alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets?hl=enalt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets@googlegroups.com
Today's topics:
* OT: "I did it for the fans". You all saw this, but... - 2 messages, 2
authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/9487a4e76c1bed95?hl=en
* Insanity: Jets, OT - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/95948db773183973?hl=en
* Maybin back with Jets to help pass rush - 10 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/e04e18d4ca4b8e7c?hl=en
* Best Jet LB in team history ??? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/c613db9e923f88e6?hl=en
* K. Ellis ??? - 6 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/0c26cb85d644fc32?hl=en
* Very Interesting Thing About Jets Team "Personality" - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/f38be8c55c4afc89?hl=en
* Just thought I'd mention - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/413b78a1842e534d?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT: "I did it for the fans". You all saw this, but...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/9487a4e76c1bed95?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Sep 29 2011 10:42 pm
From: oldnasty@mindspring.com
"The fans have to understand, they have to be happy for me"
~~~~~~~~~
NY Post:
Reyes booed after leaving game
In a one-and-done appearance, the All-Star shortstop's batting title pursuit trumped all other considerations, bringing a chorus of boos from the small crowd — maybe 20,000 — at Citi Field that hoped to savor Reyes for possibly the last time.
Reyes bunted for a single in the first inning and was promptly removed from the game with a .337 average ...
Reyes decided before taking the field he wanted out if he got a hit in his first at-bat. It was a decision supported by manager Terry Collins, who didn't want to risk losing the trust of a valued player whom the Mets will attempt to re-sign this offseason.
"It's kind of tough. I wanted to stay in the game," Reyes said. "But [fans] have to understand, too, what's going on. They have to feel happy about it if I win the batting title. I do that for the team, and the fans, too."
Collins hinted before the game that Reyes could depart early, but few could have suspected he meant one at-bat. A stunned silence, followed by a scattering of boos, overtook the ballpark as Justin Turner was announced as the pinch runner for Reyes.
"We talked [yesterday] morning when [Reyes] came in and I asked him how he wanted to go about this," Collins said. "I wanted to take him out at the appropriate time. He said if he got a hit his first time up he wanted to come out. I said, 'I want you to win this thing,' and he said, 'That's what I want to do.' It was decided then."
Collins got emotional discussing the dilemma he faced, trying to placate the fans and Reyes, who will be a free agent.
"I understand, and I've heard some comments in the stands, and I don't blame them," Collins said. "People pay a good price to come to these games, and they've got to understand that I ask these players to do a lot. [But] we worked hard to get [fans'] respect this year and they deserve ours.
"If I don't follow [Reyes' request], I could possibly lose the one thing I helped create all summer long in one instance, and I wasn't going to let that happen today," Collins added. "I can understand anybody in this room or in the stands being upset or being offended by it, I truly understand it."
~~~~~~~~~~~
After he got the bunt hit, he didn't even stay in to run it out. "Get a pinch runner in here so I can get out of here ... for the fans!"
Ted Williams he ain't.
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 6:10 am
From: John C TX
X-No-Archive: Yes
> "The fans have to understand, they have to be happy for me"
> ~~~~~~~~~
>
> NY Post:
>
> Reyes booed after leaving game
>
> In a one-and-done appearance, the All-Star shortstop's batting title pursuit trumped all other considerations, bringing a chorus of boos from the small crowd — maybe 20,000 — at Citi Field that hoped to savor Reyes for possibly the last time.
>
> Reyes bunted for a single in the first inning and was promptly removed from the game with a .337 average ...
>
> Reyes decided before taking the field he wanted out if he got a hit in his first at-bat. It was a decision supported by manager Terry Collins, who didn't want to risk losing the trust of a valued player whom the Mets will attempt to re-sign this offseason.
>
> "It's kind of tough. I wanted to stay in the game," Reyes said. "But [fans] have to understand, too, what's going on. They have to feel happy about it if I win the batting title. I do that for the team, and the fans, too."
>
> Collins hinted before the game that Reyes could depart early, but few could have suspected he meant one at-bat. A stunned silence, followed by a scattering of boos, overtook the ballpark as Justin Turner was announced as the pinch runner for Reyes.
>
> "We talked [yesterday] morning when [Reyes] came in and I asked him how he wanted to go about this," Collins said. "I wanted to take him out at the appropriate time. He said if he got a hit his first time up he wanted to come out. I said, 'I want you to win this thing,' and he said, 'That's what I want to do.' It was decided then."
>
> Collins got emotional discussing the dilemma he faced, trying to placate the fans and Reyes, who will be a free agent.
>
> "I understand, and I've heard some comments in the stands, and I don't blame them," Collins said. "People pay a good price to come to these games, and they've got to understand that I ask these players to do a lot. [But] we worked hard to get [fans'] respect this year and they deserve ours.
>
> "If I don't follow [Reyes' request], I could possibly lose the one thing I helped create all summer long in one instance, and I wasn't going to let that happen today," Collins added. "I can understand anybody in this room or in the stands being upset or being offended by it, I truly understand it."
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~
> After he got the bunt hit, he didn't even stay in to run it out. "Get a pinch runner in here so I can get out of here ... for the fans!"
>
> Ted Williams he ain't.
