Tuesday, October 18, 2011

Re: Medarticles request for articles

Buzz It
thanks a lot...

On Wed, Oct 19, 2011 at 9:59 AM, Wiliam Serna Marquez <dr.wiliamsm@gmail.com> wrote:
Solved
article 2


2011/10/18 Parijat Kanetkar <parijatkanetkar@gmail.com>
1st article attached

cheers

pvk


On Tue, Oct 18, 2011 at 9:00 PM, dishabelagu <dishabelagu@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello everyone i need the following articles can anyone help me out...
thank u all

1) Direct Organogenesis from Mature Leaf and Petiole Explants of Eryngium Foetidum L.
S. Arockiasamy, S. Prakash and S. Ignacimuthu
BIOLOGIA PLANTARUM
Volume 45, Number 1, 129-132, DOI: 10.1023/A:1015177330589

2) In vitro regeneration, flower and plant formation from petiolar and nodal explants of culantro ( Eryngium foetidum L.)
Yasseen Mohamed-Yasseen
IN VITRO CELLULAR & DEVELOPMENTAL BIOLOGY - PLANT
Volume 38, Number 5, 423-426, DOI: 10.1079/IVP2002311

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Best wishes and regards,

pvk
---------  ---------  ---------
Parijat Kanetkar

Tel. No.  (Cell)    +91-93222 40599
Email - parijatkanetkar@gmail.com
http://in.linkedin.com/in/parijatkanetkar

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alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets - 25 new messages in 12 topics - digest

Buzz It
alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets?hl=en

alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* watching cowboys-pats? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/646da96dddb121c1?hl=en
* It is wors than I though... - 7 messages, 5 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/2a30a60dd596f7a7?hl=en
* Defending Sanchez - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/f27347cdb5426a17?hl=en
* The alleged Revis PI... - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/c2cbd87784e28136?hl=en
* Ping: Tutor - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/658d5cee678db933?hl=en
* F'ing RavNsfan keeps exposing me and my anon. servers - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/26c9f1208c33a9dd?hl=en
* The Jets offense is a joke... - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/ff52919bae75ad7a?hl=en
* Maybe too obvious to notice? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/97aec8e6e892f2dd?hl=en
* Jets-Fish.. VERY Good news for Fish Fans... - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/748949c926ac7342?hl=en
* Tanny should not be allowed to escape - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/e8b3ae01955cf4a9?hl=en
* Detroit loses, Bills lose. - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/2b928a1001f10fa8?hl=en
* My favorite play of the game - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/883e1351f468638c?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: watching cowboys-pats?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/646da96dddb121c1?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 7:17 pm
From: Tutor


On Oct 18, 8:38 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
> On Oct 18, 3:44 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 18, 12:09 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 18, 12:07 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Oct 18, 8:39 am, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Oct 18, 3:16 am, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Oct 17, 10:43 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 16, 4:57 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > refs at it again.  unbelievable.
>
> > > > > > > You have a lot of nerve citing ref issues after your screwup last
> > > > > > > week.  ;)
>
> > > > > > Mark,
>
> > > > > > Patrs get so many favorable calls its unreal.  Give it up.  Of all the
> > > > > > things Pats fans shouldn't be doiing is saying that the refs don't
> > > > > > give Brady and the rest of the team preferential treatment.  You guys
> > > > > > are ridiculous.  I didn't screw anything up last week.  Call should
> > > > > > not have been overturned.  For most other teams it would not have
> > > > > > been.
>
> > > > > Then you don't understand the game of football.  When a player is
> > > > > touched and his knee is down, it's the end of the play.  There were
> > > > > half a dozen people who explained this to you.
>
> > > > Only if he had control of the ball while his knee is down.  That's
> > > > what the first ref and Sims were talking about.  If he did not, then
> > > > the initial call is correct.  There was not conclusive evidence he had
> > > > that control.  Should not have been overturned.
>
> > > Then what caused the fumble?  Nothing?
>
> > > If that's the case, then how can you reason that it was even a
> > > completion?  If you want to debate whether or not it was a completion,
> > > that makes a little sense.  But to say that was a fumble doesn't.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > A reception can be made, the receiver go down without being touched
> > and then start bobbling the ball before being hit.  Possession is
> > transitory, not fixed.  So if he starts to juggle that ball while
> > being down (before being hit) If the ball comes loose upon being hit,
> > that should be a fumble per the rules.  That is what Simms said
> > happened and also what Carl Banks said the very next day on the radio
> > here in NY.   It is not as cut and dry as many are making it out to
> > be.
>
> So your assertion, then, is that Pace did not cause the fumble.
> You're saying that Branch fumbled the ball before he was ever
> touched.  This is different from what you said initially, if I
> recall.  When it first happened, I thought you said that Branch
> fumbled as he was getting up (i.e. after his knee was down, he got up
> and THEN fumbled).
>
> Whatever.  I don't begrudge anyone for changing their opinion.  The
> bigger issue here is that you were SO certain you were right that you
> started a thread talking about the great NFL conspiracy.  You never
> even considered the possibility that you were wrong.  Now, you seem to
> be acknowledging that you were wrong (about that).- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

No it's the same exact contention, the one that Simms alluded to in
the broadcast. i just worded it poorly. At the time when he was hit
(as he was moving to get up) he was shifting the ball and as a result
did not have the same full control as when he went down. Then he was
hit and the balkl went flying out. His knee was down but without full
possession. That's what Sims and Carl Banks the next day referred to
as transitional possession. That is a fumble and Perreira simply
ignored the issue entirely. I can understand not wanting to open
Pandora's box. Now as for conspiracy... had this been a Jet receiver
down and hit by a Pat with the same initial ruling, I do not think for
a split second the ruling gets overturned. There is nothing you can
say to convince me otherwise.

Feet tangled and incidental contact on a PI call against thePats? No
problem... 2d zebra comes running in to make the first pick up the
flag, and no PI on the Pats. When the same play happens the next week
against the Jets? Where's that 2d zebra? right, nowhere to be
found. Last night's non call on Revis? Had it been Brady-to-Branch
instead of Moore-to-bipolar Marshall, the flag would have been
flying. When in doubt, we know which way it goes. Close call?
forget it... It's been happening for years. Look, until I see the
refs change thier bias, you can call me names and argue there is no
bias until you are blue in the face. Fine. I am convinced there is.
I think it's obvious (and so do others including many non Jets fans)
and that's how I see it. Agree to disagree then becuase we're just
going in circles. Hey there must be something to it. It's got Pratt
the moron's attention now as he is feverishly posting trying to turn
the tables. That alone is worth it. He's such a little hand
puppet. :)


== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:05 pm
From: MZ


On Oct 18, 10:17 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> No it's the same exact contention, the one that Simms alluded to in
> the broadcast.  i just worded it poorly.  At the time when he was hit
> (as he was moving to get up) he was shifting the ball and as a result
> did not have the same full control as when he went down.  Then he was
> hit and the balkl went flying out.  His knee was down but without full
> possession.  That's what Sims and Carl Banks the next day referred to
> as transitional possession.  That is a fumble and Perreira simply
> ignored the issue entirely.

I'm still not sure I know what you're saying. Answer this: do you
believe he fumbled the ball before Pace touched him?


> Feet tangled and incidental contact on a PI call against thePats?  No
> problem... 2d zebra comes running in to make the first pick up the
> flag, and no PI on the Pats.  When the same play happens the next week
> against the Jets?  Where's that 2d zebra?  right, nowhere to be
> found.

I agree with you that feet tangled should not be a PI call. The ref
called it right the first time, and wrong the second. But to say that
this hasn't hit the Pats is ridiculous. As I've mentioned before, it
potentially cost them a trip to the super bowl in '05 when they called
it on Asante Samuel. It was THE main thing in the Denver game that
lost it for them, IMO, completely changing the complexion of the game
(and I think they matched up well that year with Pittsburgh). So
don't tell me about feet being tangled!


> Last night's non call on Revis?  Had it been Brady-to-Branch
> instead of Moore-to-bipolar Marshall, the flag would have been
> flying.  When in doubt, we know which way it goes.  Close call?
> forget it...   It's been happening for years. Look, until I see the
> refs change thier bias, you can call me names and argue there is no
> bias until you are blue in the face.  Fine.  I am convinced there is.
> I think it's obvious (and so do others including many non Jets fans)
> and that's how I see it.  Agree to disagree then becuase we're just
> going in circles.  Hey there must be something to it.  It's got Pratt
> the moron's attention now as he is feverishly posting trying to turn
> the tables.  That alone is worth it.  He's such a little hand
> puppet.  :)

Yes, lots of NFL fans think there's a bias in favor of the Pats,
Colts, and Steelers. But I think you (and others) have causation
backwards. These three teams haven't been the three dominant teams in
the NFL because of bias; the perceived bias is there because they've
been the three dominant teams! Nobody's saying there's bias in favor
of the Bills. Why would they? The Bills don't win anything. They
usually suck, so they usually don't have calls go their way, and even
if they did, nobody would pay attention to it because the Bills are
irrelevant. I guarantee nobody in your NFL forums talks about Jason
Campbell getting all the calls (even though the numbers prove that he
does). Why? Because 1) nobody gives a flying F about Jason Campbell.
and 2) nobody gives a flying F about the Oakland Raiders. That alone
should tell you that the real bias lies in the scrutiny of teams.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: It is wors than I though...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/2a30a60dd596f7a7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 7:36 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 18:26:52 -0700 (PDT), Michael <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote:

>I just watched the Jets-Fish game again... It is even worse than I
>thought as far as the condition of the offense. I dont know if you
>call it a sliver lining or not, but after watching, it is some what
>understandable why Sanchez looks so bad. Yeah, he missed a few guys,
>but for the most part, the Jets dont have a wide receiver. Holmes
>runs a lot of the underneath stuff and so does Keller. They snuk deep
>a few times, but Sanchez is working with limited options and the
>defense knows it. Plax straigt up sucks. They would be better off
>keeping him out of the game and using Kerley, Santonio and McKnight.
>May be use Plax on the goal line. Also... Green could not find his
>way out of a phone booth. Other than popping a few straight ahead, he
>does not know what to do with himself. I wont blame the run blocking
>either. They did a decent job. Green just cant take good advantage of
>what is there.
>
>This is really first rate condition. No running game and no passing
>game. It is purely a manpower issue. I cant even blame Schotty.
>
>I predict they wont sit Plax... The brains behind that pick-up would
>never make such a mistake...
>
>Not having Edwards and Cotch really screwed Sanchez up.


Do the WRs just run wherever they want to, or do you suppose that they're running routes
given to them by their OC?


== 2 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 7:55 pm
From: "Papa Carl"

"Michael" <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:e7e1b049-fec0-4745-b5b4-a53c50b36059@y32g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
>I just watched the Jets-Fish game again... It is even worse than I
> thought as far as the condition of the offense. I dont know if you
> call it a sliver lining or not, but after watching, it is some what
> understandable why Sanchez looks so bad. Yeah, he missed a few guys,
> but for the most part, the Jets dont have a wide receiver. Holmes
> runs a lot of the underneath stuff and so does Keller. They snuk deep
> a few times, but Sanchez is working with limited options and the
> defense knows it. Plax straigt up sucks. They would be better off
> keeping him out of the game and using Kerley, Santonio and McKnight.
> May be use Plax on the goal line. Also... Green could not find his
> way out of a phone booth. Other than popping a few straight ahead, he
> does not know what to do with himself. I wont blame the run blocking
> either. They did a decent job. Green just cant take good advantage of
> what is there.
>
> This is really first rate condition. No running game and no passing
> game. It is purely a manpower issue. I cant even blame Schotty.
>
> I predict they wont sit Plax... The brains behind that pick-up would
> never make such a mistake...
>
> Not having Edwards and Cotch really screwed Sanchez up.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Thank you, that is what I said right when they made those terrible
decisions...and the worst part was not replacing them with equal quality.
They did the same thing when they let Faneca go. This is a very poorly run
operation. I watched it twice...the game. Both of those teams are
terrible. I thought Holmes was the only guy who could go play for a better
team to be honest. And you are right...they are much better off with Kerley
and McKnight playing wide receiver. Go back and look at Plaxico's face when
he is sitting alone...he knows it...he knows he has nothing left. Greene
stinks...he is not a serious RB at a top NFL level and nowhere near what TJ
and Washington were. He has no vision and does not even follow blocks when
he gets them. What the Hell is so wrong that it got this bad this quck?


