcells years).
>
Definitely a vast improvement.
Getting over the hump reminds me of being just to the left of the top
of the Bell Curve. It's easier rising to near the top, but harder to
actually get over the top, or on the top.
In the end I'm convinced that *everything* has to go right for a
playoff team to go over the top. Timing of all those high points for
the main players, and the coaches, and even a lot of *luck* has to be
there to make it all happen. How else could it be with maybe 6 teams
all capable of winning it? Some very good teams must lose. In fact,
they all must lose except for one.
That being said, the '68 Jets came out of nowhere .... like the 2001
Patriots. It wasn't the vaunted Colts or Rams that won those
games.
Maybe luck is not the right word though. Maybe destiny is? It seems
to me that certain teams do have a sense of destiny around them. How
to prove that? You can't but just look back at the 2007 Giants, and
really study what they did starting with that loss to the Patriots in
week 17. Watch what they did in Green Bay in the freezing cold. That
just doesn't happen without some destiny in the mix, me thinks. I
found it disconcerting to see them win that game in Green Bay because
that type of win can really propel a team's sense of destiny. OTOH,
if GB had won it, ho hum, sorta, that Brett in the cold could not be
beaten, etc.
I'll take luck or destiny any day. All the half dozen teams are good
enough to rate the trophy, but only one can be destined.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Ducasse
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/be47ce8f51a0966e?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 7:39 am
From: "yoyodog"
Remember Brick the first year? Pure turnstyle... how'd that work out?
Give Ducasse a chance to prove himself wrong...
"Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:68qdneTSwp1Ssf3TnZ2dnUVZ_uednZ2d@giganews.com...
> Has got to go...this isn't a project, it's pure liability. He is going to
> get people killed, he simply can not block. OMHO, Papa Carl
>
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 9:47 am
From: Harlan Lachman
In article <j4fssc$8ra$1@news.datemas.de>,
"yoyodog" <connarchNOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Remember Brick the first year? Pure turnstyle... how'd that work out?
> Give Ducasse a chance to prove himself wrong...
>
> "Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:68qdneTSwp1Ssf3TnZ2dnUVZ_uednZ2d@giganews.com...
> > Has got to go...this isn't a project, it's pure liability. He is going to
> > get people killed, he simply can not block. OMHO, Papa Carl
> >
I will go you one better yoyo.
Ducasse has got to develop sufficiently to make Hunter the back-up this
year or our team will have problems and may kill our QB and suffer a
poor running game.
He may well lack the necessities to do so. I hope not. Because we need
Ducasse to get much better much more than we ever need VG to show up.
Harlan
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Sanchez and Schott: How we'll know who to blame this year.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/3714871c4c061465?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 8:49 am
From: Johnny Morongo
On 9/9/2011 10:29 PM, Grinch wrote:
> It's simple.
>
> Sanchez'z completion pct last year was 54.8%, round it to 55% (after 53.8% the year before). This team is supposed to be "win now -- the Super Bowl!" The league average completion pct is 61%. And the top-third of teams we're supposed to be competing with to "win now" average 66%.
>
> Here's how *big* a handicap a 55% completion pct is in this competition: For every 5 passes Sanchez completes, the competition completes 6. Compared to Sanchez, over the season, that's like the competition getting an extra *3 games* worth of completed passes for free.
>
> That's sending the offense through a season with one foot stuck in a bucket.
>
> And it is worse than that. Because with the Kid being that wild, the coaches have to compromise the offense by restricting its options to protect him -- just as players on opposing teams last year openly said the Jets coaches do.
>
> This year, there is no excuse. He's not a rookie, he's not inexperienced, he's had two full years of getting the greatest support and coddling and nurturing that I've ever seen any QB receive.
>
> It's time for both Sanchez *and* the front office (Tannenbaum, Woody) to stand up and say this guy is a #5 pick getting paid #5 money -- and it's time he started to deliver #5 pick value.
>
> It's not so difficult and rare for a rookie to complete 60% right from the start. Here's a list of some rookies and second-year players of the last few seasons:
>
> Josh Freeman 61%, Colt McCoy 61%, Sam Bradford 60%, Joe Flacco 63% and 60%, Chad Henne 61%, Trent Edwards 65%, Matt Ryan 61%, Jay Cutler 64%, Vince Young 63%, Charlie Fry 64%, Carson Palmer 68% and 61%, Big Ben 66% and 63%, Chris Sims 61%, Bryon Leftwich 61%, Mark Bulger 63% and 65% ... I'll stop the here.
>
> Here is the full list of OBs who've finishes below Sanchez in completion % during his two years: Derek Anderson, Brady Quinn, Jimmy Clausen, JaMarcus Russell. Mark Stafford. That is all.
>
> And please don't anyone put Sanchez's completion % on Schott. When they find Jimmy Hoffa's body under where the old stadium was, you can put that on Schott -- but not this.
>
> Chad with half an arm, and nowhere near the supporting talent there is on the team today, was Comeback Player of the Year and left NY with the #1 completion percentage all time, with Schott running the O. Favre, who for all his great attributes was never a particularly high comp % guy, and with a crippled arm for the last third of the season, hit 66% with Schott running the O. In between them, Clemens hit 52% -- and he just got cut by the Skins.
>
> A Clemens-like completion pct ranked 29th two years in a row is **on the QB** -- there is no way around it. It is up to Sanchez to pull his foot out of that bucket.