If he did to help his negotiating position I think it will actually
work the other way. Would you want to give him 7 years at 150 MM?
I respect Collins as he was out of a manager gig for 13 years. The
players at least know that when the game doesn't matter he will do
what is bets for the player.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Insanity: Jets, OT
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/95948db773183973?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 12:42 am
From: oldnasty@mindspring.com
On Wednesday, September 28, 2011 9:44:16 PM UTC-4, JetsLife wrote:
> I was talking with my wife the other day about "radicalism," radical
> politics.
>
> And I realized: so if turning away from your conscience and acting on
> it is "radical" - that means doing otherwise is "normal"?
>
> Point being: I think that most folks myself included who act normal,
> follow rules, pay taxes, etc etc - in fact we're the radicals. We
> allow our youth to go off and fight in foreign lands far away from
> their loved ones - and for what?
>
> Is that normal? To me *that* is radical, abnormal, utterly nuts. And
> at that - the way we go about our lives pretending people aren't being
> semi slave-waged worked to death for our comfort conveniences?
>
> So who is "radical," really? What is normal? The prevailing culture,
> slotting oneself in to it and pretending nothing's wrong with doing
> so?
>
> As for the Jets: two points.
>
> - When I dare mention that desire, the outfit that wants it the most
> being critical to victory:
>
> Thus far unless I've missed some posts most responses have largely
> been: 'desire doesn't matter' etc.
>
> Which couldn't be furthest from historical truth. It's an axiom as old
> as time: you only get what you really want.
>
> The examples in sports/general history are as numbered as the days:
> '85 Bears - yes great talent but that defense was infused with fire.
> Same thing '00 Ravens.
>
> Do you think the Steelers didn't come out more fiery, desirous revved-
> up than the Jets beginning the AFC Championship? Or the Raiders
> offense last week from whistle to whistle?
>
> All of these winners - coaches and players alike - wanted it more than
> the other side.
I don't believe that for a minute.
> Yet seemingly at the first mention of desire being a key part to
> victory for the Jets or any outfit - people say talent this, something
> that.
>
> Historical perspective: as anyone knows Nazi Germany had the will to
> fight - England & France didn't, Hitler knew they were weak. Germany
> was hungry for some payback.
>
> Pearl Harbor, 9/11 attacks: those folks had a burning desire - as
> wrong as they were - to do it. And they ignited wars.
Desire only goes so far.
Yeah, the Japanese were full of desire and will to fight at Pearl Harbor.
Do you think they were any less full of them at Midway? And at every other defeat they took all the way back until US battleships sailed into Tokyo Bay?
There is no doubt about it, in a *real* war, not pretend war like football, the Japanese fought with FAR MORE desire than US troops did all the way through. Americans have never made suicides stands to the very last man, one after another, again and again, like the Japanes did -- all the way backward to utter defeat.
American troops never once did *anything* like pull out their bayonets and swords and suicide charge straight into barbed wire and machine guns screaming "For FDR!!! Banzai!!". Or fly suicide planes into enemy ships. Yet they wound up surrendering prostrate before us in Tokyo Bay.
So exactly what did all that extra desire and will to fight get the Japanese?
How did they get so destroyed by an enemy that fought far less furiously?
Simple: They were stupid enough to let their desire lead them into attacking an enemy that was literally 20 times bigger than them -- that could materially crush them pretty much as a sideline while directing three-quarters of its war effort to Europe and also sending enough supplies for a major war to Russia.
If the Japanese hadn't let their great desire and will to fight overcome their brains, they wouldn't have gotten NUKED. Twice.
And the Germans, oh, yeah, they had great desire for payback too!
And if they hadn't let it overcome their brains, they wouldn't have ended up with their entire country in rubble -- and half of it occupied by their mortal enemy Russian Communists for 45 years.
Yes, the Germans had far more desire for victory and will to fight than anyone else in Europe, certainly in 1940 that was true. But all that extra desire couldn't get them across that little strip of water to attack their enemy -- because they didn't have a navy and their enemy did.
Which meant .... they picked an enemy they couldn't beat, no matter what its deficiency in desire to fight. Oooops. That's called *bad game planning*. A little while later, Berlin is being divvied up four way by its "desire deficient" enemies. Well, deficient game planning trumps superior desire right there.
Maybe there's a lesson in these examples of history: When your desire becomes so great that it blocks your brain from working, your desire starts making you act *stupid*, you are going *to lose*. It's better to keep your brain controlling your desires.
So, desire can get you into a fight, sure -- but does it make you win? Think again.
Napoleon said: "God is on the side of the big battalions".
And so it is in football.
> And on and on through history. Desire and aggression force results
> sometimes victorious. The opposite: weakness invites attack, and never
> wins.
Dude, you are confusing "desire" with "strength" and "lack of desire" with "weakness".
That is a BIG MISTAKE, as the Japanese, Germans, and a whole lot of others have found out via very painful lessons.
Strength wins, weakness loses -- that is *true*.
But desire and weakness often travel hand in hand. Bear Bryant said: "Nobody wants to win more than a loser".
Being weak and so desiring to win that you can taste it doesn't make you strong.
Being strong and taking it for granted doesn't make you weak.