== 3 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 7:57 pm
From: "Papa Carl"

"buRford" <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
news:ends975s949b6mf7ia69l55cnajvjhh4is@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 18:26:52 -0700 (PDT), Michael <mjd1966@verizon.net>
> wrote:
>
>>I just watched the Jets-Fish game again... It is even worse than I
>>thought as far as the condition of the offense. I dont know if you
>>call it a sliver lining or not, but after watching, it is some what
>>understandable why Sanchez looks so bad. Yeah, he missed a few guys,
>>but for the most part, the Jets dont have a wide receiver. Holmes
>>runs a lot of the underneath stuff and so does Keller. They snuk deep
>>a few times, but Sanchez is working with limited options and the
>>defense knows it. Plax straigt up sucks. They would be better off
>>keeping him out of the game and using Kerley, Santonio and McKnight.
>>May be use Plax on the goal line. Also... Green could not find his
>>way out of a phone booth. Other than popping a few straight ahead, he
>>does not know what to do with himself. I wont blame the run blocking
>>either. They did a decent job. Green just cant take good advantage of
>>what is there.
>>
>>This is really first rate condition. No running game and no passing
>>game. It is purely a manpower issue. I cant even blame Schotty.
>>
>>I predict they wont sit Plax... The brains behind that pick-up would
>>never make such a mistake...
>>
>>Not having Edwards and Cotch really screwed Sanchez up.
>
>
> Do the WRs just run wherever they want to, or do you suppose that they're
> running routes
> given to them by their OC?

Plax can't run...he just can not do it...he is so slow and plodding. Holmes
is the only one who really looks like the real deal. OMHO.


== 4 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 8:37 pm
From: Johnny Morongo


On 10/18/2011 7:55 PM, Papa Carl wrote:

>
> Thank you, that is what I said right when they made those terrible
> decisions...and the worst part was not replacing them with equal quality.
> They did the same thing when they let Faneca go. This is a very poorly run
> operation.

Thanks for noticing, Papa. Yeah, to say that this organization is
poorly run is more than a bit of an understatement. From the top down.
It'll never be really good until that pyramid topples. Next best
thing is to dump the GM and the rest of the FO and replace them with
REAL football people. I'm tired of bean counters running the show.
Maybe I even dump Rex Rex Motor Mouth. Such heresy!

And I'm sick and tired of bringing in defensive coach after defensive
coach...Parcells, Groh, Herm, Mangenius and now Rex; not an offensive
mind in the bunch. And people wonder why we don't ever win the big one.
Look around the league and tell me, other than Belichick (who is in a
class by himself), what "Top 5" team is so heavily defense dominated as
this one. Add to that, the fact that Rex, a defensive head coach,
doesn't know jack shit about offense. He can't even evaluate offensive
players (see Plax & Mason, eg.). He had a chance to see Freeman in
person and passed on him in favor of Sanchez. Duh!

Wake me when it's over. Right now, this whole team is such a waste of time.

== 5 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 8:38 pm
From: "Ray O'Hara"

"buRford" <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
news:ends975s949b6mf7ia69l55cnajvjhh4is@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 18:26:52 -0700 (PDT), Michael <mjd1966@verizon.net>
> wrote:

>>
>>Not having Edwards and Cotch really screwed Sanchez up.
>
>
> Do the WRs just run wherever they want to, or do you suppose that they're
> running routes
> given to them by their OC?

As a Pats fan I was delighted to se Cotchery dumped, he was a Pats killer.


== 6 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:09 pm
From: Señor Patriots


On Oct 18, 10:38 pm, "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> As a Pats fan I was delighted to se Cotchery dumped, he was a Pats killer.

Yeh, sayonara to him. Don't let the door hit you in the ass. Between
him and the Miami Welker we had a couple who torched us in the
division.

I still remember the first time Welker played the Pats. They
introduced him during the game (he was returning kicks) and said,
"He's small but has some dangerous moves" and I thought, "Shurrrrre,
bring the little prick on!" I think before the half was over I was
sweating it every time he touched the ball. By the time the game was
over I thought, "Shit, we have to face that thing twice a year??"

Cotchery made one play that still sticks in the craw. It was a long
gainer, and as I remember it he was supposed to be downed but wasn't
and he popped up and shot off at 100mph while guys were standing
around going, "Huh?" That one stuck in the crotch.


== 7 of 7 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:03 pm
From: Señor Patriots


On Oct 18, 10:37 pm, Johnny Morongo <Moro...@Burf.com> wrote:
> what "Top 5" team is so heavily defense dominated as
> this one.
San Fran and Baltimore? Both of them run the ball well too. Gore
going for a buck fifty against Detroit?? Sheeeeeit, that ain't
amateur hour.

But I see your point. It's an offense dominated league right now.
Even the Packers don't really stone anybody on defense. There are
very few teams left with stonewall defenses. Dallas actually threw a
very confusing defense at Brady Sunday (until the last drive when they
probably abandoned what got them there.)


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Defending Sanchez
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/f27347cdb5426a17?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 7:59 pm
From: "Papa Carl"

"buRford" <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
news:8lbs97d6elebols3ocglmiovrek96eunhq@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 16:22:18 -0400, "Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"buRford" <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>>news:r8jr97hm4n6cmhrkcor6o9tdel6hpk3p7n@4ax.com...
>>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 09:30:58 -0700 (PDT), Tutor <dcat4434@yahoo.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Oct 18, 7:35 am, buRford <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 17 Oct 2011 23:43:47 -0700 (PDT), Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> >On Oct 17, 11:56 pm, "JKConey" <jkco...@verizon.net> wrote:
>>>>> >> Anyone left that still wants to defend this kid? Miami dee? This
>>>>> >> game
>>>>> >> he had
>>>>> >> no excuses. Lots of time to look off, and still so many bad
>>>>> >> choices,
>>>>> >> and
>>>>> >> inaccurate throws. 56% on a night facing no rush, and a really bad
>>>>> >> team is
>>>>> >> just not a good sign. The kid sucks.
>>>>>
>>>>> >> JK Sinrodwww.MyConeyIslandMemories.com
>>>>>
>>>>> >what can you say? The boy is NOT improving. Never scans the field.
>>>>> >Has no feel for other receivers when his primary target is covered.
>>>>> >Seems to get panicky and loses accuracy. Once in a while throws a gem
>>>>> >with speed, accuracy and touch, so he is a great big tease, because
>>>>> >he
>>>>> >does have the arm and touch. Just so damned inconsistent. Someone
>>>>> >has to coach him how to check down, how to look one way then another
>>>>> >and then throw it a third way. And puhleaaase for gd's sake he needs
>>>>> >to stop doing that Ken Obrien pat-the-ball routine. He signals where
>>>>> >and when he is going to throw it by doing that. This boy needs a
>>>>> >better QB coach. I'd like to know WTF Cavanaugh does with him during
>>>>> >the week. Is he not being coached? Or is he just dense? Or both?
>>>>>
>>>>> As I've said ad nauseum, I think it's coaching, the bizarro scheme,
>>>>> and
>>>>> all the presnap
>>>>> nonsense, which too often confuses the other O players too.- Hide
>>>>> quoted
>>>>> text -
>>>>>
>>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>>>
>>>>Isn't Cavanugh supposed to teach him how to survey the field? I'd
>>>>like to know what Cavanaugh does with him all week. The image of
>>>>Cavanaugh lecturing Sanchez on Hard Knocks while Sanchez stared off
>>>>into oblivion, making me think he wasn't listening, just sticks in my
>>>>head.
>>>>
>>>>(Really, any team that agrees to do Hard Knocks is nuts.)
>>>
>>> I've listened to the guy speak enough times... he's not dense.
>>>
>>> Somebody is failing to help him mature as a man.
>>> He just seems like he's still a kid... not a man yet.
>>> One thing that gets to me more than the vision thing, is how rarely
>>> he'll
>>> throw the ball
>>> away, when the play is pretty much dead. Something is missing in the
>>> coaching.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>Well coached high school kids pick that up. Something is missing in
>>Sanchez
>>I think. He looks like the deer in the headlights......we could all be
>>totally wrong, but he does not look like someone with confidence.
>>
>
> I agree about the confidence, but is he put in a position to succeed?
> Especially, after the beating he's taken.

No he is not...but that does not keep him from completing easy shots to open
guys....he very much reminds me of Donovan McNabb who went into a decline
after a few good years...all the passes went into the ground...Sanchez is
off all the time and sometimes they are close enough....Holmes is quick
enough to grab some stuff the others can't I think. Even when he is not
rushed he is off.


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 8:57 pm
From: "RävNsfän ®"


"Tutor" <dcat4434@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bce39074-bda7-49b0-a9ae-5e59d1b4dbb1@s7g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
<snip>
I'd like to know WTF Cavanaugh does with him during
the week. Is he not being coached? Or is he just dense? Or both?

Matt Cavanaugh, ...a.k.a.: Matt Cavanawful, ...is coaching the Jets offense
?
--
~Drew
"Talk is cheap ...lets just play"
Johnny Unitas - Baltimore Colts


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:18 pm
From: Tutor


On Oct 18, 10:57 pm, "RävNsfän ®" <noemai...@nospam4me.org> wrote:
> "Tutor" <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:bce39074-bda7-49b0-a9ae-5e59d1b4dbb1@s7g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
> <snip>
>  I'd like to know WTF Cavanaugh does with him during
> the week.  Is he not being coached?  Or is he just dense? Or both?
>
> Matt Cavanaugh, ...a.k.a.:  Matt Cavanawful, ...is coaching the Jets offense
> ?
> --
>      ~Drew
>               "Talk is cheap ...lets just play"
>             Johnny Unitas - Baltimore Colts

he has been Ass't Coach/Quarterback Coach for the Jets since 2008. I
think he sucks at his job based on Sanchez's lack of development, or
worse, regression. In one of the Hard Knocks episodes they showed him
lecturing Sanchez with Sanchez practically staring off into space.
Color me unimpressed. When Schittenheimer goes, so should Cavanaugh.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The alleged Revis PI...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/c2cbd87784e28136?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 8:40 pm
From: "Ray O'Hara"

"Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
> I thought he looked like he was trying to block him at first....all of
> this would mean nothing if they went back to "ball in the air" rules and
> it would be a better game to watch too.
>

Revis mugged and held Marshall.
and yes they should go back to the ball in the air rule.


== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:04 pm
From: Tutor


On Oct 18, 10:40 pm, "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
> > I thought he looked like he was trying to block him at first....all of
> > this would mean nothing if they went back to "ball in the air" rules and
> > it would be a better game to watch too.
>
> Revis mugged and held Marshall.
> and yes they should go back to the ball in the air rule.

Reminds me of all those years Ty Law blatantly mugged Jets WRs and
never got called. Ahhh the memories.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Ping: Tutor
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/658d5cee678db933?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 8:43 pm
From: "Ray O'Hara"

"Tutor" <dcat4434@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e510f719-3929-4364-8095-e85945c99d96@u10g2000prl.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 17, 8:04 pm, "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> tell me that wasn't a gift, Revis held the guy the whole way and then
> shoved him away befor making the interception.
> talk about Referee making a home team call.

hey, just back from the game. Yup. Now you know what it feels like.
Its an example of what we see every fukin week with the refs during
pats games. There is no team that gets more one-sided favorable
treatment than the Pats, not even the Steelers. It's a friggin
disgrace to the game. So when the Jets finally get one favorable
call, there you and idiot Pratt are to point it out. This
demonstrates beyond any doubt how you know you've been getting the
lion's share of calls for many years now. Otherwise you wouldn't be
reacting this way.

Pats get favorable treatment from NFL officials. Period. You know
it, I know it and so do most fans who see it every week.

====================================================================

no they don't. only you see it.
and the fact the towo calls you bitched about were made by Refs against the
Pats and they took challenges by BB and replay to overturn.
yeah some favoritism.