>
> AND HE KNOWS IT. If you've followed his offseason, he's many times made clear the coaches have given him this message and he accepts it. He knows it. He's said he will! See below. So it is time for him to deliver on his word. Period.
>
> So here's the bottom line:
>
> (1) IF Sanchez as a third-year #5 pick has another year of completion percentage in the 50s, the problems the offense will *inevitably* have will be on him, period.
>
> Oh, people will be able to whine all they want about Schott's crappy O (and how Rex mysteriously, inexplicably, has no influence over it).
>
> But the bottom line will be that you could bring back Bill Walsh, Don Coryell, Sid Gillman and Paul Brown all working together -- and with a QB throwing 20% more clangers than the other team, giving away *three games* worth of pass completions for nothing, they couldn't get the offense's foot out of the bucket either.
>
> It'll be Sanchez's fault. Period.
>
> (2) IF Sanchez at least partially delivers on his brave words below, and gets up at least to league average, over 60%, then there will be no reason for the Jets offense not to be fully competitive with anyone.
>
> Then if the offense still backfires all you Schott haters can rip him to your heart's content.
>
> Tear him as many new ones as you want. It'll be Schott's fault. Period.
>
> THAT's how we'll know which one to blame. Period.
>
> Of course there is a third possibility we can hope for: Sanchez delivers as he says he will, gets the offense's foot out of the bucket, Schott is freed to for the first time run the O he really wants, delivers, and the Jets Win! the Jets Win!
>
> That is, the Sanchez doubters and Schott haters are *both* proved wrong -- and in the end there is **nobody to blame**!
>
> Dare we dream?
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> Sanchez interviewed by Serby
>
> Q: How much better do you have to play for this team to win a Super Bowl?
>
> A: ... My completion percentage should be higher, I think ... getting completions early ... It's about getting off to a good start. You look at all the guys that throw 70-plus percent -- [Drew] Brees, [Peyton] Manning, [Tom] Brady -- and they start off the game 6-for-7. They don't start off 2-for-8, and then have to play catchup the whole game. So I think that's been something I've identified just in watching film this offseason.
>
> Q: Are we talking 60 percent completion percentage?
>
> A: Oh, higher than that.
>
> Q: 65%?
>
> A: Got to be. You shoot for at least 70% a year. That's like where you're going for, but your first couple of years (chuckle) it's a harder to do that than just saying it.
>
> Q: Seventy is Joe Montana-esque.
>
> A: That's what we need to win.
>
> Q: So you think that's a realistic goal for you, 70 percent?
>
> A: Absolutely.
>
> http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/serby_sunday_with_mark_sanchez_dOPxsUUZ49zGh3nZRBZk2H
> ~~~~~~~
>
> Post:
>
> The biggest thing Sanchez has talked about is raising his completion percentage from 54.8 last year. Schottenheimer and Sanchez spent a day last week watching every incompletion he threw last year. Schottenheimer said it's not a matter of Sanchez getting more accurate, just making better decisions.
>
> "That's a huge thing we want to work on," Schottenheimer said. "With his ability and his arm talent and his accuracy, there's no reason in the world that he should be a 54-percent passer. A lot of it is the youth of the first two years, him feeling windows or I can make that throw and realizing that NFL football is different than college football. He should have huge jumps this year. That's what we hope and expect."
>
> http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/jets_set_to_take_to_the_air_djMnqStzdkKZjhhXounRMM
You know Grinchkin, there's no refuting your point about Sanchez's
completion percentages, and I think we all know it. There's also no
disputing the "out of rhythm," shoe-box play calling that Schott is
prone to, for everyone but you that is. Both of them have to do much
better. Say that, and I won't have to come East and kill you, once and
for all.
== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 9:44 am
From: Harlan Lachman
In article
<62efaf47-272a-4a4f-b9ff-9e5d48bf02cc@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com
>,
Grinch <oldnasty@mindspring.com> wrote:
> So here's the bottom line:
>
> (1) IF Sanchez as a third-year #5 pick has another year of completion
> percentage in the 50s, the problems the offense will *inevitably* have will
> be on him, period.
>
> Oh, people will be able to whine all they want about Schott's crappy O (and
> how Rex mysteriously, inexplicably, has no influence over it).
>
> But the bottom line will be that you could bring back Bill Walsh, Don
> Coryell, Sid Gillman and Paul Brown all working together -- and with a QB
> throwing 20% more clangers than the other team, giving away *three games*
> worth of pass completions for nothing, they couldn't get the offense's foot
> out of the bucket either.
>
> It'll be Sanchez's fault. Period.
>
> (2) IF Sanchez at least partially delivers on his brave words below, and gets
> up at least to league average, over 60%, then there will be no reason for the
> Jets offense not to be fully competitive with anyone.
>
> Then if the offense still backfires all you Schott haters can rip him to your
> heart's content.
>
> Tear him as many new ones as you want. It'll be Schott's fault. Period.
>
> THAT's how we'll know which one to blame. Period.
Grinch, this post also makes no sense to me.
Sanchez has only had one OC in his tenure with this team. Shott had also
been criticized with his use of other QB.
Sanchez may well stink. If his completion percentage in the regular
season is at 55% or thereabouts, he will likely get a chance to work
with someone else (here or elsewhere). Then, and only then, will we know
who is to blame.