Combining desire and agression against the stronger winds up with you having a foot pressing down on your throat. Ask Tojo and Adolf about that.
>
> - Why is it some folks in here start going, well, semi insane three
> games in to the campaign?
>
> That's why I say "O Ye of Little Faith."
>
> Every NFL campaign is a week-to-week event. All of us would've
> preferred to be 3-0 waltzing in to Baltimore.
>
> To me be we 0-3, 1-2, 2-1, 3-0: these are the regular-season games you
> live for. It's a chance at payback for those fuckers beating us at
> home last year.
Now these four thoughts I agree with entirely.
(Though what they have with to do with all the "desire and aggression" stuff I don't know).
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 9:24 am
From: Johnny Morongo
On 9/30/2011 12:42 AM, oldnasty@mindspring.com wrote:
>
> Desire only goes so far.
>
> Yeah, the Japanese were full of desire and will to fight at Pearl Harbor.
>
> Do you think they were any less full of them at Midway? And at every other defeat they took all the way back until US battleships sailed into Tokyo Bay?
>
> There is no doubt about it, in a *real* war, not pretend war like football, the Japanese fought with FAR MORE desire than US troops did all the way through. Americans have never made suicides stands to the very last man, one after another, again and again, like the Japanes did -- all the way backward to utter defeat.
>
> American troops never once did *anything* like pull out their bayonets and swords and suicide charge straight into barbed wire and machine guns screaming "For FDR!!! Banzai!!". Or fly suicide planes into enemy ships. Yet they wound up surrendering prostrate before us in Tokyo Bay.
>
> So exactly what did all that extra desire and will to fight get the Japanese?
>
> How did they get so destroyed by an enemy that fought far less furiously?
>
> Simple: They were stupid enough to let their desire lead them into attacking an enemy that was literally 20 times bigger than them -- that could materially crush them pretty much as a sideline while directing three-quarters of its war effort to Europe and also sending enough supplies for a major war to Russia.
>
> If the Japanese hadn't let their great desire and will to fight overcome their brains, they wouldn't have gotten NUKED. Twice.
>
> And the Germans, oh, yeah, they had great desire for payback too!
>
> And if they hadn't let it overcome their brains, they wouldn't have ended up with their entire country in rubble -- and half of it occupied by their mortal enemy Russian Communists for 45 years.
>
> Yes, the Germans had far more desire for victory and will to fight than anyone else in Europe, certainly in 1940 that was true. But all that extra desire couldn't get them across that little strip of water to attack their enemy -- because they didn't have a navy and their enemy did.
>
> Which meant .... they picked an enemy they couldn't beat, no matter what its deficiency in desire to fight. Oooops. That's called *bad game planning*. A little while later, Berlin is being divvied up four way by its "desire deficient" enemies. Well, deficient game planning trumps superior desire right there.
>
> Maybe there's a lesson in these examples of history: When your desire becomes so great that it blocks your brain from working, your desire starts making you act *stupid*, you are going *to lose*. It's better to keep your brain controlling your desires.
>
> So, desire can get you into a fight, sure -- but does it make you win? Think again.
>
> Napoleon said: "God is on the side of the big battalions".
>
> And so it is in football.
>
>> And on and on through history. Desire and aggression force results
>> sometimes victorious. The opposite: weakness invites attack, and never
>> wins.
>
> Dude, you are confusing "desire" with "strength" and "lack of desire" with "weakness".
>
> That is a BIG MISTAKE, as the Japanese, Germans, and a whole lot of others have found out via very painful lessons.
>
> Strength wins, weakness loses -- that is *true*.
>
> But desire and weakness often travel hand in hand. Bear Bryant said: "Nobody wants to win more than a loser".
>
> Being weak and so desiring to win that you can taste it doesn't make you strong.
>
> Being strong and taking it for granted doesn't make you weak.
>
> Combining desire and agression against the stronger winds up with you having a foot pressing down on your throat. Ask Tojo and Adolf about that.
>
>>
>> - Why is it some folks in here start going, well, semi insane three
>> games in to the campaign?
>>
>> That's why I say "O Ye of Little Faith."
>>
>> Every NFL campaign is a week-to-week event. All of us would've
>> preferred to be 3-0 waltzing in to Baltimore.
>>
>> To me be we 0-3, 1-2, 2-1, 3-0: these are the regular-season games you
>> live for. It's a chance at payback for those fuckers beating us at
>> home last year.
>
> Now these four thoughts I agree with entirely.
>
> (Though what they have with to do with all the "desire and aggression" stuff I don't know).
Nice riff,G, most of it anyway. But by any name you still are an
oldnastyfuk.
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 2:37 pm
From: "R�vNsf�n �"
"Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:kt6dncd4h6OiJxnTnZ2dnUVZ_tCdnZ2d@giganews.com...
:
: "Michael" <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote in message
: news:953af87a-bd8b-49a1-bb57-916e5265dabc@g33g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
: On Sep 29, 12:11 am, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
: > "JetsLife" <JetsL...@aol.com> wrote in message
: >
: > news:49d50adb-86e0-463e-bb3e-bc70cacece72@5g2000yqo.googlegroups.com...