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:10 pm
From: Tutor


On Oct 18, 10:43 pm, "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Tutor" <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:e510f719-3929-4364-8095-e85945c99d96@u10g2000prl.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 17, 8:04 pm, "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > tell me that wasn't a gift, Revis held the guy the whole way and then
> > shoved him away befor making the interception.
> > talk about Referee making a home team call.
>
> hey, just back from the game.  Yup. Now you know what it feels like.
> Its an example of what we see every fukin week with the refs during
> pats games.  There is no team that gets more one-sided favorable
> treatment than the Pats, not even the Steelers.  It's a friggin
> disgrace to the game.  So when the Jets finally get one favorable
> call, there you and idiot Pratt are to point it out.  This
> demonstrates beyond any doubt how you know you've been getting the
> lion's share of calls for many years now.  Otherwise you wouldn't be
> reacting this way.
>
> Pats get favorable treatment from NFL officials.  Period.  You know
> it, I know it and so do most fans who see it every week.
>
> ====================================================================
>
> no they don't. only you see it.
> and the fact the towo calls you bitched about were made by Refs against the
> Pats and they took challenges by BB and replay to overturn.
> yeah some favoritism.

don't be so touchy. I watched Ty Law hold, put his hands all over,
mug and who knows what else to Jets receivers and never get called for
years. And yes, lots of people see the blatant favoritism the f-ing
refs give the Pats. It happens every damned week. Had the Revis play
been Brady-to-Branch, it would have been flagged. Had it been a Jet
receiver instead of Branch that lost the ball, then the call would not
have been overturned. It's that simple. And for you to allege that
"only I see it". Bwahahahaha. THis issue has been discussed for quite
some time by many. Your team gets preferential treatment and the rest
of us have to deal with it. When it comes to the Pats, the refs become
the 3 blind mice, with prejudice. :)


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:28 pm
From: Harlan Lachman


In article <9g549uF4e5U1@mid.individual.net>,
Percy Flage <percy.flage_REM@OVE_ianwhitephoto.co.uk> wrote:

> On 18/10/2011 08:09, Tutor wrote:
> > On Oct 17, 8:04 pm, "Ray O'Hara"<raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> tell me that wasn't a gift, Revis held the guy the whole way and then
> >> shoved him away befor making the interception.
> >> talk about Referee making a home team call.
> >
> > actually, I was sitting on the other end of the field and now that I
> > got to watch this replay (particularly the second play of it at :20
> > in) http://tinyurl.com/3gw6vf8 Revis is facing the QB watching
> > him. Marshall is steamrolling into him, not unlike a charge in
> > basketball. I can see why there is no flag here. Easy for this to be
> > a no PI/Holding call. It could be called either way. But it's not as
> > bad a non call as claimed by you and the moron troll here. In any
> > evant I am laughing at all of you showing your colors. Now we know
> > you see that Pats gat the calls. Otherwise youwouldn't be licking
> > your chops at the oppportunity. You are too funny. And so
> > predictable.
> >
> > Anyway its kinda sweet to share the patriots/Steelers ref preferential
> > treatment hat, if but for a brief moment. Maybe the refs forgot what
> > teams were playing. Don't worry fellas, the calls will still greatly
> > favor the Pats for quite some time. Have no fear, your 12th man on
> > the field will always be there to help at the best possible times for
> > you.
>
> I thought Marshall was stumbling into Revis, hence the non-call.
>
> Swings and roundabouts - Greene got tackled by the 12th man. ;)

Actually, I thought Gruden was missing the point that the call could
have gone either way. A no call was better than another unfair defensive
pass interference but there was so much contact some interference, IMHO
offensive pass interference, should have been called.

harlan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: F'ing RavNsfan keeps exposing me and my anon. servers
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/26c9f1208c33a9dd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 8:45 pm
From: "RävNsfän ®"


"RävNsfän ®" <crustylombardi@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:j7kl0l$82n$1@speranza.aioe.org...
: don't you worry "dude", ...my smug creative juices runneth over and it
: is unlikely that in your lifetime I will run out of those lovable
Drewisms©
: that you so enjoy cut and pasting into your RavNsfan impersonations. Rest
: assured "dude", ...you will never want for fresh Drewisms© in your "cut
: and paste" archives.

How is that cut and paste archive going these days mini-me wannabe? I know
your grammy's hard drive must be choking to death on all my Drewisms©,
...just like she did when..., oh well forget that, ...the grand-kids
shouldn't know about that.

You R.I.P. granny T-I-T
--
~Drew
"Talk is cheap ...lets just play"
Johnny Unitas - Baltimore Colts

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Jets offense is a joke...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/ff52919bae75ad7a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 8:49 pm
From: "RävNsfän ®"


"Señor Patriots" <roaming13@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:eb279710-f1d8-4a69-9bc0-31d541722582@x20g2000vbl.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 18, 9:00 am, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:

...how a guy could "suck" for six years and then suddenly find himself.

I see you started working on your autobiography again.
--
~Drew
"Talk is cheap ...lets just play"
Johnny Unitas - Baltimore Colts

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Maybe too obvious to notice?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/97aec8e6e892f2dd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 8:52 pm
From: "RävNsfän ®"


"Señor Patriots" <roaming13@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:94bc3f91-8dc1-45fb-9971-593bd788dd2e@f16g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...

You cannot be serious. This is a team sport. There is no such thing
as a QB carrying the team.

Classic "Ricky Bobby speak". The very same lame opinionated BS you belched
out last season in the Indy Colts forum.
--
~Drew
"Talk is cheap ...lets just play"
Johnny Unitas - Baltimore Colts


== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:25 pm
From: Harlan Lachman


In article
<94bc3f91-8dc1-45fb-9971-593bd788dd2e@f16g2000yqk.googlegroups.com>,
Señor Patriots <roaming13@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Oct 17, 7:31 pm, "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > "Señor Patriots" <roamin...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >
> > news:5b1fc4f1-6eac-4374-975e-971da1874945@i19g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
> >
> >
> >
> > > Contrary to popular belief a good QB cannot carry a team on his
> > > shoulders.  The team has to provide support for the QB and then he can
> > > act like he's carrying the team.  But nobody is going to overcome a
> > > bad HC (Singletary, et al) and perhaps a bad OC or bad OL.
> >
> > > Yes, no?
> >
> > Peyton Manning shows a QB can carry a team.
> > the Same Dolts team which has been a treat to win it all now can't win
> > without Manning..
> > he clearly was that whole team.
>
> You cannot be serious. This is a team sport. There is no such thing
> as a QB carrying the team. The QB can rise above the rest with his
> level but he'll always need the team support. They have had an
> outstanding OL and receivers for how many centuries? I'd like to see
> how far he'd have carried them without that OL.
>
> The guy is a QB, not Superman. He's smart but he's not Einsshteen.

Everyone is entitled to have a incorrect opinion. The facts prove the
point that a QB can and has carried a whole team. While Peyton, being he
best Qb in the game, is the best example, there are others of a team
losing a Qb and falling completely apart. We had such a Qb and team a
thousand years ago.

harlan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Jets-Fish.. VERY Good news for Fish Fans...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/748949c926ac7342?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:05 pm
From: "RävNsfän ®"


What you lack in originality, ...you also lack in balls Barbie.
--
~Drew
"Talk is cheap ...lets just play"
Johnny Unitas - Baltimore Colts


"RävNsfän ®" <crustylombardi@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:j7ka8n$231$1@speranza.aioe.org...
: Michael <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote in news:dfa0d318-318c-4592-a811-
: > you sound too much like a jets fan now...
: >
: >
: >
: Jethro... I just can not think of a single moronic troll that would ever
: have even attempted to offer the weak tripe that you have. To save a
: polyp's worth of any possible remaining dignity just sig a blank post to
: represent your future responses.
:
: --
: ~Drew
:
: "Talk is cheap ...lets just go play"
: Johnny Unitas - Baltimore Colts

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Tanny should not be allowed to escape
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/e8b3ae01955cf4a9?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:17 pm
From: Harlan Lachman


In article
<fd6b90f6-af21-4007-acc9-6abb56140cb6@p35g2000prp.googlegroups.com>,
John C TX <johnctxjets@gmail.com> wrote:

> X-No-Archive: Yes
> >
> > > > > Given what the Jets have done in the draft recently along with some of
> > > > > their other roster decisions, I think it is high time to add Tanny on
> > > > > the marquee along with Schotty.  It is obvious that Tanny is nothing
> > > > > more than an accountant.  He is not qualified to evaluate talent or
> > > > > build a quality roster.  He is absoluely in the dark as far as the
> > > > > conecept of "depth"
> >
> > > > > How he as escaped the hot seat up until this point is hard to
> > > > > believe... Him and his pal Schotty need walking papers.
> >
> > > > Welcome to the club, Michael.  Been decrying Tannenbum many years here.
> > > >   But get your wet gear on.  John C is teeing up a load for you right
> > > > about now.
> >
> > > Troublemaker!
> >
> > > :)
> >
> > > I think you have me confused with your man b.  I like some of what he
> > > did but really never jumped up & down about him.
> >
> > > Things I Like:
> >
> > > -Rex
> > > -manage the cap
> >
> > > Ultimately draft picks fall on him & the jury is still out.
> >
> > > 2006 - great draft Ferguson, Mangold & also guys who contributed
> > > Washington (McKnight) , Coleman & Smith
> > > 2007- two stars in Harris & Revis (traded away quite afew [picks
> > > though)
> > > 2008 - bad one  as we got Gholston & Keller & a whole lot of nothing
> > > 2009- Sanchez, Greene, Slasusson, & Westerman  not bad
> > > 2010- Wilson, Ducasse Mcknight,Holmes & rented Edwards for two years
> > > jury is out but holding out hope on Wilson...not bad
> > > 2011-- Kerley & Wilkerson show hope..maybe McElroy
> >
> > > Overall OK & next year we should be picking in every round, well as of
> > > now.
> >
> > > I don't think he pretends to do more than manage the draft. I think he
> > > has Bradway where he belongs as he was OK drafting awful in signing
> > > the wrong FA.  We have done OK there:  Faneca, Pace & Scott were the
> > > big ones & productive for us.
> >
> > > You can argue we needed more depth but we have always need that and
> > > now at least we have pretty good starters.  Think of the corpses
> > > Mangini swore by when they were trying to do a BB/Piloi? Who could
> > > have foreseen a 4th string center playing this year?
> >
> > The big indictment of Tanny are not his drafts which were pretty good
> > for the most part but his apparent inability to grasp key team failings
> > in spite of their repeatedly being in his face.
> >
> > Some of us have seen for years that Shott is horrific. Apparently the
> > myriad number of games our offense does not show up has not caused Tanny
> > to deal with the Jets' number one problem.
>
> Not beating that dead burro but isn't that on Rex?

Yes it is. I don't blame Shott for being horrific. I don't think he is
not trying his best. I blame Tanny and Rex for not dealing with the
problem.
> >
> > Many of us realized that Braylon was a better WR than Santonio and the
> > WR with whom Sanchez had the best rapport. Tanny did not agree and let
> > him go. The problem was not paying for Braylon when we had the money.
> > The problem was Tanny's willingness to gamble that Plax and Mason could
> > possibly be replacements for a young QB. IOW, taking away the WR with
> > whom he had the best connection and adding old and slow guys.
>
> Harlan, I disagree with you on Holmes. He is a big physical WR and
> last year he didn't have the dropsies but his numbers were = Homes &
> he played 4 more games. Holmes has been a more consistent WR than
> Edwards.
>
> Edwards is also an idiot & one idiot move away from being suspended.
> Maybe Holmes was a better team guy & less of an idiot.

Perhaps. But publicly throwing teammates under the bus is a unique way
to show it.
> >
> > Some of us have seen for years that Eric Smith is horrific. Yet, there
> > has been no upgrade at Safety to move him to the bench and just on
> > specials.
>
> Not making excuses but who doesn't have safety issues? The Pats have a
> Jet cut playing a lot. The Ravens picked up Pollard who the Texans
> let go.
>
> I am taking claim to the first guy who said Smith stinks.

Then you be prescient. Again, Smith tries hard. He may even be getting
not worse. But Tanny and Rex are responsible for the fact he is still
here and getting PT as a position player.
> >
> > Along the same lines, with Woody's injury last year, Tanny got fooled
> > into thinking Wayne Hunter was more than a temporary solution and Turner
> > the only needed back-up. I don't mind whiffing on Ducasse. I mind not
> > dealing with our OL and losing two games because of that error.
>
> Schott, Callahan, Rex take some blame on this,
> >
> > We can see why Tanny went after Nnamdi instead of Cro. We got played but
> > did not overpay but the problem is that we went back to Cro.
>
> who would you rather have?
> >
> > Making a mistake in the draft happens. Not seeing and not dealing with
> > weakness has killed this team's chances to win a Lombardi in spite of
> > having some good talent and the best D player in the game.
>
> The OL & DL depth is an issue. I am blaming them all.

I don't blame Callahan. He has done the best with what he gots. The fact
that Hunter has not gotten Sanchez killed so far is a testament to
something.

h

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Detroit loses, Bills lose.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/2b928a1001f10fa8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:19 pm
From: Harlan Lachman


In article <j7g7pt$4f3$1@dont-email.me>,
"Ray O'Hara" <raymond-ohara@hotmail.com> wrote:

> The Fish, they just suck , love it. they could conceivably go o-fer

Actually, as a Fish hater, I hope they eek out a game or two at the end
of the year (preferably not against us) and lose out on Luck.

harlan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: My favorite play of the game
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/883e1351f468638c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 9:38 pm
From: Harlan Lachman


I loved it when Greene broke through the line and the ref was back
there and he bowled right into him and the ref knocked down the defender
getting extra yardage for the Jets.