And, it could be both.
harlan
== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 11:34 am
From: "JKConey"
"Grinch" wrote in message
news:62efaf47-272a-4a4f-b9ff-9e5d48bf02cc@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com...
It's simple.
Sanchez'z completion pct last year was 54.8%, round it to 55% (after 53.8%
the year before). This team is supposed to be "win now -- the Super Bowl!"
The league average completion pct is 61%. And the top-third of teams we're
supposed to be competing with to "win now" average 66%.
Here's how *big* a handicap a 55% completion pct is in this competition: For
every 5 passes Sanchez completes, the competition completes 6. Compared to
Sanchez, over the season, that's like the competition getting an extra *3
games* worth of completed passes for free.
That's sending the offense through a season with one foot stuck in a bucket.
And it is worse than that. Because with the Kid being that wild, the coaches
have to compromise the offense by restricting its options to protect him --
just as players on opposing teams last year openly said the Jets coaches do.
Excellent report, but I think we all know this. Right now he stinks.
-- JK Sinrod
www.MyConeyIslandMemories.com
== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 2:38 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"Grinch" <oldnasty@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:62efaf47-272a-4a4f-b9ff-9e5d48bf02cc@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com...
It's simple.
Sanchez'z completion pct last year was 54.8%, round it to 55% (after 53.8%
the year before). This team is supposed to be "win now -- the Super Bowl!"
The league average completion pct is 61%. And the top-third of teams we're
supposed to be competing with to "win now" average 66%.
Here's how *big* a handicap a 55% completion pct is in this competition: For
every 5 passes Sanchez completes, the competition completes 6. Compared to
Sanchez, over the season, that's like the competition getting an extra *3
games* worth of completed passes for free.
That's sending the offense through a season with one foot stuck in a bucket.
And it is worse than that. Because with the Kid being that wild, the coaches
have to compromise the offense by restricting its options to protect him --
just as players on opposing teams last year openly said the Jets coaches do.
This year, there is no excuse. He's not a rookie, he's not inexperienced,
he's had two full years of getting the greatest support and coddling and
nurturing that I've ever seen any QB receive.
It's time for both Sanchez *and* the front office (Tannenbaum, Woody) to
stand up and say this guy is a #5 pick getting paid #5 money -- and it's
time he started to deliver #5 pick value.
It's not so difficult and rare for a rookie to complete 60% right from the
start. Here's a list of some rookies and second-year players of the last
few seasons:
Josh Freeman 61%, Colt McCoy 61%, Sam Bradford 60%, Joe Flacco 63% and 60%,
Chad Henne 61%, Trent Edwards 65%, Matt Ryan 61%, Jay Cutler 64%, Vince
Young 63%, Charlie Fry 64%, Carson Palmer 68% and 61%, Big Ben 66% and 63%,
Chris Sims 61%, Bryon Leftwich 61%, Mark Bulger 63% and 65% ... I'll stop
the here.
Here is the full list of OBs who've finishes below Sanchez in completion %
during his two years: Derek Anderson, Brady Quinn, Jimmy Clausen, JaMarcus
Russell. Mark Stafford. That is all.
And please don't anyone put Sanchez's completion % on Schott. When they
find Jimmy Hoffa's body under where the old stadium was, you can put that on
Schott -- but not this.
Chad with half an arm, and nowhere near the supporting talent there is on
the team today, was Comeback Player of the Year and left NY with the #1
completion percentage all time, with Schott running the O. Favre, who for
all his great attributes was never a particularly high comp % guy, and with
a crippled arm for the last third of the season, hit 66% with Schott running
the O. In between them, Clemens hit 52% -- and he just got cut by the
Skins.
A Clemens-like completion pct ranked 29th two years in a row is **on the
QB** -- there is no way around it. It is up to Sanchez to pull his foot out
of that bucket.
AND HE KNOWS IT. If you've followed his offseason, he's many times made
clear the coaches have given him this message and he accepts it. He knows
it. He's said he will! See below. So it is time for him to deliver on his
word. Period.
So here's the bottom line:
(1) IF Sanchez as a third-year #5 pick has another year of completion
percentage in the 50s, the problems the offense will *inevitably* have will
be on him, period.
Oh, people will be able to whine all they want about Schott's crappy O (and
how Rex mysteriously, inexplicably, has no influence over it).
But the bottom line will be that you could bring back Bill Walsh, Don
Coryell, Sid Gillman and Paul Brown all working together -- and with a QB
throwing 20% more clangers than the other team, giving away *three games*
worth of pass completions for nothing, they couldn't get the offense's foot
out of the bucket either.
It'll be Sanchez's fault. Period.
(2) IF Sanchez at least partially delivers on his brave words below, and
gets up at least to league average, over 60%, then there will be no reason
for the Jets offense not to be fully competitive with anyone.
Then if the offense still backfires all you Schott haters can rip him to
your heart's content.
Tear him as many new ones as you want. It'll be Schott's fault. Period.
THAT's how we'll know which one to blame. Period.
Of course there is a third possibility we can hope for: Sanchez delivers as
he says he will, gets the offense's foot out of the bucket, Schott is freed
to for the first time run the O he really wants, delivers, and the Jets Win!
the Jets Win!
That is, the Sanchez doubters and Schott haters are *both* proved wrong --
and in the end there is **nobody to blame**!
Dare we dream?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sanchez interviewed by Serby
Q: How much better do you have to play for this team to win a Super Bowl?