: >
: >
: >
: >
: >
: > >I was talking with my wife the other day about "radicalism," radical
: > > politics.
: >
: > > And I realized: so if turning away from your conscience and acting on
: > > it is "radical" - that means doing otherwise is "normal"?
: >
: > > Point being: I think that most folks myself included who act normal,
: > > follow rules, pay taxes, etc etc - in fact we're the radicals. We
: > > allow our youth to go off and fight in foreign lands far away from
: > > their loved ones - and for what?
: >
: > > Is that normal? To me *that* is radical, abnormal, utterly nuts. And
: > > at that - the way we go about our lives pretending people aren't being
: > > semi slave-waged worked to death for our comfort conveniences?
: >
: > > So who is "radical," really? What is normal? The prevailing culture,
: > > slotting oneself in to it and pretending nothing's wrong with doing
: > > so?
: >
: > > As for the Jets: two points.
: >
: > > - When I dare mention that desire, the outfit that wants it the most
: > > being critical to victory:
: >
: > > Thus far unless I've missed some posts most responses have largely
: > > been: 'desire doesn't matter' etc.
: >
: > > Which couldn't be furthest from historical truth. It's an axiom as old
: > > as time: you only get what you really want.
: >
: > > The examples in sports/general history are as numbered as the days:
: > > '85 Bears - yes great talent but that defense was infused with fire.
: > > Same thing '00 Ravens.
: >
: > > Do you think the Steelers didn't come out more fiery, desirous revved-
: > > up than the Jets beginning the AFC Championship? Or the Raiders
: > > offense last week from whistle to whistle?
: >
: > > All of these winners - coaches and players alike - wanted it more than
: > > the other side.
: >
: > > Yet seemingly at the first mention of desire being a key part to
: > > victory for the Jets or any outfit - people say talent this, something
: > > that.
: >
: > > Historical perspective: as anyone knows Nazi Germany had the will to
: > > fight - England & France didn't, Hitler knew they were weak. Germany
: > > was hungry for some payback.
: >
: > > Pearl Harbor, 9/11 attacks: those folks had a burning desire - as
: > > wrong as they were - to do it. And they ignited wars.
: >
: > > And on and on through history. Desire and aggression force results
: > > sometimes victorious. The opposite: weakness invites attack, and never
: > > wins.
: >
: > > I feel Rex knows as much.
: >
: > > - Why is it some folks in here start going, well, semi insane three
: > > games in to the campaign?
: >
: > > That's why I say "O Ye of Little Faith."
: >
: > > Every NFL campaign is a week-to-week event. All of us would've
: > > preferred to be 3-0 waltzing in to Baltimore.
: >
: > > To me be we 0-3, 1-2, 2-1, 3-0: these are the regular-season games you
: > > live for. It's a chance at payback for those fuckers beating us at
: > > home last year.
: >
: > Take a break...seriously...you think about this crap way too much. It's
a
: > game...just a game.- Hide quoted text -
: >
: > - Show quoted text -
:
: yes, but it is usually more fun to think about than other things :-)
:
: OH...I quite agree...I admit my error on that one...but don't obsess about
a
: team you can't control...watch it, criticize it, praise it...but we don't
: play the game and honestly, today, they don't play it for us
either....it's
: all about the money. I'll give you they play for themselves as a team but
I
: don't really think they worry too much about what any of us think. Could
be
: wrong...
...and if you are wrong I will never consider an oceanic cruise for fear of
falling off the face of the cube.
--
~Drew
"Talk is cheap ...lets just go play"
Johnny Unitas - Baltimore Colts
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Maybin back with Jets to help pass rush
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/e04e18d4ca4b8e7c?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 6:13 am
From: John C TX
On Sep 29, 8:00 pm, buRford <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 29 Sep 2011 10:57:13 -0700 (PDT), John C TX <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >X-No-Archive: Yes
> >> Is this a desperate/panic move ? Are things that bad that they have to
> >> resign a guy they cut and no one picked up?
>
> >> I would imagine he's brought in more for his speed than his pass
> >> rushing ability.
>
> >>http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/maybin_back_with_jets_to_shore_up...
>
> >Maybe to light a fire up Westerman or maybe Westerman is that bad.
>
> I've never understood the love-affair with Westerman. What's he ever done?
> Maybin has the speed, & in the short time he was here, he showed little flashes.
> His problem is his size... he needs to add bulk to really be a LB.
> I always thought he might be interesting at safety ;)
At 240 he is small & I know you are joking but someone has to make up
Coleman's & Lowery's sacks.
== 2 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 6:26 am
From: John C TX
On Sep 29, 1:50 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "John C TX" <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:c67e3823-27ac-4ebe-8629-cab9702d8f12@t11g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > X-No-Archive: Yes
> >> >> Is this a desperate/panic move ? Are things that bad that they have to
> >> >> resign a guy they cut and no one picked up?
>
> >> >> I would imagine he's brought in more for his speed than his pass
> >> >> rushing ability.
>
> >> >>http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/maybin_back_with_jets_to_shore_up...
>
> >> > Maybe to light a fire up Westerman or maybe Westerman is that bad.
>
> >> Somebody is hurt and we don't know who...or how badly....that's my guess.
>
> > That would be against the rules.