Even cooler was that the Ref was young, laughed and got on with. it.

I wish our runners and OL ran that hard on every play.

H


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Google Groups: http://groups.google.com/?hl=en

Re: Medarticles request for articles

Buzz It
Solved
article 2

2011/10/18 Parijat Kanetkar <parijatkanetkar@gmail.com>
1st article attached

cheers

pvk


On Tue, Oct 18, 2011 at 9:00 PM, dishabelagu <dishabelagu@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello everyone i need the following articles can anyone help me out...
thank u all

1) Direct Organogenesis from Mature Leaf and Petiole Explants of Eryngium Foetidum L.
S. Arockiasamy, S. Prakash and S. Ignacimuthu
BIOLOGIA PLANTARUM
Volume 45, Number 1, 129-132, DOI: 10.1023/A:1015177330589

2) In vitro regeneration, flower and plant formation from petiolar and nodal explants of culantro ( Eryngium foetidum L.)
Yasseen Mohamed-Yasseen
IN VITRO CELLULAR & DEVELOPMENTAL BIOLOGY - PLANT
Volume 38, Number 5, 423-426, DOI: 10.1079/IVP2002311

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Best wishes and regards,

pvk
---------  ---------  ---------
Parijat Kanetkar

Tel. No.  (Cell)    +91-93222 40599
Email - parijatkanetkar@gmail.com
http://in.linkedin.com/in/parijatkanetkar

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[socialactionfoundationforequity:14389 Reaching out for better care and attention

Buzz It
Reaching out for better care and attention
http://www.goimonitor.com/story/reaching-out-better-care-and-attention

Laws October 2011
Sat, 01/10/2011

MANU MOUDGIL

Millions of people living with HIV/AIDS in India are disappointed with
the latest response of Union Health Ministry to the much delayed HIV/
AIDS Bill. Are we back to square one?


ON JULY 5 this year, the Union Health Minister Ghulam Nabi Azad seemed
to have reinvented the wheel by saying that the government may not be
in a position to foot the treatment bill of those living with HIV. The
provision of free treatment is one of the key features of the draft
HIV/AIDS Bill which has been hanging fire for last five years and this
disownment is not acceptable to the community. It wants the government
to acknowledge that those living with HIV have no other choice but to
take lifelong medications and the costly second and third line
treatments are beyond their reach.

Though the second line treatment is being provided for free, it can be
discontinued any time and the action can't be challenged in the court
of law. This is the reason why the community wants the HIV/AIDS bill
to carry a guarantee for free treatment. It remains to be seen whether
our country, which doles out billions of dollars in grants to African
nations, will offer indefinite succour to its own people.

How it all started

A demand for the HIV/AIDS Bill was first raised in May 2002 during the
'International Policymakers Conference on HIV/AIDS' where the then
Prime Minister A B Vajpayee and Leader of Opposition in the Lok Sabha
Sonia Gandhi underscored the need for an effective response to the
epidemic. Several cases of discrimination against people living with
HIV/AIDS were being reported from across the country. Whether it was
denial of treatment in a hospital, dismissal from jobs, expulsion of
HIV-affected children from schools, absence of informed consent or non-
maintenance of confidentially, the HIV positives or their families
were being denied their fundamental rights on various fronts. The
discrimination continues to this date.

Though India has a National AIDS Prevention and Control Policy, it
does not have the status of law and is not binding on or enforceable
in court. A person claiming that she has lost her job because of her
HIV status cannot ask for a remedy by urging that this goes against
the national policy. On the other hand, presence of a nationally
applicable law would lend consistency, clarity and predictability and
courts would be able to effectively pass judgment in HIV/AIDS cases.
In addition, the law was also needed to fulfil India's international
obligations. In 2001, the United Nations General Assembly adopted the
UN Declaration of Commitment on HIV/AIDS and India as a signatory to
this declaration is committed to general obligations such as the
prohibition of discrimination. So an advisory working group on the
draft legislation was convened and Lawyers Collective HIV/AIDS unit
(LCHAU) was requested to undertake the work.


People living with HIV/AIDS protesting against delay in passage of HIV/
AIDS Bill in New Delhi. Photo by: Hari Singh

Nationwide consultations on the Bill were conducted involving people
living with HIV, high risk groups including injecting drug users, men
having sex with men and commercial sex workers, women and children's
groups, healthcare service providers, trade unions, lawyers and other
civil society organisations. Regional level consultations were
organised in the North, South, East, West and the Northeast of the
country. It was because of this exercise, that a comprehensive bill
was prepared which caters to almost all aspects of HIV/AIDS. If one
compares the draft legislation with present laws in Cambodia, Vietnam
or Sierra Leone, the Indian bill covers all the issues in much more
detail.

However, despite submission of the bill in 2006, it is yet to see the
light of the day. It remained with the law ministry for two and a half
years because the ministry had reservations about important
provisions. It modified the bill to include provisions of mandatory
testing and isolation of those living with HIV/AIDS which was not at
all acceptable to the community. After a lot of protests and advocacy
initiatives, the law ministry was forced to drop these clauses. After
several rounds of arguments and counterarguments, the sixth draft was
found to be acceptable and the ministry cleared it in 2010. But now
the bill is pending with the health ministry which is taking its own
time to clear it.

What does this Bill mean?
The draft bill specifically prohibits discrimination in private and
public sector. No person may be discriminated against in employment,
education, healthcare, travel, insurance etc. just on the basis of his/
her HIV status. The bill also accepts that HIV positive face
discrimination in hospitals because doctors and other healthcare
providers are not provided universal protection against infections.
This is why the bill imposes a duty on the health institutes to ensure
universal precautions and training to their staff. Anybody being
tested, treated or considered for research regarding HIV/AIDS should
be properly informed and should approve of the procedure. The bill
also specifies the exact protocol for and circumstances in which a
healthcare provider can inform the partner of an HIV positive person
of his/her status. There are exceptions to this clause. For instance,
if such a disclosure can lead to violence against women, the
notification is avoided.

The bill also imposes a duty on those living with HIV/AIDS to prevent
transmission by disclosing their status to their partners or by
adopting safer sex practices. The interventions like promotion of
condom usage among commercial sex workers and safe needles among
injecting drug users are protected from criminal or civil prosecution.
This does not mean that commercial sex or drug usage is legal but the
advocacy of these safe methods can't be stopped just because they
promote such behaviour.

Institutional grievance redressal machinery is also envisioned with
health ombuds in each district, independent and accountable HIV/AIDS
authorities and special court procedures which ensure quick trials
without disclosure of identity. The bill specifically recognises
certain rights for women, children and persons in the care and custody
of the state like prisoners who due to social, economic, legal and
other factors find themselves more vulnerable to HIV. It provides for
registration of marriages, provision of maintenance and the right of
residence for HIV positive women.
Special provisions addressed at children and young persons provide for
protection of inheritance and property of HIV affected children.

This law is for you and me
One important misconception is that the HIV/AIDS Bill is only for HIV
positive persons. It should be recognised that only by protecting the
rights of the most vulnerable, can we hope to tackle the epidemic and
thereby protect all of us. By getting protection against
discrimination, confidentiality and access to treatment, people feel
encouraged to come forward for testing with the understanding that
there will be no adverse consequences if they are found to be HIV
positive and if there are, the law will offer protection. By
recognising the rights of women, they are empowered to demand
information and safer sexual practices from their partners.

By protecting needle exchange, condom promotion and sexual health
information programmes, those who are ostracised by the society on the
basis of morality and law can protect themselves and others from HIV.
By recognising the right of all citizens to question their government
the government bodies are made accountable, consultative and
democratic. The epidemic has to emerge from the underground so that
HIV/AIDS is no longer a synonym for fear, neglect, discrimination and
violence but for empowerment, compassion, united action and triumph.

But that can happen only if the government accepts the HIV/AIDS Bill
in its true spirit and recognises the greater good it will bring to
the country. Till then, many more will get the HIV virus, several will
be discriminated against and deprived of the care they so rightly
deserve.

This write up is based on an interaction with Raman Chawla, a senior
advocacy officer at Lawyers Collective HIV/AIDS unit, and information
given in the Lawyers Collective's newsletter

--
Truth resides in every human heart, and one has to search for it there, and to be guided by truth as one sees it. But no one has a right to coerce others to act according to his own view of truth. - Mohandas Gandhi

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alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets - 25 new messages in 10 topics - digest

Buzz It
alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets?hl=en

alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* The Jets D... - 4 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/ecd9d203ec0b3ee6?hl=en
* Jets-Fish.. VERY Good news for Fish Fans... - 3 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/748949c926ac7342?hl=en
* Detroit loses, Bills lose. - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/2b928a1001f10fa8?hl=en
* Dont blame Al Davis... - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/3c353953d011e1a7?hl=en
* A few things - 3 messages, 3 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/c437e44f0b20c6b6?hl=en
* The Jets offense is a joke... - 3 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/ff52919bae75ad7a?hl=en
* Revis mugging non-call/int - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/eeb8011b599bd0f6?hl=en
* Defending Sanchez - 3 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/f27347cdb5426a17?hl=en
* watching cowboys-pats? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/646da96dddb121c1?hl=en
* It is wors than I though... - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/2a30a60dd596f7a7?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Jets D...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/ecd9d203ec0b3ee6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 3:23 pm
From: Michael


On Oct 18, 5:38 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "John C TX" <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:96c25a41-23dd-496d-ad68-034412d4b1c3@31g2000prt.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 18, 1:59 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "buRford" <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:9krq97h7lt9fm9jb9t0ig3j8r77lf4reg6@4ax.com...
>
> > > On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 07:02:35 -0400, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net>
> > > wrote:
>
> > >>"buRford" <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
> > >>news:balp97dairnv8r5qvhbd6eha7iv9csiiin@4ax.com...
> > >>> Fascinating how bad the Jets D has been looking, these past few weeks.
> > >>> I'm beginning to think that they're kinda losing their intensity, not
> > >>> sure
> > >>> why, but with
> > >>> an O that does endless 3 & outs, I suspect it may be getting to them.
>
> > >>> This O is just a total mess. And there seems to be a growing
> > >>> discontent
> > >>> among the
> > >>> players, which may be infecting the D.
> > >>> Amazing how, again, against a poor pass D, most of the passes are
> > >>> short.
> > >>> Ingenius gameplan.
>
> > >>Some of that is compensation for Sanchez throwing the stuff so off
> > >>target
> > >>I
> > >>think....he has really regressed IMHO.
>
> > > Obviously he's regressed, but is it because he's incapable of growing,
> > > or
> > > because he's not
> > > being mentored properly, and is running a dysfunctional offense?
>
> > You know I'm not a fan of Schotts or even so much Rex now...I don't think
> > we
> > have any idea what is really going on but something ain't right and I do
> > not
> > think Rex looks very happy at all. But....even if the offense is not a
> > well
> > designed one...some of those plays were not all that bad...the thing was
> > there...the guys are open and Sanchez can not hit them, he had time, lots
> > of
> > time and he still can not deliver the ball....he can't lead people. Holmes
> > is the only one with hands fast enough to grab his stuff that is somewhat
> > off. Does he look this bad in practice????? If so, they know they have a
> > HUGE problem and they do not have the tools to go back to a ground attack.
> > Greene is NOT the guy, he has no vision and is actually slower than LT in
> > getting to the LOS. I agree...the O is terrible...but so is
> > Sanchez....could it be he is just confused, I guess it could...but even
> > that
> > does not stop him from making a simple throw and catch play. He is way off
> > on some stuff. This is one reason I could not understand getting rid of
> > Cotch and Edwards....the QB was shaky enough without giving him new
> > targets
> > to learn. None of this crap makes any sense if you look at it as a team
> > trying to seriously get better....it looks like a team trying to cut
> > corners
> > and save money or something....they are just not good at all.
>
> Papa, initially, & to some extent still do, I understood not signing
> Edwards. He could get suspended. He was locker room issue. is there
> anyone that likes Eric Smith better than Kerry Rhodes?  Maybe Edwards
> doesn't sign that deal with us the 49ers got but I wish we had him
> instead of Burress.
>
> I never understood letting Cotchery go or his request for a release.
> He is in the last year of a contract & he thinks going to another team
> late in camp will get him more catches?
>
> Sanchez is a worry. I agree with what you wrote.
>
>
>
> So Cotchery wanted out and Edwards went rather quietly because they knew
> something bad was on the near horizon...at least Cotch did.  They aren't
> dumb...maybe they wanted out and were vocal about it or made demands that
> they knew would get them out the door.  I don't think I'd want to be in the
> middle of that offensive mess right now.  We just have no idea.  As for Eric
> Smith?  Rex's whole defense is set up to push receivers into the corners or
> at least give the safety support...the old sky and clouds deal.  For what he
> wants to happen you need to have a LB in the short coverage, or a DB
> replacing a LB....Smith can do that.  What I think they are missing is the D
> lineman or men who can put pressure on the QB without needing a bunch of
> blitzes and schemes....if they had that at least once in a while the rest of
> the deal falls into place and the safety (s) do not get hung out to dry as
> much.  Rex likes Smith because he can jump up into a LB slot and stay alive.
> I'm not sure how Rhodes was at doing that.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

agree... all the jets defense is missing is one singe guy in the front
seven, preferably on the d-line that is a "disruptive", penitrating
player.. and i dont mean disruptive in the locker room. jenkins was
the last one they had. pouha, devito and k. ellis are good guys, but
none of them are the singular talent that the jets defense really
needs... the jets need another jenkins or a guy like suh or ware


== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:42 pm
From: "Papa Carl"

"Michael" <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:e6cdae50-ed77-4bd7-a9e4-b76cf5424ee4@u13g2000vbx.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 18, 5:38 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "John C TX" <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote in
> messagenews:96c25a41-23dd-496d-ad68-034412d4b1c3@31g2000prt.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 18, 1:59 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "buRford" <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:9krq97h7lt9fm9jb9t0ig3j8r77lf4reg6@4ax.com...
>
> > > On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 07:02:35 -0400, "Papa Carl"
> > > <papa.c...@verizon.net>
> > > wrote:
>
> > >>"buRford" <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
> > >>news:balp97dairnv8r5qvhbd6eha7iv9csiiin@4ax.com...
> > >>> Fascinating how bad the Jets D has been looking, these past few
> > >>> weeks.
> > >>> I'm beginning to think that they're kinda losing their intensity,
> > >>> not
> > >>> sure
> > >>> why, but with
> > >>> an O that does endless 3 & outs, I suspect it may be getting to
> > >>> them.
>
> > >>> This O is just a total mess. And there seems to be a growing
> > >>> discontent
> > >>> among the
> > >>> players, which may be infecting the D.
> > >>> Amazing how, again, against a poor pass D, most of the passes are
> > >>> short.
> > >>> Ingenius gameplan.
>
> > >>Some of that is compensation for Sanchez throwing the stuff so off
> > >>target
> > >>I
> > >>think....he has really regressed IMHO.
>
> > > Obviously he's regressed, but is it because he's incapable of growing,
> > > or
> > > because he's not
> > > being mentored properly, and is running a dysfunctional offense?
>
> > You know I'm not a fan of Schotts or even so much Rex now...I don't
> > think
> > we
> > have any idea what is really going on but something ain't right and I do
> > not
> > think Rex looks very happy at all. But....even if the offense is not a
> > well
> > designed one...some of those plays were not all that bad...the thing was
> > there...the guys are open and Sanchez can not hit them, he had time,
> > lots
> > of
> > time and he still can not deliver the ball....he can't lead people.
> > Holmes
> > is the only one with hands fast enough to grab his stuff that is
> > somewhat
> > off. Does he look this bad in practice????? If so, they know they have a
> > HUGE problem and they do not have the tools to go back to a ground
> > attack.
> > Greene is NOT the guy, he has no vision and is actually slower than LT
> > in
> > getting to the LOS. I agree...the O is terrible...but so is
> > Sanchez....could it be he is just confused, I guess it could...but even
> > that
> > does not stop him from making a simple throw and catch play. He is way
> > off
> > on some stuff. This is one reason I could not understand getting rid of
> > Cotch and Edwards....the QB was shaky enough without giving him new
> > targets
> > to learn. None of this crap makes any sense if you look at it as a team
> > trying to seriously get better....it looks like a team trying to cut
> > corners
> > and save money or something....they are just not good at all.
>
> Papa, initially, & to some extent still do, I understood not signing
> Edwards. He could get suspended. He was locker room issue. is there
> anyone that likes Eric Smith better than Kerry Rhodes? Maybe Edwards
> doesn't sign that deal with us the 49ers got but I wish we had him
> instead of Burress.
>
> I never understood letting Cotchery go or his request for a release.
> He is in the last year of a contract & he thinks going to another team
> late in camp will get him more catches?
>
> Sanchez is a worry. I agree with what you wrote.
>
>
>
> So Cotchery wanted out and Edwards went rather quietly because they knew
> something bad was on the near horizon...at least Cotch did. They aren't
> dumb...maybe they wanted out and were vocal about it or made demands that
> they knew would get them out the door. I don't think I'd want to be in the
> middle of that offensive mess right now. We just have no idea. As for Eric
> Smith? Rex's whole defense is set up to push receivers into the corners or
> at least give the safety support...the old sky and clouds deal. For what
> he
> wants to happen you need to have a LB in the short coverage, or a DB
> replacing a LB....Smith can do that. What I think they are missing is the
> D
> lineman or men who can put pressure on the QB without needing a bunch of
> blitzes and schemes....if they had that at least once in a while the rest
> of
> the deal falls into place and the safety (s) do not get hung out to dry as
> much. Rex likes Smith because he can jump up into a LB slot and stay
> alive.
> I'm not sure how Rhodes was at doing that.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

agree... all the jets defense is missing is one singe guy in the front
seven, preferably on the d-line that is a "disruptive", penitrating
player.. and i dont mean disruptive in the locker room. jenkins was
the last one they had. pouha, devito and k. ellis are good guys, but
none of them are the singular talent that the jets defense really
needs... the jets need another jenkins or a guy like suh or ware
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
If they had a Suh and company type line....Katy bar the door !


== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 6:42 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 12:37:39 -0700 (PDT), Michael <mjd1966@verizon.net> wrote:

>On Oct 18, 2:59�pm, buRford <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 10:13:45 -0700 (PDT), Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
>> >On Oct 18, 8:21 am, buRford <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>> >> On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 07:02:35 -0400, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
>>
>> >> >"buRford" <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>> >> >news:balp97dairnv8r5qvhbd6eha7iv9csiiin@4ax.com...
>> >> >> Fascinating how bad the Jets D has been looking, these past few weeks.
>> >> >> I'm beginning to think that they're kinda losing their intensity, not sure
>> >> >> why, but with
>> >> >> an O that does endless 3 & outs, I suspect it may be getting to them.
>>
>> >> >> This O is just a total mess. And there seems to be a growing discontent
>> >> >> among the
>> >> >> players, which may be infecting the D.
>> >> >> Amazing how, again, against a poor pass D, most of the passes are short.
>> >> >> Ingenius gameplan.
>>
>> >> >Some of that is compensation for Sanchez throwing the stuff so off target I
>> >> >think....he has really regressed IMHO.
>>
>> >> Obviously he's regressed, but is it because he's incapable of growing, or because he's not
>> >> being mentored properly, and is running a dysfunctional offense?- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> >> - Show quoted text -
>>
>> >coaching and dysfunctional offense would be my guess. �more
>> >speculation... if the offense is not handed over to moore or a quality
>> >OC, (and made free of any *ground and pound* involvement from rex),
>> >sanchez is probably finished.
>>
>> At 24... ok, almost 25?
>>
>> It's just remarkable to me, how many get so caught up in their emotions, & expectations,
>> especially those that know what he's been dealing with, since drafted.
>> There is such a vast range of territory, between bust & elite.
>> I too, am concered that another year in this system, could scar him, but finished at this
>> point? �Nah ;)- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>yeah... finished at 24... if he continues on this course with the jets
>under schotty, he will regress furhter and wind up being a total
>disaster. in that case, when he finds his next team as a low paid
>back-up, it is possible he can learn somthing on the bench and return
>as a starter a few years down the road... but one thing is for sure...
>if he stays in this offense under schotty, he's done. and it will be
>an ugly ride. you can see it already. his head is gone.

I think he's shaky, but if the OL can continue to improve, some of the shell-shock will
dissipate.
My problem with MS is that he needs some rebel in him.
He just goes along with everything, rather than just standing up already, and admitting
this aint working. In a sense, he's like Rex, both banking their careers on the
precarious foundation named Schott.


== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 6:56 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 14:59:40 -0400, "Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote:

>
>"buRford" <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>news:9krq97h7lt9fm9jb9t0ig3j8r77lf4reg6@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 07:02:35 -0400, "Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"buRford" <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>>>news:balp97dairnv8r5qvhbd6eha7iv9csiiin@4ax.com...
>>>> Fascinating how bad the Jets D has been looking, these past few weeks.
>>>> I'm beginning to think that they're kinda losing their intensity, not
>>>> sure
>>>> why, but with
>>>> an O that does endless 3 & outs, I suspect it may be getting to them.
>>>>
>>>> This O is just a total mess. And there seems to be a growing discontent
>>>> among the
>>>> players, which may be infecting the D.
>>>> Amazing how, again, against a poor pass D, most of the passes are short.
>>>> Ingenius gameplan.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>Some of that is compensation for Sanchez throwing the stuff so off target
>>>I
>>>think....he has really regressed IMHO.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Obviously he's regressed, but is it because he's incapable of growing, or
>> because he's not
>> being mentored properly, and is running a dysfunctional offense?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>
>You know I'm not a fan of Schotts or even so much Rex now...I don't think we
>have any idea what is really going on but something ain't right and I do not
>think Rex looks very happy at all. But....even if the offense is not a well
>designed one...some of those plays were not all that bad...the thing was
>there...the guys are open and Sanchez can not hit them, he had time, lots of
>time and he still can not deliver the ball....he can't lead people. Holmes
>is the only one with hands fast enough to grab his stuff that is somewhat
>off. Does he look this bad in practice????? If so, they know they have a
>HUGE problem and they do not have the tools to go back to a ground attack.
>Greene is NOT the guy, he has no vision and is actually slower than LT in
>getting to the LOS. I agree...the O is terrible...but so is
>Sanchez....could it be he is just confused, I guess it could...but even that
>does not stop him from making a simple throw and catch play. He is way off
>on some stuff. This is one reason I could not understand getting rid of
>Cotch and Edwards....the QB was shaky enough without giving him new targets
>to learn. None of this crap makes any sense if you look at it as a team
>trying to seriously get better....it looks like a team trying to cut corners
>and save money or something....they are just not good at all.
>


Thing is that he's regressed, even from the beginning of the season.
Which means he was capable.
So, what happened?
The depthless OL was hit by a few injuries, & ill-conceived moves by management (Damien
Woody for one).
They traded Braylon & Cotch, for Plax & Mason.
All this weakened the O, to its basics -- the O system, which was never much of a system.

Between being beaten to a pulp, and a lack of coaching smarts, MS has been on his own to
deal with the mess. And being a kid, he's lost his head.

Now that Mason is gone, & Kerley/McKnight are starting to get playing time, together with
the settling down of the OL, let's see how he responds.

One thing that's funny... at the beginning of the season, Keller started out great.
At the time, I suggested, facetiously, that it meant that Keller would disappear, like he
had in other years after early success.
Where has Keller gone?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Jets-Fish.. VERY Good news for Fish Fans...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/748949c926ac7342?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 3:30 pm
From: Michael


On Oct 18, 4:20 pm, John C TX <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Oct 18, 12:16 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 18, 11:50 am, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 18, 12:48 pm, graybeard <graybe...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
> > > > On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 08:40:08 -0700 (PDT), Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > >On Oct 18, 10:15 am, Deadmeat <Deadmeat> wrote:
> > > > >> On 10/18/2011 10:20 AM, Michael wrote:
>
> > > > >> > That was a high quality loss for the Fish
>
> > > > >> > Not kidding....
>
> > > > >> > It looks to me as if the Fish are the front runners in the "Suck For
> > > > >> > Luck Sweepsteaks"
>
> > > > >> > Keep up the good work...
>
> > > > >> > It would be great to have Luck in the AFC East. Since Marino left,
> > > > >> > the Fish have not been the same... Luck may very well be the best QB
> > > > >> > to come out of the draft since Elway.
>
> > > > >> Right, the Dolphins still have plenty of time to screw it up. I
> > > > >> guarantee you, if the Fins need to lose to the jets the final game of
> > > > >> the season to secure him, they will win that game.
>
> > > > >> Even if they did get Luck, he'd turn out to be the next Ryan Leaf.
>
> > > > >not a chance.  I think Luck will be sensational.  I was skeptical
> > > > >about Cam Newton because of the offense he played in, but Newton's raw
> > > > >talent is compensating for his lack of experience and he will be
> > > > >great.  Luck, has the physical skills and the experience.
>
> > > > >Unlike Michael, the last thing I want to see is Luck heading to
> > > > >Miami.  Had enough of you turds with Marino there.  So...  Go FIns!
> > > > >win some damned games!
>
> > > > Why is everyone so convinced that Luck will be available? Unless I
> > > > mis-remember, I believe Luck has one more year of college eligibility.
> > > > He may pull a Peyton and go back to school.
> > > > --
> > > > graybeard- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > that was last year, i think... he did not come out because he wanted
> > > to complete his archetectural- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Luck was eligible for the 2011 draft but elected to stay and is now in
> > his redshirt junior season. Barring injury, he'll be the overall #1
> > next April.
>
> If he gets a bad fit at the #1 he will stay another year.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

i domt think there is a chance he stays in regardless of who picks
first... there has not been a single indication or word of that from
luck


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:04 pm
From: Señor Patriots


On Oct 18, 9:20 am, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
> It would be great to have Luck in the AFC East.  Since Marino left,
> the Fish have not been the same... Luck may very well be the best QB
> to come out of the draft since Elway.