A: ... My completion percentage should be higher, I think ... getting
completions early ... It's about getting off to a good start. You look at
all the guys that throw 70-plus percent -- [Drew] Brees, [Peyton] Manning,
[Tom] Brady -- and they start off the game 6-for-7. They don't start off
2-for-8, and then have to play catchup the whole game. So I think that's
been something I've identified just in watching film this offseason.
Q: Are we talking 60 percent completion percentage?
A: Oh, higher than that.
Q: 65%?
A: Got to be. You shoot for at least 70% a year. That's like where you're
going for, but your first couple of years (chuckle) it's a harder to do that
than just saying it.
Q: Seventy is Joe Montana-esque.
A: That's what we need to win.
Q: So you think that's a realistic goal for you, 70 percent?
A: Absolutely.
http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/serby_sunday_with_mark_sanchez_dOPxsUUZ49zGh3nZRBZk2H
~~~~~~~
Post:
The biggest thing Sanchez has talked about is raising his completion
percentage from 54.8 last year. Schottenheimer and Sanchez spent a day last
week watching every incompletion he threw last year. Schottenheimer said
it's not a matter of Sanchez getting more accurate, just making better
decisions.
"That's a huge thing we want to work on," Schottenheimer said. "With his
ability and his arm talent and his accuracy, there's no reason in the world
that he should be a 54-percent passer. A lot of it is the youth of the first
two years, him feeling windows or I can make that throw and realizing that
NFL football is different than college football. He should have huge jumps
this year. That's what we hope and expect."
http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/jets_set_to_take_to_the_air_djMnqStzdkKZjhhXounRMM
Don't disagree with the analysis of Sanchez...he is has nor played up to the
level to make this team a real contender. You could even say games were
lost because of his play. BUT...anyone who has any level of football
background, knows offenses will see serous issues with the design of the
scheme....as for your other references...how did all those high percentages
work out before when Schott was the OC? When Penny was playing well,
completing passes, and when Favre was...did it win games? Or did the design
of the offense suck so much that even if the QB had a decent to excellent
completion percentage the team still lost and lost because of incredibly
dumb decisions in play calling in critical situations and especially the Red
Zone. I agree with you...Sanchez is a huge liability, but I also have spent
most of my life around the game and I'm convinced Schott is one of many who
got a break because of who he was and who he "knows." And that is a theme
throughout the game...look how many times good old Richie K got recycled and
he was always pathetic.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Importance of Secondary: GB Shredding NO
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/3442d902f64a1c3c?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 9:24 am
From: Harlan Lachman
In article <MMGdnQnt8Yx1DvTTnZ2dnUVZ_u2dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
"Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote:
> "Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:POednT-b27WTF_TTnZ2dnUVZ_sydnZ2d@giganews.com...
> >
> > "JetsLife" <JetsLife@aol.com> wrote in message
> > news:1879aef5-69f9-4afd-a5a3-ccd3c0592bb1@n11g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
> >> It's opening night and things change fast ... especially as
> >> seasons,the season kick in ...
> >>
> >> ... but I the importance of a solid cohesive secondary is just so
> >> critical in today's NFL ...
> >
> > Are you even watching this game????? Green Bay is winning this,
> > dominating it on the line of scrimmage...period. Do you see what is
> > happening? NO players being driven back on O and D...and on top of that
> > both teams scored and both teams have had guys make incredible
> > catches...this is a game won by the line.
> ______________________________________________________________
>
> Now see how it ended...killed from the one yard line...should be an easy
> score...what is important in football and always has been important in
> football first and foremost is a good O and D line. Let's hope the Jets are
> a Hell of a lot better than NO appears to be right now, and the NO defense
> was supposed to be a fairly good one.
True, but no one would compare NO's D to the Jets, especially after last
year's demolishment in Seattle.
I wish both our lines were more dominant. I think the OL is not as good
as touted except for Mangold and DaBrick. I think the DL may be smoke
and mirrors. It is a good thing we have good inside backers and two
outstanding corners.
If our lines play closer to GB's than NO, and Sanchez gets better or no
worse, we will have a winning team.
But, to get to the promised land, both lines need to look better than
they have. Slauson needs to get much better, especially moving side to
side, Ducasse needs to get good enough to replace Woody (absent injury),
and Wilkerson, MTV, Ropati, and Kendrick have to all develop, quickly to
be improvements over Ellis.
I just hope the unsettled Cowboys and Panthers prove to be easy games to
give these players time to get better.
harlan
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 1:12 pm
From: Johnny Morongo
On 9/10/2011 9:24 AM, Harlan Lachman wrote:
> In article<MMGdnQnt8Yx1DvTTnZ2dnUVZ_u2dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> "Papa Carl"<papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>> "Papa Carl"<papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote in message
>> news:POednT-b27WTF_TTnZ2dnUVZ_sydnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>
>>> "JetsLife"<JetsLife@aol.com> wrote in message
>>> news:1879aef5-69f9-4afd-a5a3-ccd3c0592bb1@n11g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
>>>> It's opening night and things change fast ... especially as
>>>> seasons,the season kick in ...
>>>>
>>>> ... but I the importance of a solid cohesive secondary is just so
>>>> critical in today's NFL ...