>
> > :)
>
> > Remember though they IR'd two players this week so that was two
> > spots. They added Baker the TE to replace Cumberland so maybe it is
> > just a matter of best available.
>
> Wow...that is scary then..."best available" ? They are very thin....
Best available based on their needs. The only place that there is a
bigger need is OL. Maybe based on what they need sunday that isn't
the biggest worry.
I wish we had more depth on the line but based on what Ellis has shown
the Pats I am probably wrong on that one although like Faneca last
year he would be nice to have on the bench.
== 3 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 6:30 am
From: John C TX
>He is quick, but not big or powerful...so will he be used to rush the
> passer or what?
I think that is all he is there for as outside of Pace we don't have
much in the front 7 to accomplish that goal.
== 4 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 8:27 am
From: "Papa Carl"
"John C TX" <johnctxjets@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:5bb39f3c-ada8-4c3e-973f-784ef512bb00@b6g2000vbz.googlegroups.com...
> >He is quick, but not big or powerful...so will he be used to rush the
>> passer or what?
>
> I think that is all he is there for as outside of Pace we don't have
> much in the front 7 to accomplish that goal.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
And we agree....and that is just as big of a problem as the depth in the O
line...for some reason or reasons they had to let a lot of fairly obvious
things slide.
== 5 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 9:26 am
From: Johnny Morongo
On 9/30/2011 6:13 AM, John C TX wrote:
> On Sep 29, 8:00 pm, buRford<buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 29 Sep 2011 10:57:13 -0700 (PDT), John C TX<johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> X-No-Archive: Yes
>>>> Is this a desperate/panic move ? Are things that bad that they have to
>>>> resign a guy they cut and no one picked up?
>>
>>>> I would imagine he's brought in more for his speed than his pass
>>>> rushing ability.
>>
>>>> http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/maybin_back_with_jets_to_shore_up...
>>
>>> Maybe to light a fire up Westerman or maybe Westerman is that bad.
>>
>> I've never understood the love-affair with Westerman. What's he ever done?
>> Maybin has the speed,& in the short time he was here, he showed little flashes.
>> His problem is his size... he needs to add bulk to really be a LB.
>> I always thought he might be interesting at safety ;)
>
> At 240 he is small& I know you are joking but someone has to make up
> Coleman's& Lowery's sacks.
You know, from the little I saw of him he looked to me to have the speed
of a safety.
== 6 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 10:56 am
From: John C TX
On Sep 30, 10:27 am, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "John C TX" <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:5bb39f3c-ada8-4c3e-973f-784ef512bb00@b6g2000vbz.googlegroups.com...
>
> > >He is quick, but not big or powerful...so will he be used to rush the
> >> passer or what?
>
> > I think that is all he is there for as outside of Pace we don't have
> > much in the front 7 to accomplish that goal.
>
> And we agree....and that is just as big of a problem as the depth in the O
> line...for some reason or reasons they had to let a lot of fairly obvious
> things slide.
They bet on Jenkins last year but this year really had o plan.
Perhaps they thought that Mo & Rippppppppppoioipoi[opipoupupoup would
help but I would have chased one big body.
== 7 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 10:57 am
From: John C TX
On Sep 30, 11:26 am, Johnny Morongo <Moro...@Burf.com> wrote:
> On 9/30/2011 6:13 AM, John C TX wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 29, 8:00 pm, buRford<buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
> >> On Thu, 29 Sep 2011 10:57:13 -0700 (PDT), John C TX<johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>> X-No-Archive: Yes
> >>>> Is this a desperate/panic move ? Are things that bad that they have to
> >>>> resign a guy they cut and no one picked up?
>
> >>>> I would imagine he's brought in more for his speed than his pass
> >>>> rushing ability.
>
> >>>>http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/maybin_back_with_jets_to_shore_up...
>
> >>> Maybe to light a fire up Westerman or maybe Westerman is that bad.
>
> >> I've never understood the love-affair with Westerman. What's he ever done?
> >> Maybin has the speed,& in the short time he was here, he showed little flashes.
> >> His problem is his size... he needs to add bulk to really be a LB.
> >> I always thought he might be interesting at safety ;)
>
> > At 240 he is small& I know you are joking but someone has to make up
> > Coleman's& Lowery's sacks.
>
> You know, from the little I saw of him he looked to me to have the speed
> of a safety.
He did get back there. Does he look better playing with 1st string
vs 1st string?
== 8 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 3:01 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"John C TX" <johnctxjets@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:3d3ddfcb-b8e5-44de-a627-6856332eaa83@n36g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
On Sep 30, 10:27 am, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "John C TX" <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote in
> messagenews:5bb39f3c-ada8-4c3e-973f-784ef512bb00@b6g2000vbz.googlegroups.com...
>
> > >He is quick, but not big or powerful...so will he be used to rush the
> >> passer or what?
>
> > I think that is all he is there for as outside of Pace we don't have
> > much in the front 7 to accomplish that goal.
>
> And we agree....and that is just as big of a problem as the depth in the O
> line...for some reason or reasons they had to let a lot of fairly obvious
> things slide.
They bet on Jenkins last year but this year really had o plan.