It was a strong move by the Fish!

I can't wait to see what Luck can do at the next level. But look, we
already have Newton. He's a phenom. The league is getting rich on
QBs finally.


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:06 pm
From: Señor Patriots


On Oct 18, 10:40 am, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> Unlike Michael, the last thing I want to see is Luck heading to
> Miami.  Had enough of you turds with Marino there.  So...  Go FIns!
> win some damned games!

Now come on Tutor, don't talk like a loser. The better the
competition in your back yard the better you will build your own
team. The higher level of play raises the entire division. Don't
wish for an NFCW circa 2010. If everybody sucks who cares if you're
the Seahawks?


==============================================================================
TOPIC: Detroit loses, Bills lose.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/2b928a1001f10fa8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 3:44 pm
From: Señor Patriots


On Oct 18, 6:14 am, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "Señor Patriots" <roamin...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:89f0a06c-ab53-4a08-acb8-742ae959af40@s14g2000vbj.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 17, 7:35 pm, "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Their back-up was incapable of turning in even a shadow of the job because
> > the entire scheme was built to Manning.
>
> Keeerist, even in Mexico they know that the Colts are obliged to
> change the schemes to suit the QB.  Either that or the backup is good
> enough to run the Manning offense.  Either way they didn't have the
> personnel.  That's why they called Kerry Collins.  Collins is proof
> that they swapped out the system for something more conventional.  It
> still sucks though - and that's my point about the front office
> fail.   They failed.  There is no excuse for it.  If they had had a
> decent backup they would have salvaged their season.
>
> Fine with me if they blew it because now the Patriots clearly have the
> best W/L record over the past decade.  They were neck and neck with
> the Neck before he went down.
>
> Tell the Jets to change the scheme to fit the QB :-)  What I'm saying about
> Manning is he was THE COACH on the field....he knew more about the scheme
> than any of the coaches...it was his system.

Acknowledged ...


== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:40 pm
From: "Papa Carl"

"Señor Patriots" <roaming13@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f4b29ff7-4644-41c3-abe5-4b1a072cf08a@h5g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 18, 6:14 am, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "Señor Patriots" <roamin...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:89f0a06c-ab53-4a08-acb8-742ae959af40@s14g2000vbj.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 17, 7:35 pm, "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Their back-up was incapable of turning in even a shadow of the job
> > because
> > the entire scheme was built to Manning.
>
> Keeerist, even in Mexico they know that the Colts are obliged to
> change the schemes to suit the QB. Either that or the backup is good
> enough to run the Manning offense. Either way they didn't have the
> personnel. That's why they called Kerry Collins. Collins is proof
> that they swapped out the system for something more conventional. It
> still sucks though - and that's my point about the front office
> fail. They failed. There is no excuse for it. If they had had a
> decent backup they would have salvaged their season.
>
> Fine with me if they blew it because now the Patriots clearly have the
> best W/L record over the past decade. They were neck and neck with
> the Neck before he went down.
>
> Tell the Jets to change the scheme to fit the QB :-) What I'm saying about
> Manning is he was THE COACH on the field....he knew more about the scheme
> than any of the coaches...it was his system.

Acknowledged ...

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I honestly do not think we will ever see this again...he was the architect
of that system...it was HIM....and he got those results with sometimes less
than equal talent. Still....they have fallen so far who knows what this
season would have been.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Dont blame Al Davis...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/3c353953d011e1a7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 3:50 pm
From: Señor Patriots


On Oct 18, 10:35 am, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I am surrised they didn't make a move to acquire
> Mallet.  That would have been a way better long-term move.  But I
> think the Raiders are feeling they can win now and that Palmer gives
> them the best chance over the next few years.  I agree that Palmer has
> looked pretty bad the last couple of years.  Gone is that once great
> arm strength and his accuracy really declined as well.  It's not like
> he didn;t have good receivers.
Yep, the want to win now, and I think they can. I like the move.
It's like going for it late in the game on fourth down instead of
punting.

I know Palmer has declined but I think it's fair to say that he was
being misused or he would not have been so irate at the organization.
With that team and HC I suspect he may find his game again. I hope he
does and then we won't have to endure one more San Diego playoff
collapse.

That will be a tough team to draw in the playoffs.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 5:40 pm
From: MZ


On Oct 18, 11:35 am, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Oct 18, 10:05 am, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> > Raiders trade away two first round picks + for Carson Palmer.
>
> > You cant blame Al Davis for this one.  The lunacy continues in
> > Oakland...
>
> > Palmer was a good part of the Bengals problems... He was off target
> > more often than not.
>
> Wonder if ol' Al would have done this.  It's a 2012 1st and a 2013
> 2nd, which could rise to a 2013 1st based on unspecified performance
> stats.
>
> What a boost to the next couple of Bengal drafts this is.
>
> I'm glad they made this trade.  Given the Raiders history of trading
> with New England, I am surrised they didn't make a move to acquire
> Mallet.  That would have been a way better long-term move.  But I
> think the Raiders are feeling they can win now and that Palmer gives
> them the best chance over the next few years.  I agree that Palmer has
> looked pretty bad the last couple of years.  Gone is that once great
> arm strength and his accuracy really declined as well.  It's not like
> he didn;t have good receivers.

I think the Pats could get more for Hoyer. I think this is their
plan, and this is why they drafted Mallet. It's not often you hear of
a guy that's traded the same year he's drafted.

Anyway, I could see Palmer actually resurrecting his career.
Oakland's probably a tough place to do it.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: A few things
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/c437e44f0b20c6b6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:02 pm
From: Señor Patriots


On Oct 18, 11:51 am, graybeard <graybe...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 07:52:07 -0700 (PDT), Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Oct 18, 10:32 am, John C TX <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> I wouldn't want another guy as ST coach but why can't they figure out
> >> short kicks? BTW I think Oakland has a good ST coach as well.
>
> >> Maybin is quick but he & Westerman better smarten up or that Bush run
> >> will be a regular occurrence.  Someone saw an opportunity in how we
> >> defend.
>
> >> Plaxico is a slug. McKnight & LT in the slot was promising. I never
> >> thought Logan Payne coming back would be that big a deal.  I won't be
> >> shocked if Plaxico is gone before week 16.
>
> >> I didn't focus on Kenrick Ellis but even on a play where he made a
> >> tackle he got pushed back on the line.  Anyone watch him more
> >> carefully?
>
> >I was at the game...  i was excited to see k. ellis come into the
> >game.  i was not excited watching him play.  i had my binoculars
> >trained on him. for a big guy, he has little "push".  i could be
> >wrong, but i dont think he's going to be much more than a guy that
> >takes up space.  a one gapper who eats like a two gapper.  no way is
> >he going to be any sort of a disruptive inside player.
>
> >and i agree 100 % about Plax.  He's a dud. he gets little to no
> >separation and he has no moves.  edwards was better by a good margin.
> >the best he can do is take a db along with him.  the fish did not even
> >use a safety to help.  one db took him out of the game.
>
> One thing I have noticed about Burress is that he seems to play soft
> after the catch. I recall numerous instances where he dove into the
> ground when he saw tacklers getting close.
> --
He's no Welker I guess.

To me it's a great waste of human potential to not keep your body in
top shape the way Jerry Rice did. He proved that you can be
productive well into your thirties even after an ACL problem. It's
about heart and the work ethic. Apparently guys like Moss and Burress
were born with so much talent that they failed to get the message.

An aside: It could be that the conservative play calling is greatly
affected by his underperformance. I mean you have one top receiver
and a good TE, but teams could double those guys and make targets
pretty hard to find.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:54 pm
From: graybeard


On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 16:02:53 -0700 (PDT), Señor Patriots
<roaming13@yahoo.com> wrote:

>To me it's a great waste of human potential to not keep your body in
>top shape the way Jerry Rice did. He proved that you can be
>productive well into your thirties even after an ACL problem. It's
>about heart and the work ethic. Apparently guys like Moss and Burress
>were born with so much talent that they failed to get the message.

This has been happening now for a number of years in all sports, and the
NBA is the prime example. Athletes in just about every sport are bigger,
faster, and stronger than athletes of only a couple of generations ago,
and they feel that their natural ability is all they need, so they don't
put in the time and effort to be better. Some NBA players today are
paragons of athleticism, yet they can't play defense and can't really
shoot all that well except in streaks. Larry Bird, hardly anyone's Mr.
Universe, was an excellent defensive player, and could shoot out the
lights because of a work ethic that kept him in the gym practicing
hundreds of 3 point shots for hours. Too many pro players today would
rather go out to the clubs than put in the practice time. You wonder
what some of these guys could really accomplish if they put their minds
and hearts into it.
--
graybeard


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 7:04 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 19:54:13 -0400, graybeard <graybeard@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 16:02:53 -0700 (PDT), Se�or Patriots
><roaming13@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>To me it's a great waste of human potential to not keep your body in
>>top shape the way Jerry Rice did. He proved that you can be
>>productive well into your thirties even after an ACL problem. It's
>>about heart and the work ethic. Apparently guys like Moss and Burress
>>were born with so much talent that they failed to get the message.
>
>This has been happening now for a number of years in all sports, and the
>NBA is the prime example. Athletes in just about every sport are bigger,
>faster, and stronger than athletes of only a couple of generations ago,
>and they feel that their natural ability is all they need, so they don't
>put in the time and effort to be better. Some NBA players today are
>paragons of athleticism, yet they can't play defense and can't really
>shoot all that well except in streaks. Larry Bird, hardly anyone's Mr.
>Universe, was an excellent defensive player, and could shoot out the
>lights because of a work ethic that kept him in the gym practicing
>hundreds of 3 point shots for hours. Too many pro players today would
>rather go out to the clubs than put in the practice time. You wonder
>what some of these guys could really accomplish if they put their minds
>and hearts into it.

I was thinking about Dave DeBusschere, too.
Not much of an athlete, but worked his butt off to be a great player.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Jets offense is a joke...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/ff52919bae75ad7a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:14 pm
From: Señor Patriots


On Oct 18, 9:00 am, Michael <mjd1...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
> And you know what ??? I don't put the blame on him...
>
> He's been getting his head handed to him and he's playing in an
> offense that does not fit his strengths.
>
It's possible he is getting AlexSmithed.

And I don't mean the 2011 version. I think every football fan should
really look into how a guy could "suck" for six years and then
suddenly find himself. Well, there's a long story there I'm sure but
it's going to be one worth knowing.


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:17 pm
From: Señor Patriots


On Oct 18, 3:19 pm, John C TX <johnctxj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > No way is this team going to beat any above average team with the
> > > > offense they are running. The play calling is horrible, Sanchez is
> > > > not accurate nor does he make the best reads and Plax sucks. All Plax
> > > > is good for is taking a CB out of the play and may be some blocking,
> > > > but no way is he a bona fied target for the qb. As far as the running
> > > > games goes, the line cant block very well, Green is not a complete
> > > > back, and due to the Jets NEVER throwing the ball down field, the run
> > > > game is at a disadvantage.
>
> > > > I dont know if Rex thinks his defense can win games for him with
> > > > scores like 3 to 6, but if he does, he's mistaken. The defense is
> > > > not that good. It is an above average defense, not the 85 Bears.
>
> > > > This team is in serious trouble... The only teams they will beat are
> > > > teams like the Jags and Miami
>
> > > Sanchez does not look beyond his primary target. Almost never. It's
> > > awful. He locks on and stares him down. He NEVER scans the whole
> > > field. I can't tell you how many open receivers he misses during a
> > > game (that TV doesn't show). It's ridiculous. We were screaming
> > > tonight.
>
> > > Green doesn't know how to shift and find another seam/hole. His
> > > vision too is limited.
>
> > > Plax dropping balls. Not sure if it is still jailhouse rust. He is
> > > running good routes it seems.
>
> > Dave, he is a slug.
>
> > His routes are terrible...he quits on them and cuts them off.  If I recall
> > one of the booth guys mentioned that too...he flat out looks like he can not
> > get it done and knows it.
>
> He was jogging.  The laughing on the sideline when he is playing like
> crap is not good and is a cancer.  His money this year is guaranteed.
> If he decides this game is not for him anymore he will roll over.