>>>
>>> Are you even watching this game????? Green Bay is winning this,
>>> dominating it on the line of scrimmage...period. Do you see what is
>>> happening? NO players being driven back on O and D...and on top of that
>>> both teams scored and both teams have had guys make incredible
>>> catches...this is a game won by the line.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>>
>> Now see how it ended...killed from the one yard line...should be an easy
>> score...what is important in football and always has been important in
>> football first and foremost is a good O and D line. Let's hope the Jets are
>> a Hell of a lot better than NO appears to be right now, and the NO defense
>> was supposed to be a fairly good one.
>
> True, but no one would compare NO's D to the Jets, especially after last
> year's demolishment in Seattle.
>
> I wish both our lines were more dominant. I think the OL is not as good
> as touted except for Mangold and DaBrick. I think the DL may be smoke
> and mirrors. It is a good thing we have good inside backers and two
> outstanding corners.
>
> If our lines play closer to GB's than NO, and Sanchez gets better or no
> worse, we will have a winning team.
>
> But, to get to the promised land, both lines need to look better than
> they have. Slauson needs to get much better, especially moving side to
> side, Ducasse needs to get good enough to replace Woody (absent injury),
> and Wilkerson, MTV, Ropati, and Kendrick have to all develop, quickly to
> be improvements over Ellis.
>
> I just hope the unsettled Cowboys and Panthers prove to be easy games to
> give these players time to get better.
>
> harlan
All good points, old guy.
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 2:42 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"Harlan Lachman" <harlan@eeivt.com> wrote in message
news:harlan-B8742A.12244310092011@news60.forteinc.com...
> In article <MMGdnQnt8Yx1DvTTnZ2dnUVZ_u2dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> "Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>> "Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote in message
>> news:POednT-b27WTF_TTnZ2dnUVZ_sydnZ2d@giganews.com...
>> >
>> > "JetsLife" <JetsLife@aol.com> wrote in message
>> > news:1879aef5-69f9-4afd-a5a3-ccd3c0592bb1@n11g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
>> >> It's opening night and things change fast ... especially as
>> >> seasons,the season kick in ...
>> >>
>> >> ... but I the importance of a solid cohesive secondary is just so
>> >> critical in today's NFL ...
>> >
>> > Are you even watching this game????? Green Bay is winning this,
>> > dominating it on the line of scrimmage...period. Do you see what is
>> > happening? NO players being driven back on O and D...and on top of
>> > that
>> > both teams scored and both teams have had guys make incredible
>> > catches...this is a game won by the line.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>>
>> Now see how it ended...killed from the one yard line...should be an easy
>> score...what is important in football and always has been important in
>> football first and foremost is a good O and D line. Let's hope the Jets
>> are
>> a Hell of a lot better than NO appears to be right now, and the NO
>> defense
>> was supposed to be a fairly good one.
>
> True, but no one would compare NO's D to the Jets, especially after last
> year's demolishment in Seattle.
>
> I wish both our lines were more dominant. I think the OL is not as good
> as touted except for Mangold and DaBrick. I think the DL may be smoke
> and mirrors. It is a good thing we have good inside backers and two
> outstanding corners.
>
> If our lines play closer to GB's than NO, and Sanchez gets better or no
> worse, we will have a winning team.
>
> But, to get to the promised land, both lines need to look better than
> they have. Slauson needs to get much better, especially moving side to
> side, Ducasse needs to get good enough to replace Woody (absent injury),
> and Wilkerson, MTV, Ropati, and Kendrick have to all develop, quickly to
> be improvements over Ellis.
>
> I just hope the unsettled Cowboys and Panthers prove to be easy games to
> give these players time to get better.
>
> harlan
I didn't compare NO to the Jets...I pointed out to him his observation was
total crap ! He is touting secondary in a game that was one of the highest
scoring opening games ever. Both QB's threw really well...but I do think GB
is a better team. My point is the game came down to what happened up front
in the end and GB's O line kicked the crap out of NO's D line. My point is
Life apparently lacks any understanding of what he is watching.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Young & Fearless v. Old & Cowardly
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/39a03d5ac411e71f?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 9:39 am
From: Harlan Lachman
In article
<19201870-a4a5-4c4f-91b6-1ed58a101f44@s2g2000vby.googlegroups.com>,
JetsLife <JetsLife@aol.com> wrote:
> Which side do you want to be on?
>
> Here is a hard and painful truth: the current Jets crowd is slightly
> different pre PSL/Met Life Stadium ... and in that crowd is a spirit
> unafraid to want to win at all costs ...
>
> And so you old cowardly folks like Grinch - who can only muster up his
> inner Jets fire and belief when his son witnesses a great comeback win
> last yr v Houston - ya'll are dying your natural deaths, and i thank
> god for it.
>
> It's one thing do die as an old Jet which some day I will ... it's
> another thing to drag the rest of us done with your FEAR and
> negativity ...
>
> This is a NEW DAY and we want JETS WHO BELIEVE COME WHAT MAY ...
>
> Alas I think too many folks in here are just too beaten down and
> fearful to join the fun.
>
> Keep in mind: you old beaten-down negative cowards do not own this
> group. You're like dead weight darkening the current Jets light. And
> we are taking over this group slowly but surely.
>
> I for one will stand for a new outlook. I cherish this group too much.
Life, take your meds. You sound nuts.
1) Fans have no impact other than teams who have real fans who can
afford tickets and attend games giving their teams some home field
advantages.
2) NG flourish when fans with different perspectives, histories, and
skills discuss issues until a truth is fleshed out. I don't want to read
a bunch of band wagon jumpers who have no memory, history or ability to
see what is both wrong and right with a team good enough to compete but
not good enough to win in 42 years.