Perhaps they thought that Mo & Rippppppppppoioipoi[opipoupupoup would
help but I would have chased one big body.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I know you are closer to Mexico and some good weed...but slow down on that
stuff :-) That betting on Jenkins last year was a bad decision...and now a
worse one on top of it. I'm really feeling like Rex sells his ability to
scheme well...they buy into it...and it can work a little...but not
ultimately...they need the bodies that can produce...I don't see it
happening now. Despite how in love Michael is with the two inside
guys...they are just OK...the big threat does not exist at all...we will see
how they can stop an inside run this week...I don't think they can.
== 9 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 3:43 pm
From: Johnny Morongo
On 9/30/2011 10:57 AM, John C TX wrote:
> On Sep 30, 11:26 am, Johnny Morongo<Moro...@Burf.com> wrote:
>> On 9/30/2011 6:13 AM, John C TX wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Sep 29, 8:00 pm, buRford<buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 29 Sep 2011 10:57:13 -0700 (PDT), John C TX<johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>> X-No-Archive: Yes
>>>>>> Is this a desperate/panic move ? Are things that bad that they have to
>>>>>> resign a guy they cut and no one picked up?
>>
>>>>>> I would imagine he's brought in more for his speed than his pass
>>>>>> rushing ability.
>>
>>>>>> http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/maybin_back_with_jets_to_shore_up...
>>
>>>>> Maybe to light a fire up Westerman or maybe Westerman is that bad.
>>
>>>> I've never understood the love-affair with Westerman. What's he ever done?
>>>> Maybin has the speed,& in the short time he was here, he showed little flashes.
>>>> His problem is his size... he needs to add bulk to really be a LB.
>>>> I always thought he might be interesting at safety ;)
>>
>>> At 240 he is small& I know you are joking but someone has to make up
>>> Coleman's& Lowery's sacks.
>>
>> You know, from the little I saw of him he looked to me to have the speed
>> of a safety.
>
> He did get back there. Does he look better playing with 1st string
> vs 1st string?
I don't know, but couldn't you use him as a cover safety, especially as
neither Smith or Leonard are known for their cover speed?
== 10 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 5:50 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"Johnny Morongo" <Morongo@Burf.com> wrote in message
news:j65gn0$3ia$1@dont-email.me...
> On 9/30/2011 10:57 AM, John C TX wrote:
>> On Sep 30, 11:26 am, Johnny Morongo<Moro...@Burf.com> wrote:
>>> On 9/30/2011 6:13 AM, John C TX wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Sep 29, 8:00 pm, buRford<buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 29 Sep 2011 10:57:13 -0700 (PDT), John C
>>>>> TX<johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> X-No-Archive: Yes
>>>>>>> Is this a desperate/panic move ? Are things that bad that they have
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> resign a guy they cut and no one picked up?
>>>
>>>>>>> I would imagine he's brought in more for his speed than his pass
>>>>>>> rushing ability.
>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/maybin_back_with_jets_to_shore_up...
>>>
>>>>>> Maybe to light a fire up Westerman or maybe Westerman is that bad.
>>>
>>>>> I've never understood the love-affair with Westerman. What's he ever
>>>>> done?
>>>>> Maybin has the speed,& in the short time he was here, he showed
>>>>> little flashes.
>>>>> His problem is his size... he needs to add bulk to really be a LB.
>>>>> I always thought he might be interesting at safety ;)
>>>
>>>> At 240 he is small& I know you are joking but someone has to make up
>>>> Coleman's& Lowery's sacks.
>>>
>>> You know, from the little I saw of him he looked to me to have the speed
>>> of a safety.
>>
>> He did get back there. Does he look better playing with 1st string
>> vs 1st string?
>
> I don't know, but couldn't you use him as a cover safety, especially as
> neither Smith or Leonard are known for their cover speed?
_______________________________________________________________________________________________
I have seen quite a number of times when some kid who was a serious track
star came out for football...couldn't catch real good so they made him a D
back...and found he couldn't find the ball or follow it either...Maybin
should have more football skills that that...but speed will not make him the
cover guy...now, if he was a good basketball player and fast...and he can
hit...we are really into something.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Best Jet LB in team history ???
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/c613db9e923f88e6?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 10:34 am
From: MacUser
On 9/28/11 5:35 PM, oldnasty@mindspring.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, September 28, 2011 10:06:18 AM UTC-4, Michael wrote:
>> On Sep 27, 10:07 pm, oldn...@mindspring.com wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, September 27, 2011 6:46:44 PM UTC-4, Michael wrote:
>>>> Taking a quick break from the current Jets..
>>>
>>>> Who's the best all around LB in Jets history ???
>>>
>>>> 1. Grantham
>>>> 2. Lance Mehl
>>>> 3. Greg Buttle
>>>> 4. Kyle Clifton
>>>> 5. Mo Lewis
>>>> 6. Davis Harris
>>>> 7. Other
>>>
What about Marvin Jones from Florida State? He was pretty good as well
and lasted approx 10 years for the NY Jets.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: K. Ellis ???
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/0c26cb85d644fc32?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 11:43 am
From: Michael
Does anyone know anything about this guy??? At least he has size... I
wonder when if ever we will see him on the field...
== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 3:01 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"Michael" <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:7b75f969-c8f4-4e05-a09d-e05285954cc8@j10g2000vbb.googlegroups.com...
> Does anyone know anything about this guy??? At least he has size... I
> wonder when if ever we will see him on the field...
Wonder if he can play OT.
== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 6:18 pm
From: Michael
On Sep 30, 6:01 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "Michael" <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
> news:7b75f969-c8f4-4e05-a09d-e05285954cc8@j10g2000vbb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Does anyone know anything about this guy??? At least he has size... I
> > wonder when if ever we will see him on the field...
>
> Wonder if he can play OT.
we know the jets can use a hand on both the offensive and defensive
lines... yet high round draft picks ducasse and k. ellis have not been
seen. that is how bad they are. the jets managment has done a
horrible job drafting since mangini left
== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 6:57 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"Michael" <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:b2381eed-8f7b-4b27-ae08-5f42004bdbfe@hd1g2000vbb.googlegroups.com...
On Sep 30, 6:01 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "Michael" <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
> news:7b75f969-c8f4-4e05-a09d-e05285954cc8@j10g2000vbb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Does anyone know anything about this guy??? At least he has size... I
> > wonder when if ever we will see him on the field...
>
> Wonder if he can play OT.
we know the jets can use a hand on both the offensive and defensive
lines... yet high round draft picks ducasse and k. ellis have not been
seen. that is how bad they are. the jets managment has done a
horrible job drafting since mangini left
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So what do you think is up with this...they go for skill position guys
only...no meat and potatoes at all...and no pure toughness...I don't get it.
== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 7:17 pm
From: Johnny Morongo
On 9/30/2011 6:18 PM, Michael wrote:
> On Sep 30, 6:01 pm, "Papa Carl"<papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
>> "Michael"<mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>>
>> news:7b75f969-c8f4-4e05-a09d-e05285954cc8@j10g2000vbb.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>> Does anyone know anything about this guy??? At least he has size... I
>>> wonder when if ever we will see him on the field...
>>
>> Wonder if he can play OT.
>
> we know the jets can use a hand on both the offensive and defensive
> lines... yet high round draft picks ducasse and k. ellis have not been
> seen. that is how bad they are. the jets managment has done a
> horrible job drafting since mangini left
er, Michael, who drafted Gohlston?
== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 7:12 pm
From: Michael
On Sep 30, 9:57 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "Michael" <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
> news:b2381eed-8f7b-4b27-ae08-5f42004bdbfe@hd1g2000vbb.googlegroups.com...
> On Sep 30, 6:01 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> > "Michael" <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
> >news:7b75f969-c8f4-4e05-a09d-e05285954cc8@j10g2000vbb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > Does anyone know anything about this guy??? At least he has size... I
> > > wonder when if ever we will see him on the field...
>
> > Wonder if he can play OT.
>
> we know the jets can use a hand on both the offensive and defensive
> lines... yet high round draft picks ducasse and k. ellis have not been
> seen. that is how bad they are. the jets managment has done a
> horrible job drafting since mangini left
>
>
>
> So what do you think is up with this...they go for skill position guys
> only...no meat and potatoes at all...and no pure toughness...I don't get it.
well... i think they figured the guys they had on defense could do the
job. blt, scott, harris and pace is not a shabby group of lb's. it
is top of the line. pouha, devito and wilkerson should be able to
control the center to a fair degree. they are fully loaded with db's
as well. i dont think it is fair to say that their defensive roster
was bad. it is very clear that the o-line was degraded one piece at a
time since 2009. they should be called out for that one... they blew
it. if ducasse worked out, they would be OK... but he didnt.. IMHO,
the ducasse pick cost them tremendously.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Very Interesting Thing About Jets Team "Personality"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/f38be8c55c4afc89?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 2:25 pm
From: "R�vNsf�n �"
"Michael" <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:fdaf5244-da06-480f-a758-a7d154700d20@u13g2000vbx.googlegroups.com...
On Sep 28, 9:20 pm, "R�vNsf�n �" <noemai...@nospam4me.org> wrote:
> "Michael" <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
> news:68f7cf26-535a-4ba6-8d58-32474d250829@5g2000yqo.googlegroups.com...
> On Sep 28, 10:52 am, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> > "Michael" <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
> >news:409150f8-28cd-42da-b287-4115ab2f7ca9@d17g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
> > Although the Jets are known as "talkers" mostly due to the coach, the
> > type of talk that you hear is idle boasting. There is never any real
> > "content". Just bluster. There are a few other key things about the
> > Jets team "personality". You rarely if ever hear any of the Jet
> > players or the coaches whine or bitch about bad calls, tuff breaks or
> > illegal hits. Also... Even though Ryan talks up the Jets as wanting to
> > be a "physical" team and Bart Scott with his "knock someone the hell
> > out" type commentary the Jets are one of the cleanest teams on the
> > field. You don t see any cheap shots from the Jets, low shots, or
> > "boarder line" head shots on opposing players. For all the boastfull
> > type smack "talk" that the Jets do, they are actually a very classy
> > and professional team on the field. A lot of the flags that got
> > thrown on them in Oakland were BS calls. Especially on Cromartie...