I'd love to know how hard that guy trained to get back on the field.
I don't sense he was Jerry Rice v. 2.0.

Kinda pisses me off that people take so much for granted and then
never reach their potential. But he is a little long in the tooth, so
maybe he's just done soon. Shit, can you imagine being that young and
talented and only needing to take your interval training seriously?
I'd be on that like a fly on shit (good shit.)


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 7:01 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 10:35:20 -0700 (PDT), John C TX <johnctxjets@gmail.com> wrote:

>>
>> >> > No way is this team going to beat any above average team with the
>> >> > offense they are running. �The play calling is horrible, Sanchez is
>> >> > not accurate nor does he make the best reads and Plax sucks. �All Plax
>> >> > is good for is taking a CB out of the play and may be some blocking,
>> >> > but no way is he a bona fied target for the qb. As far as the running
>> >> > games goes, the line cant block very well, Green is not a complete
>> >> > back, and due to the Jets NEVER throwing the ball down field, the run
>> >> > game is at a disadvantage.
>>
>> >> > I dont know if Rex thinks his defense can win games for him with
>> >> > scores like 3 to 6, but if he does, he's mistaken. � The defense is
>> >> > not that good. � It is an above average defense, not the 85 Bears.
>>
>> >> > This team is in serious trouble... The only teams they will beat are
>> >> > teams like the Jags and Miami
>>
>> >> Sanchez does not look beyond his primary target. �Almost never. �It's
>> >> awful. �He locks on and stares him down. �He NEVER scans the whole
>> >> field. �I can't tell you how many open receivers he misses during a
>> >> game (that TV doesn't show). �It's ridiculous. �We were screaming
>> >> tonight.
>>
>> >> Green doesn't know how to shift and find another seam/hole. �His
>> >> vision too is limited.
>>
>> >> Plax dropping balls. �Not sure if it is still jailhouse rust. �He is
>> >> running good routes it seems.
>>
>> >Dave, he is a slug.
>>
>> What do you have against slugs?
>> Fascinating creatures ;)
>
>Not the animal... it was a gun reference.
>

Ahhh, I stand corrected ;)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Revis mugging non-call/int
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/eeb8011b599bd0f6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:38 pm
From: MuahMan


On Oct 18, 5:31 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "Tutor" <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:ff32b085-dbf2-4bc6-b110-875f1d7b7499@y22g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 18, 3:26 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Tutor" <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:a93859c4-34cc-4b53-b11f-876cdae131f4@v8g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
> > On Oct 18, 12:07 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 18, 12:04 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Oct 18, 8:44 am, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Oct 18, 2:33 am, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > Brady
> > > > > > gets a follicle touched -----> PI!
>
> > > > > Sanchez had twice as many personal foul calls go his way last
> > > > > season,
> > > > > per pass attempt. The Jets get favorable treatment.
>
> > > > your reasoning is faulty here. I think you overlooked the following
> > > > consideration:
>
> > > > You can't measure ref favoritism by comparing the *number* of roughing
> > > > calls on QBs. That's not the correct stat to be measuring because you
> > > > are comparing appl;es to oranges based on the level of QB protection
> > > > the OL provides. You have to compare the ratio of roughing calls to
> > > > QB contact/hits. That's why saying Brady was 32nd is 100%
> > > > meaningless. Brady (and P. Manning) have quick releases and some of
> > > > the best damned pass protection during their years. They don't get
> > > > hit often.
>
> > > Please provide data to back up this assertion. Because I'm pretty
> > > sure you have it backwards. Brady takes a lot of hits. [Probably
> > > because he holds the ball so damned long...]
>
> > > But I agree with your metric.
>
> > > Since Jason Campbell draws nearly 10 times as many PFs as Brady and
> > > Manning, are you arguing that Brady and Manning are hit 10 times less
> > > often than Campbell?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > why do you think that Campbell gets 10x as many penalty flags thrown
> > on his behalf than Brady? That data seems awfully fishy. Not so sure
> > i would be relying on that stat. I wouldn't doubt he gets hit many
> > times more than Manning or Brady. At least we have thankfully moved
> > away from merely counting the number of penalty flags and using that
> > to claim who is getting the calls. That really made no sense at all
> > Mark. And I'll bet people were buying it too. I'm glad you agree that
> > it should be based on a comparison of the ratio of flags to hits and
> > not just on the number of flags thrown.
>
> > Figure out where Vick fits in this. He gets the crap beat out of him and
> > very few penalties. Obviously they are thinking he will run and is a
> > threat, but when he is standing in the pocket it should all be the same.
> > I'd guess Brady does not get the calls now because people are flat out
> > afraid to go near him. The rule is named after him...that has to give him
> > some level of protection. As a QB gets better and means money to the
> > League
> > the flags get thrown I think....even in Sanchez case...he got put into the
> > limelight, even though he did not earn it, and got some protection no
> > doubt.
> > But watching a bunch of games I do not think it is a very standardized
> > call
> > at all.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Again the larger point is which way does the benefit of the doubt
> run?  In the Pats' case, I contend it is weighed heavily towards
> them.  Moving away from the roughing calls for a minute, let's take
> another look at last night's (correct) Revis non PI call (TD play):
> Same exact play, same exact defender, same location, but instead of
> Moore-to-Marshall, it's Brady-to-Branch.  Does a flag for PI or
> defensive holding get thrown against the Jets?  Honestly?
>
>
>
> Oh Hell...the overall situation seems to me to be always take care of a
> couple teams...especially NE and Pitt.  I'm sure there are others, but I
> really only think of them immediately.  Back in the day I always felt the
> calls went to Miami's favor.  I seriously think that officiating does have
> way too much influence in the outcome of way too many games.  They have too
> many damned rules now too, and that makes the "selection" even more of a
> problem in terms of calling it or not.  How much crap can one person
> remember in an instant? They can't, so they go into a situation looking to
> call something...my opinion.

If not for shady refs the Jets would be 2-4 after last night. They
were awarded a 14 point swing. Miami would have been up 10-0.


== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 5:44 pm
From: MZ


On Oct 18, 3:37 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Oct 18, 12:07 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 18, 12:04 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 18, 8:44 am, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > > On Oct 18, 2:33 am, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > Brady
> > > > > gets a follicle touched -----> PI!
>
> > > > Sanchez had twice as many personal foul calls go his way last season,
> > > > per pass attempt.  The Jets get favorable treatment.
>
> > > your reasoning is faulty here.  I think you overlooked the following
> > > consideration:
>
> > > You can't measure ref favoritism by comparing the *number* of roughing
> > > calls on QBs.  That's not the correct stat to be measuring because you
> > > are comparing appl;es to oranges based on the level of QB protection
> > > the OL provides.  You have to compare the ratio of roughing calls to
> > > QB contact/hits.  That's why saying Brady was 32nd is 100%
> > > meaningless.  Brady (and P. Manning) have quick releases and some of
> > > the best damned pass protection during their years.  They don't get
> > > hit often.
>
> > Please provide data to back up this assertion.  Because I'm pretty
> > sure you have it backwards.  Brady takes a lot of hits.  [Probably
> > because he holds the ball so damned long...]
>
> > But I agree with your metric.
>
> > Since Jason Campbell draws nearly 10 times as many PFs as Brady and
> > Manning, are you arguing that Brady and Manning are hit 10 times less
> > often than Campbell?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> why do you think that Campbell gets 10x as many penalty flags thrown
> on his behalf than Brady?  That data seems awfully fishy.  Not so sure
> i would be relying on that stat.

I think it's more likely that there's an error in your perception than
there is an error by Mike Perriera. He has a reputation (whether you
like him or not) to not fabricate data. You were right to challenge
whether or not this is the best metric to use -- and I agree with you
about how to modify it -- but I think you're grasping at straws here
by suggesting that there's something fishy going on. You're really
being hard-headed on this one, tut.


>  I wouldn't doubt he gets hit many
> times more than Manning or Brady.  At least we have thankfully moved
> away from merely counting the number of penalty flags and using that
> to claim who is getting the calls.  That really made no sense at all
> Mark. And I'll bet people were buying it too. I'm glad you agree that
> it should be based on a comparison of the ratio of flags to hits and
> not just on the number of flags thrown.

Ok. So are you saying that Campbell gets hit 10x as often to account
for the discrepancy?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Defending Sanchez
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/f27347cdb5426a17?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 4:45 pm
From: "Papa Carl"

"Ritchie" <ritchie1965@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:b1fab6eb-367b-4904-b73a-c4cfd91d1660@n18g2000vbv.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 18, 4:22 pm, "Papa Carl" <papa.c...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "buRford" <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>
> news:r8jr97hm4n6cmhrkcor6o9tdel6hpk3p7n@4ax.com...
>
>
>
> > On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 09:30:58 -0700 (PDT), Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> >>On Oct 18, 7:35 am, buRford <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
> >>> On Mon, 17 Oct 2011 23:43:47 -0700 (PDT), Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>> >On Oct 17, 11:56 pm, "JKConey" <jkco...@verizon.net> wrote:
> >>> >> Anyone left that still wants to defend this kid? Miami dee? This
> >>> >> game
> >>> >> he had
> >>> >> no excuses. Lots of time to look off, and still so many bad
> >>> >> choices,
> >>> >> and
> >>> >> inaccurate throws. 56% on a night facing no rush, and a really bad
> >>> >> team is
> >>> >> just not a good sign. The kid sucks.
>
> >>> >> JK Sinrodwww.MyConeyIslandMemories.com
>
> >>> >what can you say? The boy is NOT improving. Never scans the field.
> >>> >Has no feel for other receivers when his primary target is covered.
> >>> >Seems to get panicky and loses accuracy. Once in a while throws a gem
> >>> >with speed, accuracy and touch, so he is a great big tease, because
> >>> >he
> >>> >does have the arm and touch. Just so damned inconsistent. Someone
> >>> >has to coach him how to check down, how to look one way then another
> >>> >and then throw it a third way. And puhleaaase for gd's sake he needs
> >>> >to stop doing that Ken Obrien pat-the-ball routine. He signals where
> >>> >and when he is going to throw it by doing that. This boy needs a
> >>> >better QB coach. I'd like to know WTF Cavanaugh does with him during
> >>> >the week. Is he not being coached? Or is he just dense? Or both?
>
> >>> As I've said ad nauseum, I think it's coaching, the bizarro scheme,
> >>> and
> >>> all the presnap
> >>> nonsense, which too often confuses the other O players too.- Hide
> >>> quoted
> >>> text -
>
> >>> - Show quoted text -
>
> >>Isn't Cavanugh supposed to teach him how to survey the field? I'd
> >>like to know what Cavanaugh does with him all week. The image of
> >>Cavanaugh lecturing Sanchez on Hard Knocks while Sanchez stared off
> >>into oblivion, making me think he wasn't listening, just sticks in my
> >>head.
>
> >>(Really, any team that agrees to do Hard Knocks is nuts.)
>
> > I've listened to the guy speak enough times... he's not dense.
>
> > Somebody is failing to help him mature as a man.
> > He just seems like he's still a kid... not a man yet.
> > One thing that gets to me more than the vision thing, is how rarely
> > he'll
> > throw the ball
> > away, when the play is pretty much dead. Something is missing in the
> > coaching.
>
> Well coached high school kids pick that up. Something is missing in
> Sanchez
> I think. He looks like the deer in the headlights......we could all be
> totally wrong, but he does not look like someone with confidence.

I agree Papa. My brother and I were watching the game and Sanchez
looked jittery and unsettled. His feet were all over the place while
he was standing in one spot, which means he is nervous and having
trouble locating his targets. I don't like the direction he is going
in and the fact that the Jets really have no choice in their
commitment to him.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I saw a local high school kid the other night who had all those things
going....knew when to get rid of the ball and where to throw it. Read his
receivers well....and could even step up into his blocking and avoid getting
hit. I'm thinking to get this far Sanchez had to do some of that at some
point....what happened? The speed of the game?


== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 6:58 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 16:22:18 -0400, "Papa Carl" <papa.carl@verizon.net> wrote:

>
>"buRford" <buRford@buR.ford.com> wrote in message
>news:r8jr97hm4n6cmhrkcor6o9tdel6hpk3p7n@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 09:30:58 -0700 (PDT), Tutor <dcat4434@yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>On Oct 18, 7:35 am, buRford <buRf...@buR.ford.com> wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 17 Oct 2011 23:43:47 -0700 (PDT), Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> >On Oct 17, 11:56 pm, "JKConey" <jkco...@verizon.net> wrote:
>>>> >> Anyone left that still wants to defend this kid? Miami dee? This game
>>>> >> he had
>>>> >> no excuses. Lots of time to look off, and still so many bad choices,
>>>> >> and
>>>> >> inaccurate throws. 56% on a night facing no rush, and a really bad
>>>> >> team is
>>>> >> just not a good sign. The kid sucks.
>>>>
>>>> >> JK Sinrodwww.MyConeyIslandMemories.com
>>>>
>>>> >what can you say? The boy is NOT improving. Never scans the field.
>>>> >Has no feel for other receivers when his primary target is covered.
>>>> >Seems to get panicky and loses accuracy. Once in a while throws a gem
>>>> >with speed, accuracy and touch, so he is a great big tease, because he
>>>> >does have the arm and touch. Just so damned inconsistent. Someone
>>>> >has to coach him how to check down, how to look one way then another
>>>> >and then throw it a third way. And puhleaaase for gd's sake he needs
>>>> >to stop doing that Ken Obrien pat-the-ball routine. He signals where
>>>> >and when he is going to throw it by doing that. This boy needs a
>>>> >better QB coach. I'd like to know WTF Cavanaugh does with him during
>>>> >the week. Is he not being coached? Or is he just dense? Or both?
>>>>
>>>> As I've said ad nauseum, I think it's coaching, the bizarro scheme, and
>>>> all the presnap
>>>> nonsense, which too often confuses the other O players too.- Hide quoted
>>>> text -
>>>>
>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>>
>>>Isn't Cavanugh supposed to teach him how to survey the field? I'd
>>>like to know what Cavanaugh does with him all week. The image of
>>>Cavanaugh lecturing Sanchez on Hard Knocks while Sanchez stared off
>>>into oblivion, making me think he wasn't listening, just sticks in my
>>>head.
>>>
>>>(Really, any team that agrees to do Hard Knocks is nuts.)
>>
>> I've listened to the guy speak enough times... he's not dense.
>>
>> Somebody is failing to help him mature as a man.
>> He just seems like he's still a kid... not a man yet.
>> One thing that gets to me more than the vision thing, is how rarely he'll
>> throw the ball
>> away, when the play is pretty much dead. Something is missing in the
>> coaching.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>Well coached high school kids pick that up. Something is missing in Sanchez
>I think. He looks like the deer in the headlights......we could all be
>totally wrong, but he does not look like someone with confidence.
>

I agree about the confidence, but is he put in a position to succeed?
Especially, after the beating he's taken.


== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 6:59 pm
From: buRford


On Tue, 18 Oct 2011 12:22:57 -0700 (PDT), John C TX <johnctxjets@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Oct 18, 11:23�am, Johnny Morongo <Moro...@Burf.com> wrote:
>> On 10/18/2011 5:53 AM, John C (tx) wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > X-No-Archive: Yes
>>
>> >> Anyone left that still wants to defend this kid? Miami dee? This game he had
>> >> no excuses. Lots of time to look off, and still so many bad choices, and
>> >> inaccurate throws. 56% on a night facing no rush, and a really bad team is
>> >> just not a good sign. The kid sucks.
>>
>> >> JK Sinrodwww.MyConeyIslandMemories.com
>>
>> > I don't think he sucks because when the game is on the line he wants
>> > the ball and he has come through. �We can't get rid of him& �whether
>> > it is like buRf& �others �feel it is the OC, or as I feel the Ryan/
>> > Schott offense is dysfunctional, they aren't getting it done.
>>
>> > My theory is he is pleaser (remmeber he did not fight for the last $&
>> > got to camp early) and seems to be a hard worker. �You can see the
>> > stress he is carrying for his team& �the pressure the offense is
>> > under. In hindsight, for me a day, letting Edwards go �--& �Cotchery
>> > although I hated that move-- was a mistake. �The lack of continuity at
>> > WR is hurting them& �Papa was 100% right about Burress he is a slug.
>>
>> > The positive is that the line played better. �We have a bye so Mangold
>> > can get healthier although I was disappointed when I heard how much
>> > mandatory time off they have to give these guys. �Ducasse& �others
>> > like Westerman& �Maybin �need the work.
>>
>> About Mangold: did I see Slauson or someone else at center during the
>> letter stages of the game, and with Ducasse in there on the line? �Also,
>> and here I may be crazy, but I could have sworn that I saw Brick at
>> RIGHT tackle for the first play of the game.
>
>Ryan said they benched Mangold once the game was in hand. I assume it
>was Baxter. I think Ducasse lined up as an extra tackle (TE) the role
>Hunter used to fill last year.

He was in on the OL, too.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: watching cowboys-pats?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/646da96dddb121c1?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 5:38 pm
From: MZ


On Oct 18, 3:44 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Oct 18, 12:09 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 18, 12:07 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 18, 8:39 am, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > > On Oct 18, 3:16 am, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Oct 17, 10:43 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Oct 16, 4:57 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > refs at it again.  unbelievable.
>
> > > > > > You have a lot of nerve citing ref issues after your screwup last
> > > > > > week.  ;)
>
> > > > > Mark,
>
> > > > > Patrs get so many favorable calls its unreal.  Give it up.  Of all the
> > > > > things Pats fans shouldn't be doiing is saying that the refs don't
> > > > > give Brady and the rest of the team preferential treatment.  You guys
> > > > > are ridiculous.  I didn't screw anything up last week.  Call should
> > > > > not have been overturned.  For most other teams it would not have
> > > > > been.
>
> > > > Then you don't understand the game of football.  When a player is
> > > > touched and his knee is down, it's the end of the play.  There were
> > > > half a dozen people who explained this to you.
>
> > > Only if he had control of the ball while his knee is down.  That's
> > > what the first ref and Sims were talking about.  If he did not, then
> > > the initial call is correct.  There was not conclusive evidence he had
> > > that control.  Should not have been overturned.
>
> > Then what caused the fumble?  Nothing?
>
> > If that's the case, then how can you reason that it was even a
> > completion?  If you want to debate whether or not it was a completion,
> > that makes a little sense.  But to say that was a fumble doesn't.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> A reception can be made, the receiver go down without being touched
> and then start bobbling the ball before being hit.  Possession is
> transitory, not fixed.  So if he starts to juggle that ball while
> being down (before being hit) If the ball comes loose upon being hit,
> that should be a fumble per the rules.  That is what Simms said
> happened and also what Carl Banks said the very next day on the radio
> here in NY.   It is not as cut and dry as many are making it out to
> be.

So your assertion, then, is that Pace did not cause the fumble.
You're saying that Branch fumbled the ball before he was ever
touched. This is different from what you said initially, if I
recall. When it first happened, I thought you said that Branch
fumbled as he was getting up (i.e. after his knee was down, he got up
and THEN fumbled).

Whatever. I don't begrudge anyone for changing their opinion. The
bigger issue here is that you were SO certain you were right that you
started a thread talking about the great NFL conspiracy. You never
even considered the possibility that you were wrong. Now, you seem to
be acknowledging that you were wrong (about that).


== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 7:17 pm
From: Tutor


On Oct 18, 8:38 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
> On Oct 18, 3:44 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 18, 12:09 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 18, 12:07 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Oct 18, 8:39 am, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Oct 18, 3:16 am, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Oct 17, 10:43 pm, MZ <for...@mdz.no-ip.org> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 16, 4:57 pm, Tutor <dcat4...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > refs at it again.  unbelievable.
>
> > > > > > > You have a lot of nerve citing ref issues after your screwup last
> > > > > > > week.  ;)
>
> > > > > > Mark,
>
> > > > > > Patrs get so many favorable calls its unreal.  Give it up.  Of all the
> > > > > > things Pats fans shouldn't be doiing is saying that the refs don't
> > > > > > give Brady and the rest of the team preferential treatment.  You guys
> > > > > > are ridiculous.  I didn't screw anything up last week.  Call should
> > > > > > not have been overturned.  For most other teams it would not have
> > > > > > been.
>
> > > > > Then you don't understand the game of football.  When a player is
> > > > > touched and his knee is down, it's the end of the play.  There were
> > > > > half a dozen people who explained this to you.
>
> > > > Only if he had control of the ball while his knee is down.  That's
> > > > what the first ref and Sims were talking about.  If he did not, then
> > > > the initial call is correct.  There was not conclusive evidence he had
> > > > that control.  Should not have been overturned.
>
> > > Then what caused the fumble?  Nothing?
>
> > > If that's the case, then how can you reason that it was even a
> > > completion?  If you want to debate whether or not it was a completion,
> > > that makes a little sense.  But to say that was a fumble doesn't.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > A reception can be made, the receiver go down without being touched
> > and then start bobbling the ball before being hit.  Possession is
> > transitory, not fixed.  So if he starts to juggle that ball while
> > being down (before being hit) If the ball comes loose upon being hit,
> > that should be a fumble per the rules.  That is what Simms said
> > happened and also what Carl Banks said the very next day on the radio
> > here in NY.   It is not as cut and dry as many are making it out to
> > be.
>
> So your assertion, then, is that Pace did not cause the fumble.
> You're saying that Branch fumbled the ball before he was ever
> touched.  This is different from what you said initially, if I
> recall.  When it first happened, I thought you said that Branch
> fumbled as he was getting up (i.e. after his knee was down, he got up
> and THEN fumbled).
>
> Whatever.  I don't begrudge anyone for changing their opinion.  The
> bigger issue here is that you were SO certain you were right that you
> started a thread talking about the great NFL conspiracy.  You never
> even considered the possibility that you were wrong.  Now, you seem to
> be acknowledging that you were wrong (about that).- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

No it's the same exact contention, the one that Simms alluded to in
the broadcast. i just worded it poorly. At the time when he was hit
(as he was moving to get up) he was shifting the ball and as a result
did not have the same full control as when he went down. Then he was
hit and the balkl went flying out. His knee was down but without full
possession. That's what Sims and Carl Banks the next day referred to
as transitional possession. That is a fumble and Perreira simply
ignored the issue entirely. I can understand not wanting to open
Pandora's box. Now as for conspiracy... had this been a Jet receiver
down and hit by a Pat with the same initial ruling, I do not think for
a split second the ruling gets overturned. There is nothing you can
say to convince me otherwise.

Feet tangled and incidental contact on a PI call against thePats? No
problem... 2d zebra comes running in to make the first pick up the
flag, and no PI on the Pats. When the same play happens the next week
against the Jets? Where's that 2d zebra? right, nowhere to be
found. Last night's non call on Revis? Had it been Brady-to-Branch
instead of Moore-to-bipolar Marshall, the flag would have been
flying. When in doubt, we know which way it goes. Close call?
forget it... It's been happening for years. Look, until I see the
refs change thier bias, you can call me names and argue there is no
bias until you are blue in the face. Fine. I am convinced there is.
I think it's obvious (and so do others including many non Jets fans)
and that's how I see it. Agree to disagree then becuase we're just
going in circles. Hey there must be something to it. It's got Pratt
the moron's attention now as he is feverishly posting trying to turn
the tables. That alone is worth it. He's such a little hand
puppet. :)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: It is wors than I though...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.football.pro.ny-jets/t/2a30a60dd596f7a7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Oct 18 2011 6:26 pm
From: Michael


I just watched the Jets-Fish game again... It is even worse than I
thought as far as the condition of the offense. I dont know if you
call it a sliver lining or not, but after watching, it is some what
understandable why Sanchez looks so bad. Yeah, he missed a few guys,
but for the most part, the Jets dont have a wide receiver. Holmes
runs a lot of the underneath stuff and so does Keller. They snuk deep
a few times, but Sanchez is working with limited options and the
defense knows it. Plax straigt up sucks. They would be better off
keeping him out of the game and using Kerley, Santonio and McKnight.
May be use Plax on the goal line. Also... Green could not find his
way out of a phone booth. Other than popping a few straight ahead, he
does not know what to do with himself. I wont blame the run blocking
either. They did a decent job. Green just cant take good advantage of
what is there.

This is really first rate condition. No running game and no passing
game. It is purely a manpower issue. I cant even blame Schotty.

I predict they wont sit Plax... The brains behind that pick-up would
never make such a mistake...

Not having Edwards and Cotch really screwed Sanchez up.


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