3) Anyone who is lauding a team that has not won or even played in a SB
in 42 years is drinking too much of the kool aid. It was great to be in
two AFC Championship games. It is not winning the big dance as multiple
teams have done multiple times since we last one. The Jints, Steelers,
Cowboys, 49ers, and Pats have each won 3 SB since we last played in one.
The Raiders, Broncos, Colts, Green Bay, and Foreskins have each won 2.
And, this is shorting Green Bay who have won 4 SB since it started.
Lets win one before we spout off about how good a team we have
harlan
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 11:28 am
From: "JKConey"
"JetsLife" wrote in message
news:19201870-a4a5-4c4f-91b6-1ed58a101f44@s2g2000vby.googlegroups.com...
Which side do you want to be on?
Here is a hard and painful truth: the current Jets crowd is slightly
different pre PSL/Met Life Stadium ... and in that crowd is a spirit
unafraid to want to win at all costs ...
And so you old cowardly folks like Grinch - who can only muster up his
inner Jets fire and belief when his son witnesses a great comeback win
last yr v Houston - ya'll are dying your natural deaths, and i thank
god for it.
I used to like you, your youthful and blind loyalty were fun to read. Now
you've gone over the top, and sound like a real nutcase. You probably won't
even read any of this but I'll give it a try. IT'S JUST A GAME, played by
spoiled millionaires. WE ARE JUST FANS, hoping our team wins. It makes
absolutely no difference what we say or do. We're here to have fun.
-- JK Sinrod
www.MyConeyIslandMemories.com
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Where's Wald...errr, buRford?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/9f219c979f38cac4?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 10:08 am
From: John C TX
On Sep 9, 12:47 pm, Johnny Morongo <Moro...@Burf.com> wrote:
> On 9/8/2011 9:20 AM, John C TX wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 8, 11:12 am, Johnny Morongo<Moro...@Burf.com> wrote:
> >> On 9/8/2011 9:02 AM, John C TX wrote:
>
> >>>> I would agree there is a problem and time will tell if it is Schhott,
> >>>> Sanchez, Ryan or all of them. I would love to know what Ryan thinks of
> >>>> Schott. Bringing in Moore tells me he doesn't think too much of him
> >>>> some of things they do. Other things like Hunter playing TE to me
> >>>> tells me that Ryan has his hand in the offense 7 is Schott or Ryan
> >>>> not being true to themselves but I unlike some I realize I don't know.
>
> >>> & no I won't ever proofread my BS.
>
> >> Well at least you got one part right. ;)
>
> > I think like a broken clock twice a day- the BS& the proofreading.
>
> > :)
>
> > I think TX has become CA. Droughts, fire& pray that our governor is
> > schtupping his maid. 4 years of another Texan is not a distraction
> > this country needs.
>
> Not even if it's Ron Paul?
He is too honest but what a breath of fresh air.
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 2:08 pm
From: graybeard
On Sat, 10 Sep 2011 10:08:41 -0700 (PDT), John C TX
<johnctxjets@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Sep 9, 12:47�pm, Johnny Morongo <Moro...@Burf.com> wrote:
>> On 9/8/2011 9:20 AM, John C TX wrote:
>>
>> > ... 4 years of another Texan is not a distraction
>> > this country needs.
>>
>> Not even if it's Ron Paul?
>
>He is too honest ...
And thus not likely to ever get elected.
--
graybeard
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 2:45 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"graybeard" <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:gbkn6715k7g51rtt2bkmfkp5q5n9036684@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 10 Sep 2011 10:08:41 -0700 (PDT), John C TX
> <johnctxjets@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Sep 9, 12:47 pm, Johnny Morongo <Moro...@Burf.com> wrote:
>>> On 9/8/2011 9:20 AM, John C TX wrote:
>>>
>>> > ... 4 years of another Texan is not a distraction
>>> > this country needs.
>>>
>>> Not even if it's Ron Paul?
>>
>>He is too honest ...
>
> And thus not likely to ever get elected.
> --
> graybeard
And sometimes very honest people can be nuts too...he is honest, says what
he thinks, but he's still a little whacked IMHO...but he does get my
interest. And John...I agree....Perry is a nightmare...the one time
Democrat who was on the side of Al Gore flips quite often...it appears he
has now gone to the Marjo Gortner Academy of Evangelism to learn his public
speaking skills. He'd be best served with mustard on a bun.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Defense, O-Line, QB: Jets v. Cowboys, In General
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/1164eaba7ff247be?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 11:45 am
From: Señor Patriots
On Sep 8, 3:42 pm, JetsLife <JetsL...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> Otherwise lots of folks seem to be discounting Dallas this season ...
> I think that could be a mistake considering how they performed under
> Garrett last year - and that was with Kitna at QB.
I agree. It's a mistake to discount the 'Boys. Rob Ryan will have
that defense playing better. That we can take to our local bank. The
Dallas offense has always been potent. So there is the 1 + 1 in my
book. I will not be shocked to see them win the division. I think
the Eagles are too hyped and the Cowboys will be flying under the
radar with zero pressure on them.
I expect the Jets and 'Boys to give me the type of game I have always
loved to watch: Defense dominating with a close finish.