> > They were very disciplined in their first two games as far as
> > infractions. It is a sign of good general coaching. If you really
> > give it some thought, the Jets real personality is quite a bit
> > different from the media fa ade. They aren t a pack of buffoons. Far
> > from it.
>
> > Honestly...I don't think any team in the NFL is a "pack of
> > buffoons"...it
> > just isn't the case and I think most players you meet are nice guys for
> > the
> > most part.
>
> papa... there are a lot of teams that have guys that habitually play
> to the extent of the rules and then past the extent. there is smoke
> from fire and before that there is a the guy that always lights the
> match. there are also teams that dont control players well. consider
> the titans (cheap shot artists), steelers (head shot and low shot
> artits), patriots (ruffing call whiners), cowboys (divas), bengals
> (off the field stuff) and so on...
>
> the jets are really a class team once you get past the "strategic"
> distractions :-) it also appears to me that they take player conduct
> seriously. they will take on a problem case, but if you screw up
> after you made your agreement with the team, you are gone. say what
> you want about money or production, but i think edwards was gotten rid
> of because he continued to act out after he promised managment that
> he'd be a good boy if they took a chance.
>
> --
> One thing the Ravens organization has always done was to crush bad-apples
> spoiling the locker-room barrel. I'm certain that is a philosophy that Rex
> agrees with and also adheres to. Mason's continuous complaints against the
> organization led to him becoming the most recent example to be extricated.
> I'm certain that Rex must have pacified Mace to the extent that Rex felt
> he
> would not be disruptive force within his locker room. If Mason ever does
> it
> will show the lack of respect Mason tends to exude when he doesn't get
> what
> he feels he deserves.
> --
> ~Drew
i did not know that mason was a problem... i always thought he was a
class guy... then again, i dont know the ravens too well...
--
For the most part over the majority of his career in B'more Derrick was a
class guy. Derrick got what he wanted contractually and was content.
Ray Lewis & Ed Reed received potent reworked contracts to lock them up for
the remainder of their careers the year before Derrick's contract was to
expire. Ongoing efforts to renegotiate Mason's own contract through his
agent were not bearing the kind of fruit Mason believed he was due. In the
offseason of that same year Mason's Tennessee neighbor and good friend,
Steve McNair, was murdered. Mason's agent began to release misinformation
which included Mason planning on quitting the NFL to take care of McNair's
family, and then..., that Mason needed to dedicate more time to his own
family as just another reason for his considerations toward retirement.
Finally, ...his agent posted that Mason felt unappreciated by the Ravens and
especially by new HC, John Harbaugh. Harbaugh stated that he had not been
able to even contact Derrick, his messages toward same with Derrick's agent
and at his home had failed to provoke a single response.
This went on for several weeks into Camp the next season before Derrick
personally contacted Harbaugh by showing up to Camp. The Ravens soon
thereafter did manage to negotiate a respectable one year contract that at a
minimum got Derrick into uniform and Camp. That contract did not impress
Mason enough to hide his bitterness toward the organization for failing to
concede a long term contract similar to Lewis and Reed. His discontent often
filled the Ravens locker room mostly directed toward the rookies who were
the only players willing to listen to his constant bitching. Derrick
eventually received a contract adequate enough to retain him up to his being
cut. Ravens management will not comment on what happened beyond the teams
need for youth at the position, however, his closest friends in Ray Lewis
and Ed Reed, would only offer that they would miss him.
Mason was a favorite of mine since his days with the Titans. We went against
him 2-3 times a season when they were still in the AFCN. Mason did bring
everything he had to the Ravens which was greatly appreciated by fans and
management alike. All was well until McNair's murder. Mace was obviously
impacted however, his agent's contract tie in to same toward negotiations
soured many fans when Mason failed to separate himself from his agents
actions. If Mason's issue was the seeming lack of loyalty for what he had
done for the Ravens, and I think that is it, as a Mace fan I would have been
the first to back him. However, this flavor of the NFL is a business and he
like every player has benefited from that shift away the original game.
For what I have to pay for PSL's and anything carrying an NFL logo, my
loyalty remains with the team and the players that played their hearts out
every Sunday to bring a championship home to my city every Sunday during
football season. They were real people that sat down with us to dine and
drink a few beers in local dinners and pubs around town be that after
practice, after a home game win or loss, or during the offseason when they
came home from the job that actually supported them and their families
during the offseason of the game they loved. I really feel for fans that
will never know of such an experience.
--
~Drew
"Talk is cheap ...lets just go play"
Johnny Unitas - Baltimore Colts
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Just thought I'd mention
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/413b78a1842e534d?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 7:12 pm
From: Michael
Do you realize that Suggs will be across from Hunter ??? And, unless
Magold plays, Ngata will be across from an undrafred rookie
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Sep 30 2011 10:10 pm
From: "Papa Carl"
"Michael" <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:6fd1dac2-891d-4be6-b81a-211b9891a64d@z12g2000yqz.googlegroups.com...
> Do you realize that Suggs will be across from Hunter ??? And, unless
> Magold plays, Ngata will be across from an undrafred rookie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
And Mark Sanchez will be across the hall from the nurse manning the ICU
desk.
==============================================================================
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