Same with Pats-Dolphins I suspect because the Dolphins have a better
defense than most people want to admit.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: HOUSTON TEXANS 2011 DIVISION WINNERS
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/a3f1e2648f2b8868?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 11:49 am
From: Señor Patriots
On Sep 8, 4:48 pm, "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Señor Patriots" <paul.lebl...@bluebottle.com> wrote in message
>
> news:2879e704-6837-431e-bac9-7f430b0c6190@y4g2000vbx.googlegroups.com...
> On Sep 8, 3:03 pm, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> all he said was the Dolts are fucked without Manning, so spare us your
> holier than thou sanctimonious bullshit.
Hey, somebody has to remind you guys that football is actually number
two in the universe. It's not my fault you talk about football
injuries as if they are entertainment or Christmas presents.
> the Dolts built their entire offense around Manning and without him they are
> doomed.
I think I get that point, not that you were trying to be sanctimonious
or anything.
== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 11:47 am
From: Señor Patriots
On Sep 8, 3:42 pm, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 4:25 pm, Señor Patriots <paul.lebl...@bluebottle.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 8, 3:03 pm, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> > > Manning having surgery. Out for at least four months.
>
> > This is not good for the NFL. It's not good for the Texans. It's not
> > good for the Patriots, who have been the marquee matchup with the
> > Colts since Jeezuz walked the earth. IMO, only terrified (of Manning)
> > losers are glad to see him go. Any real fan of the sport, or any real
> > Texans fan has to feel a huge let down over this because the level of
> > competition has been hurt. The guy is a straight up great player and
> > gifted leader, and I can't see this as good for any fan of the sport.
>
> > There are fans who are not fans of the sport, though. I'm afraid
> > their IQ isn't able to fill a thimble and they will be dancing in the
> > streets down in Houston.
>
> > Sigh ... do we really think sports fantasies are bigger than life?
>
> it is not bad for anyone other than manning and colts fans...
> remember, some other guy had to lose his job before brady and manning
> got theirs... this game ends for everybody. all that means is new
> stars are born and the ballance of power between rivals constantly
> shifts. it makes for a better sport.
I don't know how you can say that about a venerable star of the NFL.
It's like watching Joe Montana sitting on the sidelines against the
Bills in the driving rain with a concussion. I mean how can you watch
that and feel like it's good for the NFL? Sure, it's his time to go,
I get that point, but who said they wanted him to go at all?
== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 1:09 pm
From: Johnny Morongo
On 9/8/2011 2:48 PM, Ray O'Hara wrote:
> "Se�or Patriots"<paul.leblanc@bluebottle.com> wrote in message
> news:2879e704-6837-431e-bac9-7f430b0c6190@y4g2000vbx.googlegroups.com...
> On Sep 8, 3:03 pm, Michael<mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
>> Manning having surgery. Out for at least four months.
>
> This is not good for the NFL. It's not good for the Texans. It's not
> good for the Patriots, who have been the marquee matchup with the
> Colts since Jeezuz walked the earth. IMO, only terrified (of Manning)
> losers are glad to see him go. Any real fan of the sport, or any real
> Texans fan has to feel a huge let down over this because the level of
> competition has been hurt. The guy is a straight up great player and
> gifted leader, and I can't see this as good for any fan of the sport.
>
> There are fans who are not fans of the sport, though. I'm afraid
> their IQ isn't able to fill a thimble and they will be dancing in the
> streets down in Houston.
>
> Sigh ... do we really think sports fantasies are bigger than life?
>
>
> ==============================================================================
>
> all he said was the Dolts are fucked without Manning, so spare us your
> holier than thou sanctimonious bullshit.
> the Dolts built their entire offense around Manning and without him they are
> doomed.
>
>
As would be the Patsies without Marsha.
== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 2:50 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"Se�or Patriots" <paul.leblanc@bluebottle.com> wrote in message
news:a7288c9c-74b7-4dc5-a658-a48a79b94df7@d2g2000vbk.googlegroups.com...
On Sep 8, 3:42 pm, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Sep 8, 4:25 pm, Se�or Patriots <paul.lebl...@bluebottle.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 8, 3:03 pm, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> > > Manning having surgery. Out for at least four months.
>
> > This is not good for the NFL. It's not good for the Texans. It's not
> > good for the Patriots, who have been the marquee matchup with the
> > Colts since Jeezuz walked the earth. IMO, only terrified (of Manning)
> > losers are glad to see him go. Any real fan of the sport, or any real
> > Texans fan has to feel a huge let down over this because the level of
> > competition has been hurt. The guy is a straight up great player and
> > gifted leader, and I can't see this as good for any fan of the sport.
>
> > There are fans who are not fans of the sport, though. I'm afraid
> > their IQ isn't able to fill a thimble and they will be dancing in the
> > streets down in Houston.
>
> > Sigh ... do we really think sports fantasies are bigger than life?
>
> it is not bad for anyone other than manning and colts fans...
> remember, some other guy had to lose his job before brady and manning
> got theirs... this game ends for everybody. all that means is new
> stars are born and the ballance of power between rivals constantly
> shifts. it makes for a better sport.
I don't know how you can say that about a venerable star of the NFL.
It's like watching Joe Montana sitting on the sidelines against the
Bills in the driving rain with a concussion. I mean how can you watch
that and feel like it's good for the NFL? Sure, it's his time to go,
I get that point, but who said they wanted him to go at all?
I agree completely...anytime a great player leaves the game prematurely it
is a loss to the game. Even though I don't like or root for the Colts..he
was very exciting to watch. I live in Central Jersey...I'm not an Eagles
fan...but I do really enjoy watching the new Vick play..because he does it
well. To me, if you are a real football fan, you can enjoy a good player no
matter who he plays for. I was at the old stadium the day Dan Marino staged
the big comeback and pulled off the fake spike deal...I was anguished by
that loss...but the football fan in me could not help but appreciate and
love what Marino could do. I enjoyed watching him play, because he was
tough, and consistent and always showed courage. If you don't get that, and
can only appreciate something YOUR team does...then you are not really a
football fan, but rather just a fan of a particular locality or color of
uniform or whatever, but not of the game. My rant, sorry.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Jets preview via PFR.com
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/6a234c0a87891dad?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 5:32 pm
From: Grinch
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/?p=9248
The gist...
Upside: Defense looks more improved than most people think over last year's, which was plenty good to start with.
Downside: "In the pasisng game, 'third-year Mark Sanchez' should be better than versions 1.0 and 2.0. But what about his targets?
"Adding Holmes made the offense much more explosive in 2010, but replacing Edwards, Cotchery and Brad Smith with Burress, Mason and rookie Jeremy Kerley is the big wildcard. I view that as a noticeable downgrade, but the front offense and some fans seem to think the Jets got stronger at receiver. If the front office is right, the Jets' passing game will continue to improve and put the team in position to reach all of its goals.
"But I don't think Burress will provide the production that Edwards did last season, and it's hard to imagine Kerley contributing as impressively as Brad Smith has over the past few seasons. Derrick Mason had a better career than Cotchery, but Mason will be 38 before the Super Bowl. Is he going to be better than Cotchery was at ages 27 and 28?
"Simply put, the offensive line and the wide receiver group look worse entering 2011 than they did entering 2010, while the running game comes with more question marks.
"The only hope for the offense? An emergence by Mark Sanchez into an above-average quarterback. Considering Sanchez ranked 29th out of 32 quarterbacks in net yards per attempt in 2010, there is obviously lots of room for improvement..."
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 6:14 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"Grinch" <oldnasty@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:093e1f07-fe46-4341-b2cb-2da851a70f63@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com...
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/?p=9248
The gist...
Upside: Defense looks more improved than most people think over last
year's, which was plenty good to start with.
Downside: "In the pasisng game, 'third-year Mark Sanchez' should be better
than versions 1.0 and 2.0. But what about his targets?
"Adding Holmes made the offense much more explosive in 2010, but replacing
Edwards, Cotchery and Brad Smith with Burress, Mason and rookie Jeremy
Kerley is the big wildcard. I view that as a noticeable downgrade, but the
front offense and some fans seem to think the Jets got stronger at receiver.
If the front office is right, the Jets' passing game will continue to
improve and put the team in position to reach all of its goals.
"But I don't think Burress will provide the production that Edwards did last
season, and it's hard to imagine Kerley contributing as impressively as Brad
Smith has over the past few seasons. Derrick Mason had a better career than
Cotchery, but Mason will be 38 before the Super Bowl. Is he going to be
better than Cotchery was at ages 27 and 28?
"Simply put, the offensive line and the wide receiver group look worse
entering 2011 than they did entering 2010, while the running game comes with
more question marks.
"The only hope for the offense? An emergence by Mark Sanchez into an
above-average quarterback. Considering Sanchez ranked 29th out of 32
quarterbacks in net yards per attempt in 2010, there is obviously lots of
room for improvement..."
_________________________________________________________________________________________________
I'm right on with this....totally. I think losing Edwards and Cotch and
getting Burress and Mason is a downgrade not to mention new targets for a
very shaky QB to develop with.
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Sep 10 2011 7:34 pm
From: Johnny Morongo
On 9/10/2011 5:32 PM, Grinch wrote:
>
> http://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/?p=9248
>
> The gist...
>
> Upside: Defense looks more improved than most people think over last year's, which was plenty good to start with.
>
> Downside: "In the pasisng game, 'third-year Mark Sanchez' should be better than versions 1.0 and 2.0. But what about his targets?
>
> "Adding Holmes made the offense much more explosive in 2010, but replacing Edwards, Cotchery and Brad Smith with Burress, Mason and rookie Jeremy Kerley is the big wildcard. I view that as a noticeable downgrade, but the front offense and some fans seem to think the Jets got stronger at receiver. If the front office is right, the Jets' passing game will continue to improve and put the team in position to reach all of its goals.
>
> "But I don't think Burress will provide the production that Edwards did last season, and it's hard to imagine Kerley contributing as impressively as Brad Smith has over the past few seasons. Derrick Mason had a better career than Cotchery, but Mason will be 38 before the Super Bowl. Is he going to be better than Cotchery was at ages 27 and 28?
>
> "Simply put, the offensive line and the wide receiver group look worse entering 2011 than they did entering 2010, while the running game comes with more question marks.
>
> "The only hope for the offense? An emergence by Mark Sanchez into an above-average quarterback. Considering Sanchez ranked 29th out of 32 quarterbacks in net yards per attempt in 2010, there is obviously lots of room for improvement..."
>
How many times will we have to concede that Sanchez has to improve? We
get that. Shut up already. But given that, when are you going to
concede that Schitty has to improve as a play caller too? And when are
you going to acknowledge that it was the DEFENSE that dropped the ball
as often as not, especially in the 1st half against the Steelers?
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